Right!

Think I have convinced myself that as the materials for my manifold came to £200, I can spend around £400 on a tig welder and still come out cheaper than a manifold from leading manufacturers.........so........after me offering lots of advice on here its my turn to request some!

Whats the best features per quid spent DC only TIG machine, used or new. Would rather go for a used properly built machine than a new inverter that is scrap if it goes pop!

(I'm guessing £400 used machines are going to be tricky to find with AC-DC operation, and most work will be steel anyway so hey ho!)


What do you reckon?

(I'm really looking for a s/h one with foot control etc etc included)

Get HF start and make sure you have enough amps. Inverters are OK these days, there are a few companies out there who do OK new kit cheap, GYS spring to mind, the Sealy range can be bought cheap with other names on the side, they are also OK but pay minimum for them and spend the extra on the extras! Remember you will need gas regulator / bottles, and foot pedal.

The older TIGs and many of the AC/DC ones need 3 phase so this may or may not be ok for you.

TIG is a great process but does take practice to get good, easier if you gas weld than if you are used to MIG or sticki

good luck

Caber

go on, get AC/DC you know you want too and it means i start giving you more beer tokens / beer for odd jobs

think how much you'll save if you can weld ali?

heck, you could even do your own fuel tank, header tank, all sorts in future........

(i know, i'm a person without a father!)

can't justify a grand Mike, much as I'd like to as I see a rather nice transformer based AC-DC machine on ebay now for £985!! (and it's british built)

but its not a grand, its 600 quid more than you want to spend. thats all.

so you still haven't got the bike engines for next years grasser - which means you have the money. Get the welder then earn the money back doing jobs for other people.

Then that way you get the welder you want and can still get the engines. Plus if i get the megasquirt stuff sorted on my car i'll be able to help you run the grassers via that saving you money on the ecu - which means you'll actually end up with more money in your pocket and happier with more toys!!!!!!!!

Sales .......... no, i'm in IT, just feels like sales some days.

I,d look for a copper wound Millers or Lincoln off Ebay.

Most American commercial welders run 1, 2 or 3 phase (although will be sold as 3 phase aa thats what they will have been connected as), you just need to strap em right and run a heavy lead from your consumer unit. 60 amps @240v for 200 amp welding @83v

Do not look for features like slope in/slope out and all that cleverness, you just need remote on/off, foot pedal (These are not the same as invertor pedals as they have big reostats inside) and post gas delay.

If its goes wrong (which is extremly doubtful) beyond the coils its all solid state, big transistors, capacitors etc that you can replace, no tricky ECU's here.

Regards Mark

Cheers Mark, that's sort of confirmed my suspicions, can I u2u you if I see a likely candidate on t'internet just to run it by you?

I know Mike!!! But selfish as it sounds I never have enough time on my own car now!! Spent 2 hours tonight on the phone to a mate diagnosing a 205gti that wouldn't start, but it drove to work this morning. Not a bad diagnosis by phone! Managed to tie it down to ECU failure or intermittent connection between coil -ve and ecu/tach relay....toook a bit over the phone to work out that the fuel pump was there on cranking, we had sparks, we even had power to the +ve side of the injectors, but the ECU wasn't earthing them. not bad for the chap on the other end of the phone with some pliers, a screwdriver and a length of wire and a sidelight bulb from the car!!!!

Rattling on but that's how I end up not getting my car done!!!

Anyhoo, would love to get the ACDC machine but just struggle to see how I could get the £600 worth of work in to pay for it......................................................................

read your email - i have a solution!



(and no its not selling your body - that wouldn't make 600 quid in 10 years!)

IMHO a foot pedal is not needed on a DC machine.

Ally is another can of worms. When you start an ally weld the metals cold.
As you progress it warms up, and come the finish it's as hot as hell. A foot pedal's great.

Steel and stainless however doesn't conduct heat as much, so setting the heat on the machine is no problem.

Just my 2p

Anyway, you don't need it yet. Wait till I can afford my new Lincoln, and then buy my Sure Weld.

Paul G

how much for the sureweld? (what model etc etc)

know what you mean (I think!) on the foot pedal, just from migging ally I know its rapid conductivity and high heat capacity make it a swine!

Thought it might be nice on thin stainless coming up to outside corners and the like just to make life a bit easier.

My cans were .7 thick.

35 amps, no prob.

I'm contemplating knocking up a batch.
It would pay for the Lincoln.

Paul G

p.s. Start on an edge and work in.

[Edited on 18/4/06 by 907]

http://www.westermans.co.uk/Ltec250tig.htm
These lads take machines and overhaul them.
Ive not used them but they may be of some help to the cause.

Cheers!!!!!!!!!

once again locostbuilders comes up trumps!!!

Thanks!!!

They are all of 4 miles up the road from where I work, and have some transformer/thyristor based 220v ac-dc machines in stock.

price is not cheap but considerably less than an equivalent new inverter based machine...................

getting serious now!!

BUY BUY BUY BUY

you know i want you too !!!!

still going to be a grand by the time I have got set up with gas etc etc etc and will really need to put a proper connection unit in the garage for this jobbie, can't really stick a 200amp tig on a 13 amp plug........,but then my 220 amp mig is!!!

well it should be running through that cable i gave you so the feed should be ok (you are using that 40 / 45 / 50 amp (i can't remember) cable aren't you?)

Still on the previous cable (was it 6mm or 8mm that you gave me??) mine was normal cooker stuff, yours was bigger than that!!!

Must get that swapped over, but yep, on 45 amp cable at the mo anyway.

std 13 amp plugs are not the done thing though, as you can only get 13 amp max fuses for them.

On full power I use an alternative "fuse" but I don't think that's the done thing either as I can't see a 6mm bolt "blowing" very easily!! The circuit is all protected by an appropriate MCB and RCD anyway having said that.

ooh you bad. i got flamed a while back for mentioning the word 'nail' in that context

my 160amp mig runs fine off the 13 amp plug and extension lead though the cord gets a bit hot with the fan heating going at the same time.

oh and i had to switch the socket the extension lead was running off after the switch on the double socket stopped working - think something might have got a bit warm inside and melted it - the other half of the same socket has been holding up so far so good

the way I see it, though dodgy, is actually pretty safe (ducks for cover!!!)

The cable that goes direct from the consumer unit MCB (with RCD protection) is sized correctly for the MCB that protects it, and it runs to a junction box in the garage, again correctly sized for the MCB protecting it, then to the pair of sockets, all still 45 amp cable. The only weak point is the sockets. After these the welder cable itself is obviously up to the job, so 1 set of brass contacts is the only part of the system that has its rating exceeded, and I am very disinclined to use 16 amp blue plugs, 1 cos nothing else I have uses them, 2 cos then I can't use the welder on low current at somebody elses house and 3 cos the welder will draw over 16 amps anyway so I will exceed the blue plug rating anyway!!!

I had a 140 amp oil cooled arc welder given me and I was a bit dubious about the cable on it so I fitted a new one. I found when I took the plug off that the fuse was a bolt and when I put the 13 amp fuse in it lasted about 5 minutes so I soldered a piece of 30 amp fuse wire across the fuse. It's on a 40 amp circuit so it should still blow first (that's my theory anyway) and it works now.

Why don't people (i know i'm going to get shot down for this....)

get two fuses or fuse wire and make a fuse that can handle the rating?

The cable was for a top of the range what ever kw (12?) shower even though mine was only 10kw. The sparky who did it commissioned water stations and the like for a living and liked to "make sure" everything was going to be fine.

Sure it was more a case of "thats all they had in when he went to visit the wholesaler" ...........

I have an AC stick welder that can be wired for 3 phase.

On single phase it sometimes blows a 13 amp fuse, but only when I haven't got a spare with me.

I bought one of those cards of fuse wire and made some up using blown 13 amp fuses with a
strand of the 15 amp wire soldered to the outside.

I made half a dozen, but I've only needed the one.

Paul G

HMM Fuse wire is rated to carry double the load for 30 minutes cartridge fuses are "quick blow" and will fail instantly on double the rated load. 13A plug fuses are supposed to protect the cable and the appliance against a dead short on what can be 5 amp rated cable. Theoretically a highr rated fuse in a plugtop is OK up to a point. Another possibility is to use two neutral pins in the plug top and forget about the fuse.

A long time ago we used to do this for stage follow spots that drew about 20 amps on starting but ran at about 8 amps, you could never get a cartridge fuse to survive the start up. This dodge is also used to make convertors from 13A to CEEForm 32A sockets again for connecting stage lighting dimmers to ring mains . . . .

This is a remarkably effective way of testing for dodgy building wiring . . . . . . .

Caber

quote:

---

Originally posted by mangogrooveworkshop
http://www.westermans.co.uk/Ltec250tig.htm

---

I gave them a call and the millers are 415v only (single phase but 415v)

but they have a pair of Murex Transtig 200 ACDC machines and an ESAB machine, all useable on 240v single phase and all reasonably priced.

will go over to see them after work one afternoon next week.

a minor comment on the fuses thing, someone had the idea of using a plug with the live pin swapped for a neutral pin, hence no need to stick a bolt in. Only do this on a device with a 2.5mm 3 core flex, then set up a radial circuit in the garage off a 20A mcb, and the system is completely safe, as you are still fused at 20amps throughout. You can use the socket for anything as normal plugs will sitll be fused appropriately for the appliance.

Roight!

Tig machine aquired!!!

Just got to drive to Plymouth to collect it but I will shortly be the owner of an ESAB DTA 200 AC/DC Squarewave TIG machine.

Anybody used one before?

Got to swap the transformer tappings over to suit 240v and sort the power supply out and get some argon/tungstens/wires etc sorted out and should be able to start to play/learn.

Will probably be asking lots more questions when I have picked the machine up. Think it has a water cooled torch and full cooler system on it so may have to have a head scratch over that one, as I think it's been running on 415v single phase, not sure if the motor is internally supplied with power or externally supplied. shouldn't be a big deal either way I guess.

Then just got to remember not to use it at full output, as the manual says it draws 59A on 240v supply at 200amp output

There is a song we sing at Wigan when watching the footy, rather apt now.....


You are my sunshine,
my only sunshine,
you make me happy,
when skys are gray,


we'll stop there not only cause i can't sing but i'm not calling Nat "dear" nor am i declaring love to him!

steady Mike!!

Got to work out how to use the bugger yet, going to raid Clive's stainless scrap bin for some DC practice, and I have loadsa bits of ally for AC practice!

Still need an Argon reg/flowmeter, anybody got a spare kicking about before I buy one?

ahem ..........

its not spare as i use it as my normal regulator but its designed to be used for argon



works no problem, just bought a converter from nuneaton welding supplies as the threads are different.