ok my first moan on here but having had a bad year at work and seeing alot of peeps getting paid silly amounts im venting some wind.
The word Engineering was once as good as 'doctors', accountancy and other top name work classes. Do you regret becoming an engineer or
taking on such a role knowing now that its no longer seen to be a top end job?
I confess i dont cloass my self as an engineer (alltho my spelling sometimes matches one lol). I didnt get a Beng or Meng or any other degree. However
i take on roles at work that such qualifications demand such a DFMEA's and risk assesments. These are jobs that no one i talk to understand let
alone know the responsibilities attached to them.
Im fed up trying to solve problems that every other profession would just sweep under the carpet. Are you?
My friend gets paid £280 a day! and his job is easier than mine by a mile.
What im getting at, after seeing jobs which involve very little future thought being moved up the 'respect' level like the tanker job in the
news at the moment meaning they can demand loads of money and dont have to think about much.
Has engineering lost its meaning?
Is there still a break between and engineer and technician anymore?
ARGH!!!!
im so peeved that i take pride in my work knowing i have future proofed it, checked out every possibility of failure and set up systems to stop it
happening which means saving money everyone involved and then just get accused of being the one stopping things from being developed. I see sales
people lye, doctors just 'try this' and knowing they get paod loads more.
Does it get to you lot?
Rant over cheers
I know what you mean. Lots of people have assumed that after I told them I did mechanical engineering at uni, that I was just someone learning to
tinker around with cars (which I obbiously do anyway ) etc.
One person once actualy asked me 'but what does an engineer actually do?' Hmmm, that kind of annoyed me if that is the general
perception, or lack of, of the profession.
The situation should be far closer or on a par with Germany, the respect they have for engineers is (I have heard) almost unparalleled.
James
I'm an engineer. It says so on my Job description so I must be one. My occupation is an engineer when I'm getting insurance quotes and I can
hold my own in a room full of professors. I get paid an engineers wage. I'm an engineer.
However, I'm not an engineer and I don't profess to be one. I served my time as a mech fitter, got promoted up to leading hand and then
Industrial Technician. Then after a lot of hard graft (over several years), sat a promotions board and got the 'Engineers' post. Along the
way I also got a HNC in Eng.
Since then, my company got taken over, lost contacts, won contracts and through it all, I'm still sat in the same control room pressing the same
buttons but now, I have unskilled folks working alongside me with absolutely no formal qualifications. They are also employed as
'Engineers'!
So no. The word engineer is worth jack-sh1t.
[Edited on 17/6/08 by owelly]
quote:
im so peeved that i take pride in my work knowing i have future proofed it, checked out every possibility of failure and set up systems to stop it happening which means saving money everyone involved and then just get accused of being the one stopping things from being developed. I see sales people lye, doctors just 'try this' and knowing they get paod loads more.
The word engineer is protected in some countries (Canada for example) in the same way as (medical) Doctor or Solicitor is here.
Unfortunately as it isn't protected here it's been devalued to nothing. The worst example I've heard is a toilet cleaner being called
a 'Sanitation Engineers'.
No point complaining about it though, it's far too late for that.
quote:
I explained that while a mechanic could sort a car then an engineer could make every component on a car (given the correct tooling) assemble it and sort it as well.
quote:
Originally posted by iankThe worst example I've heard is a toilet cleaner being called a 'Sanitation Engineers'.
I graduated from a british uni with a mech eng degree and went on to get quite a very responsible and difficult job under the job description
engineer.
I agree that to the general public engineer means absolutely jack sh1t. a friend of mine once asked what i wanted to do when i left school, I told
him I wanted to be an electrical engineer (at the time, I'm a mechy now). He replied by saying "I'll know who to call when my washing
machine breaks".
The worst thing was he wasn't trying to insult me, he was serious. BTW he is a solicitor now.
I now work in the US as a project manager on large storage tank terminal contruction and when I tell people I am an engineer they are often surprised
and very impressed. They value these type of skills a lot more over here and it makes me feel all the hard work was worth it. they pay a lot better
here too.
[Edited on 18/6/08 by liam.mccaffrey]
I was doing Civil engineering at Poly but decided to switch to computers as there was little respect for Civil Engineers in this country so you
ideally had to go abroad to be appreciated. My bro stuck it out for a few years but became stressed from long site hours and pressure from above
constantly so he switched careers eventually. My brother in law however works for a Japanese company and is often abroad but gets very well treated
and has a very good salary.
I became a "PC Engineer" but my job has fek all to do with designing PC/Software systems but is fairly stress free and well paid. I could
earn quite a bit more if I contracted but again I like my easy life
If you think engineers don’t get the respect they deserve try being a bus driver - in charge of the safety of as many folk as a medium sized airliner
in a much more dangerous environment, working flat out for 8hrs a day doing crazy shifts and then getting treated like third grade moron who just
deserves only to get spat on (last guy who tried that with me got a fist in the face). Many folk in offices and the like forget just how hard some
work for their messily pennies.
oh course currently I'm sitting in a office getting paid 3 times as much surfing the net but things are quiet lately, yip I do miss the busses
[Edited on 18/6/08 by Mr Whippy]
It's highly rated in Germany too - 'Herr Engineer' is as common as 'Herr Doctor', and so on. (Obviously spelt differently! )
Definately de-valued.
I studied Mech Eng and uni and then got a job doing really technical hard stuff. The Engineers were seen as somwhere below the sales guys in the
pecking order.
I've had lots of requests to mend garage doors and washing machines.
Anyway, I moved industries and now work as a Project Manager in in Construction. I work alongside other people with barely any useful qualifications
and we all seem to get much more respect and probably money than the Engineers we manage.
Being a Engineer in Germany was a diffrent matter, I just didnlt want to go and live over there.
I have to agree with the sentiments of the above.
A few years ago, I think it was the IMechE, did a poll of the general public on who they thought was an Engineer. I believe that the most popular
choice was "Kevin Webster" the spanner monkey from Coronation street.
Simon
As many realise on here, I'm a properly qualified engineer.
My wife works in the NHS, and some of the stories about the 'consultants' would make a good book. I was talking to one, and when I told him
what I did, he laughed. He makes a mistake, he kills one person. An engineer makes a mistake, he can kill hundreds!
I pointed out that the doctor wouldn't be able to do his job, without the engineers who designed all of his theatre equipment, diagnostic
equipment and electronics, and his car and washing machine,which quietened him down somewhat. He had no reply.
My second son graduated with his 2/2 Civil Engineering degree last year. Couldn't get a job as a tea boy here. Best offer was £18k, and he had to
move to the midlands. He now is working in Queensland, has just been moved into the position of Shire Engineer in the north, gets the equivalent of
over £35K/year, a new Toyota 4x4(twin turbo V6 diesel), and a spanking new house to live in. He's also in charge of an area bigger then the UK!
At the age of 23! (And he's paying way less tax than here.)
So yes, it is time the UK valued its engineers properly, before they all end up overseas, where their education is properly valued.
Cheers,
Syd.
I don't know if I call myself an engineer to a real engineer - but I suppose I am one
I did Mech eng hons at Uni (got a third), then went to a small local company (steel fabricator in a small specialised industry) as a CAD technician,
basically I did the drafting work for the engineer who designed the structures
and slowly I started doing more of the work until I could nearly do it all myself - then after 9 months the other engineer quit (suddenly) and I had
to learn the rest fast
4 years on I've learnt enough about structural steelwork to do my job (but I can't help feeling like I'm missing allot of background
info) and I've trained up 3 other people (none of which has stayed - all but 1 went abroad)
I still don't like calling myself an engineer, but I sometimes use "Structural Design Engineer" as a job description, just to avoid the
assumption that I fix washing machines
my biggest complaint is the fact that most managers seem to think they don't really need engineers, or if they do its just a necessary evil
and this is in an industry where nearly everything is a 1 off design to suit the site (they have tried standard designs - the either don't work
or cost a fortune)
but still all I get is "do you really need to design it - its the same as at the last site, the only is its a bit higher, wider, longer and the
thing on the top is a bit bigger and heavier, and the legs can't go there anymore - but it will be the same won't it"
I think part of the problem is that there are so many types of engineer, and that confuses allot of people - I nicked this from the imeche site:
quote:
[our] Members work in research, design, development, manufacturing, installation, commissioning, contracting, consulting and teaching, in fields as diverse as lubrication, satellite launching, surgical implants and in power stations
quote:
Originally posted by liam.mccaffrey
I graduated from a british uni with a mech eng degree.....................I now work in the US as a project manager on large storage tank terminal contruction and when I tell people I am an engineer they are often surprised and very impressed. They value these type of skills a lot more over here and it makes me feel all the hard work was worth it. they pay a lot better here too.....
quote:
Originally posted by mcerd1
......my biggest complaint is the fact that most managers seem to think they don't really need engineers, or if they do its just a necessary evil
and this is in an industry where nearly everything is a 1 off design to suit the site (they have tried standard designs - the either don't work or cost a fortune)
but still all I get is "do you really need to design it - its the same as at the last site, the only is its a bit higher, wider, longer and the thing on the top is a bit bigger and heavier, and the legs can't go there anymore - but it will be the same won't it" ....
Pah! You Engineers spend all day clicking buttons in some software that does all the hard work for you. Type some numbers into Excel, copy and paste a few graphs into PowerPoint and your day's work is done. My mum could do that.
Nice to know i am not the only one then. My Title is ‘Product Designer’ which I am fine with, others in the office are Engineers (again i am fine with
this) as they have a degree or two. But I do the same work as them or even more as I am the longest serving member here and they are always asking me
questions so they can do their tasks. The gaffa will only pay the right amount for the job title meaning I am paid less for the same work.
I agree every level of qualification is needed. There’s no point having one type without the other as nothing would get done, all I am saying is how
many times do you see a problem and then someone trying to solve it by hit and miss or just ignoring it and replacing it? I see it everywhere and it
does directly effect me. I don’t even bother with the doctors anymore, the last time I went with a knee problem he asked me when does it hurt, I said
when I kneel down and he told me to kneel down less or not at all! Is that it? To me he didn’t even want to try and help, thought I was there for a
sick note and waved me on. Yet he gets a £40K+ job and is regarded as a god by the public.
Its nice to know that in some other countries engineering is still regarded as a professional’s job and not just a nice title. But I think it isn’t
salvageable here anymore.
I wander if I attended a health course I could call myself a doctor?
What a load of pants.
Hi I am a engineer and proud of it.
I conpleted an indenured apprenticeship and also completed a HND in Mechanical Engineering.
My company values enginners , many of us are now registered as Incorporated Enginneers with the Engineering Council.
However you need a Masteres degree to become chartered, engineering is the only field with this requirement.
I belive that to be a Chartered Accountant you dont need to have a Masters, and that surely aint right.
Once again Incorporated Engineer and proud of it
quote:
Originally posted by johhny5
However you need a Masteres degree to become chartered, engineering is the only field with this requirement.
Anyone can call themselves a doctor.... no rules against that at all (look at 'Dr' Gillian McKeith, who is neither a medical doctor or a
researcher with a PhD) - a registered medical practitioner is the legal definition.. and don't worry - our managers think that they don't
need us either... I couldn't do an engineers job (in fact I couldn't do pretty much any job except mine) and wouldn't presume so - so
please don't presume you can do ours
I think the lack of respect for engineering / lawyering / teaching / policing / doctoring etc etc is down to a generalised wish that everyone was the
same, there was no such thing as excellence, and everything is pretty easy.... my job isn't, and most people I know don't have easy jobs
either.... had some TIG done the other day, and the guy was a genius - much respect there....
Chris
Declaration of interest - Registered medical practitioner 4526322 and PhD student
[Edited on 18/6/08 by chrsgrain]
I've cut myself a few times, can I be a surgeon please . I design and make stuff all the time but it never gets out of the shed usually and I wouldn't claim to be an inventor or an engineer.
quote:
quote:Originally posted by mcerd1
......my biggest complaint is the fact that most managers seem to think they don't really need engineers, or if they do its just a necessary evil
and this is in an industry where nearly everything is a 1 off design to suit the site (they have tried standard designs - the either don't work or cost a fortune)
but still all I get is "do you really need to design it - its the same as at the last site, the only is its a bit higher, wider, longer and the thing on the top is a bit bigger and heavier, and the legs can't go there anymore - but it will be the same won't it" ....
This could easily be a scenario from my field too...all the thing they say it "only" needs are what engineering is about....
My mate is an Architect Technician and he hates structural engineers almost as much as QS He's trying to get retirement as he is fed up of the BS he now has to put up with from these two groups.
The penny dropped in my second year Mechanical BEng.
Got out of uni and became one of those lying Techinical Sales Engineers, pissed my boss off so much he quit Slipped into his job, they stuck a
'Contracts Manager' label on the tin.
Am I happy, am I shite.
My job looks easy (I like to think it's because I'm the bollox) but it's like a poo sandwich, the more bread you want the more shit
you've got to take.
Ah well, time for an early finish
The same can be said for many job titles though... especially the title of Manager... *opens up a can o' worms*
quote:
Originally posted by Davey D
The same can be said for many job titles though... especially the title of Manager... *opens up a can o' worms*