speedview
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| posted on 14/1/12 at 10:59 PM |
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Driving to/from IVA on trade plates?
Can you drive to/from the IVA test on trade plates?
I'll have this to test in the not too distant future:
17 1/2 feet long and weighs the better part of 2 tonnes, so it'll mean hiring a seriously big trailer and a truck/4x4 thing to tow it with.
Might be cheaper to pay a trader to get the train to our house in the morning, drive to the IVA test, then he heads back to work whilst IVA test is
completed and pops back to drive it to the DVLA or back to our place. Added advantage is that the brakes bed in/engine warms up fully. (175k on the
original Nikasil engine may be marginal on emissions)
Is this legal? Its an "unregistered car" right, same as any other new one/imported one? Can you pay people to move cars on trade plates?
Can you ride with them? (to listen for clonks/clanks/bits about to drop off)
Thanks!
(Ideally I'd want somebody with a lockup so that if it fails on trivia we could work on it in Swansea and its a short hop back to IVA, rather
than trucking all the way back to Pembrokeshire again)
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big_l
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| posted on 14/1/12 at 11:04 PM |
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ring dvla local office but i was allowed to drive my car to iva with no tradeplates at all just needed insurance on chassis number!!
drove to dvla inspection aswell 
Check out my blog mnrvortxhayabusa@blogspot.com
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ReMan
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| posted on 14/1/12 at 11:08 PM |
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Dont ring DVLA ( unless its for sport)
You dont need any plates to drive to IVA any more than you need an MOT to drive to an MOT
www.plusnine.co.uk
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Chippy
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| posted on 14/1/12 at 11:09 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by big_l
ring dvla local office but i was allowed to drive my car to iva with no tradeplates at all just needed insurance on chassis number!!
drove to dvla inspection aswell
+1
To make a car go faster, just add lightness. Colin Chapman - OR - fit a bigger engine. Chippy
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speedview
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| posted on 14/1/12 at 11:14 PM |
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Cheers guys!
So if I can find an insurer that'll cover (26 y/o male & original car is 4.0 V8 / group 20) on the VIN, I can drive to a pre-booked
IVA and registration with no MOT, tax, or plates?
Is there a relevant piece of paper that would show the "this ought to be illegal" know-all policeman that's bound to stop me knowing
my luck/the look of the vehicle?
(I've been told all sorts of nonsense by DVLA when ringing them and its no defence in court)
Can I also drive from the IVA back home (nominated repair location) should it fail the IVA?
Thanks,
--
Marko
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adithorp
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| posted on 14/1/12 at 11:21 PM |
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You have to have insurance (covered using the VIN instead of the reg' but you don't need trade plates. You can drive to and from an IVA
with just insurance and the documents for the test to prove thats where you're going should you get stopped.
edit to add...
Don't ask DVLA. Iva is run by VOSA and it's the same regulation that allows you to drive to an MOT without a valid MOT. You can drive to
and from a legally required inspection and to/from a place of repair to correct faults found during the test. Only in extream cercumstances will the
VOSA inspector issue a prohibition notice if the car is deemed to be too dangerous to be allowed to leave under it's own steam (pretty rare).
[Edited on 14/1/12 by adithorp]
"A witty saying proves nothing" Voltaire
http://jpsc.org.uk/forum/
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loggyboy
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| posted on 14/1/12 at 11:42 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by adithorp
You have to have insurance (covered using the VIN instead of the reg' but you don't need trade plates. You can drive to and from an IVA
with just insurance and the documents for the test to prove thats where you're going should you get stopped.
edit to add...
Don't ask DVLA. Iva is run by VOSA and it's the same regulation that allows you to drive to an MOT without a valid MOT. You can drive to
and from a legally required inspection and to/from a place of repair to correct faults found during the test. Only in extream cercumstances will the
VOSA inspector issue a prohibition notice if the car is deemed to be too dangerous to be allowed to leave under it's own steam (pretty rare).
[Edited on 14/1/12 by adithorp]
Pretty sure that happened to the Haynes Roadster maybe?
Im sure I read he was glad he trailered it as the inspector wouldnt let him drive it home due to a brake issue? or maybe it was a different car, but
same story...... i forget!
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Snuggs
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| posted on 15/1/12 at 06:59 AM |
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Can I just ask why this needs an IVA ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.topcashback.co.uk/ref/snuggstcb
Spider pig, spider pig, does whatever a spider pig does.
I doubt therefore I may be.
Luposlipophobia : Fear of being chased by wolves around a freshly waxed kitchen floor, while wearing only socks on your feet.
My mind not only wanders, sometimes it leaves completely!
http://www.venganza.org
http://www.jesusandmo.net/
http://www.snuggs.co.uk
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ReMan
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| posted on 15/1/12 at 08:04 AM |
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+1
Tell us a bit more about the car?
www.plusnine.co.uk
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stevegough
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| posted on 15/1/12 at 09:35 AM |
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Interesting car!
When we kit-car types say "you are legally allowed to drive to a pre-arranged IVA test" we are talking about kit-cars / one - offs that we
have built ourselves.
This vehicle, although very definitely a 'one-off' is obviously not a kit car, but a vehicle that has been converted from a
standard model - that is one that is already covered under 'type approval' which Jaguar sorted many moons ago. The only reason to have to
do a full IVA on it would be if you have altered the chassis from the original.
Reiterating what Snuggs has asked - why does it need an IVA test?
I think you may need a VIC check (same as you do with imported and Cat C / D write offs) to register it - however - to further fuel the debate - as
you have cut the roof off, and the car's chassis is a monocoque - maybe you have altered the chassis........ (or was it built as a convertible
originally?)......
On another point, as the insurance groups now go from 1 to 50, I think you will find it is a group 36 (ish) and not a 20.
Good luck!
Luego Locost C20XE.
Build start: October 6th 2008.
IVA passed Jan 28th 2011.
First drive Feb 10th 2011.
First show: Stoneleigh 1st/2nd May 2011.
'Used up' first engine may 3rd 2011!
Back on the road with 2nd engine may 24th
First PASA mad drive 26/7/11
Sold to Mike in Methyr Tydvil 19/03/14
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iank
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| posted on 15/1/12 at 09:36 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by loggyboy
quote:
Originally posted by adithorp
You have to have insurance (covered using the VIN instead of the reg' but you don't need trade plates. You can drive to and from an IVA
with just insurance and the documents for the test to prove thats where you're going should you get stopped.
edit to add...
Don't ask DVLA. Iva is run by VOSA and it's the same regulation that allows you to drive to an MOT without a valid MOT. You can drive to
and from a legally required inspection and to/from a place of repair to correct faults found during the test. Only in extream cercumstances will the
VOSA inspector issue a prohibition notice if the car is deemed to be too dangerous to be allowed to leave under it's own steam (pretty rare).
[Edited on 14/1/12 by adithorp]
Pretty sure that happened to the Haynes Roadster maybe?
Im sure I read he was glad he trailered it as the inspector wouldnt let him drive it home due to a brake issue? or maybe it was a different car, but
same story...... i forget!
It will happen to any car that's got more than a tiny weep of brake fluid or the inspector thinks they've been built incorrectly, if the
brakes could fail on the way home it's a cause for the too dangerous to be driven notice. Rare because it's something most people check
before they take it for IVA.
--
Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level, then beat you with experience.
Anonymous
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snapper
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| posted on 15/1/12 at 09:42 AM |
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It's got a vin number which identifies it as a pre registered car which has a registration number already.
You need to insure it on the reg now MOT it, advise DVLA of the modifications and probably be required to get an engineers report
I eat to survive
I drink to forget
I breath to pi55 my ex wife off (and now my ex partner)
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Humbug
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| posted on 15/1/12 at 09:53 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by stevegough
Interesting car!
When we kit-car types say "you are legally allowed to drive to a pre-arranged IVA test" we are talking about kit-cars / one - offs that we
have built ourselves.
This vehicle, although very definitely a 'one-off' is obviously not a kit car, but a vehicle that has been converted from a
standard model - that is one that is already covered under 'type approval' which Jaguar sorted many moons ago. The only reason to
have to do a full IVA on it would be if you have altered the chassis from the original.
Reiterating what Snuggs has asked - why does it need an IVA test?
I think you may need a VIC check (same as you do with imported and Cat C / D write offs) to register it - however - to further fuel the debate - as
you have cut the roof off, and the car's chassis is a monocoque - maybe you have altered the chassis........ (or was it built as
a convertible originally?)......
On another point, as the insurance groups now go from 1 to 50, I think you will find it is a group 36 (ish) and not a 20.
Good luck!
I think you've answered your own question there! The monocoque chassis has been considerably altered.
http://www.fordownersclub.com/forums/topic/28976-new-member-new-company/
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rusty nuts
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| posted on 15/1/12 at 10:03 AM |
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When my car was being SVAd someone rang the test station and asked if the car could be driven on trade plates, I can't remember the reason but
I'm sure they said it was illegal. As for the car having a registration number because it has a vin number ALL production cars come off the
assembly line with a vin number but not a reg number
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wilkingj
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| posted on 15/1/12 at 11:02 AM |
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What ever you end up doing, if you go for an IVA, CARRY ALL your Paperwork with you, including your driving licence insurance etc etc etc.
If you get stopped, it will be easier to explain to the police. They are far more likely to believe you if you can back up your story with the
paperwork.
Especially any appointment or letters from VOSA etc.
Its easier to explain a kit car with no number plates and an IVA. But a std car, even though its been modified is a Lot harder to convince them it
hasnt got a registration.
They will stick the VIN number into their computer, and out will pop the old reg, as you can bet the DVLA wil not have changed any records!
My Nephew is a policeman, and he tells me that the stories he geta are often very far fetched. Most are outright lies. So they will be pushed to
believe an explanation that is a bit unusual.
Having all the paperwork will show that you are not trying to hide anything.
Also remember..... getting it wrong, they will sieze the vehicle. This will cost you the tow away fees, the storage fees on a daily basis, and till
having to sort out the paperwork to get the vehicle back.
Sorting out the paperwork on something like your vehicle, could take days or weeks. Then you car could get crushed as you run out of time before their
time limit is up.
Maybe you need it IVA'd etc, and you cant do that as they have it impounded. ie chicken and egg job.
Make sure you get this right.
Last resort, trailer it to the IVA.
1. The point of a journey is not to arrive.
2. Never take life seriously. Nobody gets out alive anyway.
Best Regards
Geoff
http://www.v8viento.co.uk
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speedview
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| posted on 15/1/12 at 12:29 PM |
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Morning all,
More info about 'why' at the bottom of this page:
http://www.speedview.co/about
(short version - pubs and eBay app on smartphone is to blame)
Structurally it looks like "the roof has been chopped off" but in reality there isn't a lot left of the 'middle bit'
that's original:
Double-thickness gearbox tunnel and inner chassis rails. (600x600x3 mm dropping to 300x250x4 mm section there!)
3 additional cross members on the bottom of the tunnel to turn it into more of a box (one at the start/A-pillar position; one in the middle, and one
at the other end on the crossbeam under the rear seats) in addition to the two from the factory (gearbox and prop centre bearing) Can see the scale of
the tunnel well in this shot:
150x150x5mm sills tied into the rear chassis legs (themselves over-plated and plugged w/4mm plate), a strengthened rear seat crossbeam (more sections
removed and re-fabbed in 4 mm plate), and the front chassis legs/bulkhead (you guessed it, big chunks removed and re-fabbed in 4 mm plate.
A and C pillars are tied in with 3 mm plate on the insides; windscreen frame is a mixture of 30x30x3 mm box and 3 mm plate, with some delicate little
gussets in our favourite 3 mm plate (hide behind the door mirrors with the doors shut) 2 mm centre span deflection with no glass and a British
Standard bloke hanging off it, 1 mm if you try the same at a corner, so we should be good for the inevitable hanging off the screen frame to get out
the car without killing the glass. B-pillars are the factory outers (they're actually a pretty serious pair of pressings, 4 mm total in high
strength steel), with the inside halves made in 6 mm plate for the lower half with the belt hole in, and 3 mm plate for the upper half.
Or in photos, the grey bits look like they were fabricated in a shipyard...
In terms of structure I guess its a Discovery 3 sized chassis with a monocoque shell as a template. Heavy as all heck (+ somewhere between 200 and 250
kg in steel) but its cheap and the car isn't a flyweight kit car anyway. Net (having lost a lot in roof, glass, soundproofing, electric
motors/adjustments etc) I doubt it'll be 150kg, and you don't really notice two passengers in the original anyway. Time will tell
though!
Why an IVA? The monocoque has been modified (it doesn't matter how trivial the mods are by the way - anything structural invalidates the
original type approval) so it loses type approval.
If you make a notifiable change (eg, change of bodystyle), DVLA will now ado the following when you notify them:
http://www.cosic.org.uk/MarkoStuff/xj8/XJ_DVLA/
Supposedly that car doesn't exist any more. but if you hit up R32 FND Jaguar in here:
https://www.taxdisc.direct.gov.uk/EvlPortalApp/app/home/intro
It says that it isn't due for SORN until 01/12/2012 - suggesting that it has two identities: New unregistered vehicle SABTVRO397B223240 and
used/SORNED vehicle R32 FND?
If you haven't made any notifiable changes, you're supposed to voluntarily de-register the vehicle, request a new VIN, take a BIVA test,
and re-register. They're going to begin enforcing this with the MOT test checkboxes for 'modified monocoque' but they're
already starting to give anything roof-chopped/pickup-converted etc a tug after seeing them at shows.
Poking about, it looks like the IVA is the same waiver as the MOT:
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1994/22/schedule/2
quote:
22(1)A vehicle is an exempt vehicle when it is being used solely for the purpose of—
(a)submitting it (by previous arrangement for a specified time on a specified date) for a compulsory test [F45, a vehicle identity check][F46, a
vehicle weight test or a reduced pollution test], or
(b)bringing it away from [F47any such test][F48or check].
[F49(1A)A vehicle is an exempt vehicle when it is being used solely for the purpose of—
(a)taking it (by previous arrangement for a specified time on a specified date) for a relevant re-examination, or
(b)bringing it away from such a re-examination.]
quote:
(4)In this paragraph “compulsory test” means, as respects England and Wales and Scotland—
(a)in the case of a vehicle for which by virtue of section 66(3) of the M10Road Traffic Act 1988 a vehicle licence cannot be granted unless certain
requirements are satisfied, an examination such as is specified in sub-paragraph (5), and
(b)otherwise, an examination under section 45 of the M11Road Traffic Act 1988 with a view to obtaining a test certificate without which a vehicle
licence cannot be granted for the vehicle.
(5)The examinations referred to in sub-paragraph (4)(a) are—
[F59(a)an examination under regulations under section 49(1)(b) or (c) of the M12Road Traffic Act 1988 (examination as to compliance with construction
and use or safety requirements)]
(b)an examination for the purposes of sections 54 to 58 of that Act (examination as to a F60. . . vehicle’s compliance with type approval
requirements), [F61and]
F62(c). . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
(d)an examination under regulations under section 61(2)(a) of that Act (examinations in connection with alterations to . . . vehicles subject to type
approval requirements).
I'll drive the IVA route, stopping for fuel/pee/food at Tesco just before VOSA in Cardiff in the morning (need to top off with fuel and
I'll want breakfast!) and again on the way back in the evening at Asda Swansea (I'll want dinner!).
If the DVLA chappie (or local police if they use them for ID checks) fancies walking 300 metres/getting a lift in the chase car to the car park to do
the ID check that'd be great, but I couldn't drive it to their car park. (that wouldn't be an incidental stop unless they sold bacon
sandwiches and petrol!)
Only two police authorities (Dyfed-Powys, South Wales) so if I file notice in advance that'll probably reduce the heartache too. (no good being
legal but late for the IVA test) It'll be fine in Dyfed-Powys as there are all of about 3 policemen here, but am not sure about South Wales!
Trailering would be cheating if its legal not to! There's something appealing about driving to the test to check whether the vehicle is
roadworthy or not... 
[Edited on 15/1/12 by speedview]
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Snuggs
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| posted on 15/1/12 at 12:54 PM |
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Cheers for that.
IVA is definitely the way to go but as others have said you should only need to be insured and attending a pre-booked test to be legal.
Also as said, carry every bit of documentation that you have.
Good luck with the IVA
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.topcashback.co.uk/ref/snuggstcb
Spider pig, spider pig, does whatever a spider pig does.
I doubt therefore I may be.
Luposlipophobia : Fear of being chased by wolves around a freshly waxed kitchen floor, while wearing only socks on your feet.
My mind not only wanders, sometimes it leaves completely!
http://www.venganza.org
http://www.jesusandmo.net/
http://www.snuggs.co.uk
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speedview
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| posted on 15/1/12 at 10:48 PM |
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Must be quiet at Dyfed Powys Police HQ at 10:30 pm on a Sunday...
"In the not too distant future I shall be driving a vehicle from
Milford Haven to VOSA's inspection facility in Cardiff... [bit about IVA test] ...The
vehicle WILL be insured, but WILL NOT be registered, taxed, or
MOTed. It will not show any registration plates or trade plates."
"Sure - just let us know the date."
(dropped them an email earlier this afternoon)
Rural Wales is awesome sometimes
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caroline89
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| posted on 13/12/13 at 05:24 AM |
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IVA is unquestionably the best approach to go yet as others have said you may as well just need to be safeguarded and going to a provoked test to be
lawful.
Truck driving jobs
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omega 24 v6
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| posted on 13/12/13 at 06:51 AM |
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quote:
"Sure - just let us know the date."
So we know where and when we can catch and charge you LOL.
Seriously though you will be fine. Nice bit of work you've done there.
If it looks wrong it probably is wrong.
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britishtrident
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| posted on 13/12/13 at 07:27 AM |
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Trade plates if you are entitled to use them bring the vehicle under the insurane cover company of the
motortrader who own the trade plates.
There are however restrictions on the use of trade plates you cannot just borrow them from the local garage, basically they are to allow employees to
move unregistered or untaxed vehicles, the only exceptions are for demonstration purposes and recovery vehicles.
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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adithorp
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| posted on 13/12/13 at 08:50 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by caroline89
IVA is unquestionably the best approach to go yet as others have said you may as well just need to be safeguarded and going to a provoked test to be
lawful.
Nice thread resurection... almost 2 year sold!
Always check the post dates before replying to, what I'd assume, you found via a search.
"A witty saying proves nothing" Voltaire
http://jpsc.org.uk/forum/
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speedview
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| posted on 15/12/13 at 09:16 PM |
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Still not bloody finished either. :-o
(topic reply notification)
I hate interiors...
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ashg
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| posted on 16/12/13 at 06:52 AM |
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If you hate them dont have one :-)
Anything With Tits or Wheels Will cost you MONEY!!
Haynes Roadster (Finished)
Exocet (Finished & Sold)
New Project (Started)
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