So I want a nice powerful home pc for home theatre, gaming and storing all my music, pictures etc etc.

Now I watched the Gadget Show last night where he built a better PC from components than Suzie could buy for the same money.

I was looking to spend around £1200-1400 on a Mesh PC - dual core, good graphics card, etc etc.

How hard is it to build a PC from components? Should I think about attempting it? or just buy a ready built one? I can do things like swap out Ram, HDD's and CD drives already....

way easier than building a car, unless something goes wrong. much more difficult to break a car when you're putting it together

Easy enough, 1-2hours work max, I've built 5 over the years.

Only bit where you really have to be extra careful is putting the heatsink on the processor, the rest of it is screwing components into the case and making sure you plug the connectors in the right way round (which it sounds like you have already done ). The only problem comes If it doesn't work first time, as you do have a problem working out which bit is broken.

I'd avoid mesh by the way they have a rather poor reputation.

Dead easy

Built the one I'm typing this on in fact.

Stu

One area where you might gain from a pre-built is with the software.
If the bundled software is actually stuff you want and will use then you could save a lot of money, look at the price of MS Office for instance
If you are happy to tinker and aquire your own software then go for it and build one, its about as hard as, well nothing really, if you can use a screwdriver thats it hardware wise!

Thanks guys, and how do I find out what components I need, what are best for what I want, etc etc....

As for software, the only thing I need it XP, the rest I can get 'elsewhere'

[Edited on 24/10/06 by Jasper]

Its pretty easy to do.

I would buy memory from Crucial (www.crucial.com/uk) as they are good for service and quality at decent prices too.

Get a good quality PSU don't go for the cheapest for the power. Get something that is not going to cause problems later (such as random game lock ups due to the graphics card not getting a good enough power feed).

Make sure your cooling is adequate too.

As a basis, go for at least a gig of memory (espesh if you plan to use vista in the future). Look at a CPU just below state of the art (so you arn't paying a premium for a couple of % performance improvement).

Something like a GeForce 7600 card (I have a 6600GT which is more then enough). Look at around 150 mark for a graphics card, again just below state of the art.

I would go for a decent Creative Labs sound card for home theater at least (say 80 quid at a guess).

Your monther board will be based on your CPU choice. I would personally go Intel for CPU as past experiences have always been better with Intel. Certainly I've found the cost of cooling for AMD CPUS has eaten up a chunk of the price difference. May not be the same these days though.

Say 100 to 200 gig SATA hard drive (or a couple of 80-100 gig drives) if you want to keep movies on HDD its useful.

If you can swap out bits you can build. The only bit is getting the motherboard and CPU installed without bodging it. Just take anti static precautions (i.e. don't lay it all out on a nylon carpet) and you should be mostly OK.

After its all running for a while zip tie all your power cables up neatly it will improve cooling and help if you do need to open it up.

for good on line prices check out

www.scan.co.uk
www.microdirect.co.uk

I have no conection with the above but thay do seem to have good prices and can supply evry thging you need

PC building is fairly simple. I, too, watched Gadget show last night, BUT didn't like the way he was building PC with no earth strap!
If you're doing that, put the PSU in first and plug it in (don't turn on at socket though!) Then touch the case occasionally.

For picking components it depends on what you need it for £1400 buys a really good spec, but where you spend the money depends what you are doing.

Have a look at these:
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/acatalog/Full_Systems.html

I'd suggest something like a "Titan" Intel Core 2 DUO E6300 System (FS-000-OK) for a detailed spec, which would leave you enough for a decent mouse/keyboard/monitor.

(I've never had any problems with AMD, but I'd pick a Nvidia graphics card over ATI if you ever want to experiment with Linux)

p.s. while I've only had good luck buying from overclockers others have had problems with returns.

be aware of overclockers.co.uk
good kit, but they do not recognise you have rights under the distance selling regualtions. unless you actually take them to court

EDIT sorry didn't read the above post fully before i posted.


[Edited on 24/10/06 by liam.mccaffrey]

www.pcnextday.co.uk get pretty good reviews for pre-built PCs.

For components try:

www.overclockers.co.uk (no issues so far)
www.aria.co.uk
www.dabs.co.uk
www.scan.co.uk
www.ebuyer.co.uk

For research try www.tomshardware.com or www.anandtech.com and get reading.

I couldn't count how many PCs I've built over the last 15 years!



[Edited on 24/10/06 by bimbleuk]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Jasper
Thanks guys, and how do I find out what components I need, what are best for what I want, etc etc....

As for software, the only thing I need it XP, the rest I can get 'elsewhere'

[Edited on 24/10/06 by Jasper]

---

I have built hundreds of systems of the years and it really is very simple.

The biggest problem these days is ordering compatible components.

Start with a Processor that fits your needs and pocket.

then find a motherboard that accepts it. You must make sure the motherboard has the right socket number, for instance you will find that an AMD64 is available in at least 3 different types to fit different sockets!

Next up is memory, read VERY carefully the specs for the motherboard you ahve chosen to ensure you get the correct memory to fit the board....

Graphics cards are much of a muchness these days unless you are into some very serious gaming. I would look for something between £100 and £200 BUT make sure it has WDDM compatible drivers available and an absolute minimum of 128Mb memory.
Personally I tend to try and buy the graphics card from the same manufacturer as the motherboard as this seems to reduce compatability issues.

The watchword for anyone building or upgrading a machine right now is Vista! (the new version of windows if you hadn't heard). Vista requires a pretty high spec machine but if you are building a machine in the near future it is likely you will want to run Vista as your OS. It is available now as a free time limited beta and will go on sale early in the new year (if not sooner). From a 'behind the scenes' view it is a huge step forward and well worth it BUT it does require a GOOD machine to live up to it's hype. you will need the min spec graphics card I mentioned above to run the new interface - and without the new interface some of the components like DVD maker stop working!

My personal MIN spec for a new machine build would be:

Athlon 64 3000 or Intel equivalent
suitable motherboard for above(not the cheapest!)
1Gb DDR2 mem (matched pair of 512Mb's)
256 Mb WDDM PCI-express graphics
500 Watt low noise PSU (decent quality)
100Gb Sata2 HDD
Soundblaster Audigy sound card
Dual layer DVD writer
Windows Vista!

others will no doubt disagree but that's my personal opinion.

HTH

quote:

---

Originally posted by Marcus
PC building is fairly simple. I, too, watched Gadget show last night, BUT didn't like the way he was building PC with no earth strap!
If you're doing that, put the PSU in first and plug it in (don't turn on at socket though!) Then touch the case occasionally.

---

These days to build a pc is a waste of time and money, it isn't difficult but you will end up paying twice the cost for the same kit.

I built my very first one at the start of the year, its an absolute monster, watercooled and everything!! Cost me £1200 in total, though now I suppose you could build it for half that the way prices fall. If you need any help u2u I'll help you out if I can.
Regards
Matt

quote:

---

Originally posted by DaveFJ
My personal MIN spec for a new machine build would be:

Athlon 64 3000 or Intel equivalent
suitable motherboard for above(not the cheapest!)
1Gb DDR2 mem (matched pair of 512Mb's)
256 Mb WDDM PCI-express graphics
500 Watt low noise PSU (decent quality)
100Gb Sata2 HDD
Soundblaster Audigy sound card
Dual layer DVD writer
Windows Vista!

others will no doubt disagree but that's my personal opinion.

HTH

---

I also don't need to worry about monitor mouse or keyboard as I have these thanks to Dells amazing delivery service where they seem to send two of everything

Its a doddle. Built about 10 pcs in the last 4 or 5 years. You cant go wrong most of the time.

Make sure you buy well known brands to avoid any hardware compatability issues (though these are few and far between these days). Use AMD CPUs as for the money you will not beat them for performance, Intel CPUs are horribly overpriced IMO.

You dont need an earth strap to build a PC. I have never used one, just make sure that you arent sitting on the carpet when you build it, and you make good use of the anti static bags you get with all the bits and dont pic up parts by touching the connectors (you shouldnt do this anyway as you create an oxide layer on the surface of the connector!). Never had a problem doing this... If you are really paranoid then earthstarps are only a couple of quid.

David

I tend to leave PCs plugged into the mains when working on them but switched off at the socket. this way the earth is still connected. Then when working with sensitive components like memory I try to keep the skin of my wrist/forearm in conatct with the chassis...

It's not ideal but it is better than nothing.....

I was gonna use Scan.com, same as he used on Gadget Show. Spoke to a chap there who said he would happily go through the whole set-up with me when ordering to make sure I get the right kit.

I was thinking more on the lines of Dual Core Intel, 2Mb ram, 300 Gig HDD, good graphics card, Vista ready motherboard etc etc

Takes me back, my first homebuild was a Scan (you used to be able to go in and they'd get the stuff off the shelf while you waited).

Demon machine for the time 486SX33 with 8M of ram, when the mainstream made do with 4M

Stick a dvb tv card in it as well so you can use it as a pvr and burn to dvd. It's a piece of cake building them as long as all you components are compatible. Graphics cards are the expensive part and whatever you get will be out of date next week so don't go mad on it just get something to do what you need. Don't forget to earth yourself to something before you start, I know one person who knackered a memory module before it got used.

just for a bit of one-up-manship

my first homebuild PC was a 286 16Mhz with 1Mb ram and 128K? graphics oh and a 40Mb HDD

My 1st PC was a 486 with 512meg of HDD and 4 meg of ram. Sad eh!!

Incidently i built myself a PC which was dead easy untill it came to loading on the software. It took 2 days to sort out and that was with a microsoft certified engineer and i swore NEVER AGAIN!!!

All recomendations given will end up with a good PC for sure, but please take static precautions, without doing so you can cause motherboard and memory problems that can haunt you for the life of the PC, seriously!

Cheers

Alex
PS
You can buy a proper static strap for a couple of pounds, don't take the chance.

quote:

---

Originally posted by donut
My 1st PC was a 486 with 512meg of HDD and 4 meg of ram. Sad eh!!

---

Got my bits from ebuyer and they went together no problem. Wish I had bought the OEM XP at the time though.

Building your own means you don't pay extra for bits you will never use and I transferred drives etc from the old computer.

just been on to Eclipse computers site

link

I have recommended this company to others in the past.

They have a 'computer configurator' on their site. I just ran through a config for an 'ultimate' PC and came in with a price of a little over £1000...... worth a look!

I buy all my parts from eclipse computers. they are only down the road from me at uni.

Do check they have stuff in stock before you order though!

David

quote:

---

Originally posted by DaveFJ
just been on to Eclipse computers site

link

I have recommended this company to others in the past.

They have a 'computer configurator' on their site. I just ran through a config for an 'ultimate' PC and came in with a price of a little over £1000...... worth a look!

---

click 'computers' section on the top right.
Pick a series and then configure and buy.

quote:

---

Use AMD CPUs as for the money you will not beat them for performance, Intel CPUs are horribly overpriced IMO.

---

Ahh yes, got it now, did the same thing and came out at £1009. Is that ready built for that price?

Mine was a 1k ZX80, I wish I still had it

[Edited on 24/10/06 by Peteff]

When buying your Processor go for the retail package rather than OEM that way you'll get the correct fan and heatsink plus a guarantee.As for overclockers personally I wouldnt give em elbow room re thier returns policy, Aria are a better bet.
Cheers,
Bob

Most of the goodpoints about building your own PC have already been mentioned. I built my home PC three years ago, and it is still going strong.

The only things I will add are get a decent power supply! And be wary of Overclockers. I bought most of my components from them, and most worked fine and I had no issue with them. When they sent me a duff flatscreen monitor out though, it took me 9 weeks and over 20 emails and around 4 hours on the phone to get a replacement sorted. Their customer service when it comes to returns is a complete and utter farce.

Oh, and the other thing thta might be worth mentioning, if you are planning to use the PC as a home entertainment centre, then be aware of the noise level that is produced by the various components. It's the one thing that annoys me, a fan buzzing away in the background.

I'm going to be building a new pc next year, and I'm planning to look into "Silent" components, and reduce the noise to next to nothing....

Cheers
Andy

I say go for it - I've built & re-built my own for 7 years (and the rest of the family's for the last 5 years or so = 20 to 30 PC's of varing spec and component ages - I even got my old +3 spectrum to work again ! ) - If you want to get started quickly, get a good book or read some of the guides online

www.motherboards.org - lots of info, reviews and guides

online.stak.com - wholesaler with a good range of stuff (based in rugby)


ASUS stuff has always worked well for me (lots of updates and support on there site) I have 4 of there motherboards, 4 optical drives, 4 graphics cards and a Laptop and no problems yet [touch wood] - the laptops 4 years old and nothings broken (which is more than I can say for my mates who got HP's and Fujitsu-Siemens ones at the same time)


I'd always spend a bit extra to get a good motherboard (£130 last time, when I could have got one for £30), one thats reliable, fast, has lots of features and leaves room for a bit of upgrading (something that package PC's never do anymore)
ASUS do some motherboards that are designed to be 'silent' that don't have fans (other than what ever you use for the CPU, Graphics and Power supply)


Seagate hard discs have lasted much longer than others I've had (IBM are good too) - don't get a fujitsu one (and I had alot of problems with old western digital ones in the past but they are supposed to be better now)
I'm running 2 Segate 120Gb SATA discs together as a RAID 0 array (two discs acting like 1 twce the size and twice the speed) it makes a big difference to loading times (but if 1 disc dies you loose all your data) - RAID 1 would give you normal speed but with a backup copy of everything and RAID 10 does both at the same time (but needs 4 identical discs)


I'd go with Nvidia graphics too - I've had 2 ATi cards and both died within 2 years, but my ASUS Nvidia cards are all still going strong [touch wood] and some are 6 years old
For a high end machine I'd get a G7600, G7800, G7900 or G7950 - these will be avalible in a few different specs (GT, GTX.... some slightly faster than others)
again ASUS do some 'silent' ones to reduce the total noise emissions


If you wan't to run demanding apps. - such as games or DVD's and high quality music - then get a good sound card
it will not only improve the quality of your sound (if your speakers are upto it) but will reduce the load on the CPU, speeding up the whole PC (remeber to turn off the onboard sound in the BIOS to get this advantage)


Power supplies (PSU) are very important for a high end machine - my PC kept crashing despite the 650w PSU - I changed to a better 500w one and its hardly ever done it since - P4's don't like cheep PSU's (they need a very stable power source)

Just my p2's worth
-Robert


[Edited on 24/10/06 by mcerd1]

quote:

---

Originally posted by DaveFJ
just been on to Eclipse computers site

link

I have recommended this company to others in the past.

They have a 'computer configurator' on their site. I just ran through a config for an 'ultimate' PC and came in with a price of a little over £1000...... worth a look!

---

Think I shall go with an Eclipse ready built system - fantastic value (no more than a self build) and a warranty

Thanks for all your input chaps, really helped to get things clear in my head.

Eclipse are 4-5 weeks delivery, so I'm goona build it myself, here's the spec, comments and suggestions gratefully received:

QTY Price (ea) Ex VAT Total Inc VAT Remove
1 x LN15048 Intel Core 2 Duo E6400 775, 2.13 GHz, 1066MHz FSB, Allendale Core, 2MB Cache, Retail £129.89 £152.62

1 x LN15170 ASUS P5B Deluxe/WiFi-AP iP965, S775, PCI-E (x16), DDR2 533/667/800, SATA II, SATA RAID, ATX £110.96 £130.38

1 x LN12201 2Gb (2X1Gb) Corsair Value Select, DDR2 PC5300 (667), 240 Pin, Non-ECC Unbuffered, CAS 5-5-5-15 £119.53 £140.45

2 x LN14162 320 Gb Seagate ST3320620AS Barracuda 7200.10, SATA300, 7200 rpm, 16MB Cache, 8.5 ms, NCQ £57.92 £136.11

1 x LN16065 512MB ASUS 7950GT, PCI-E (x16), Mem 1400MHz, GPU 550MHz, 24 Pipes, Dual DVI/HDTV £170.65 £200.51

1 x LN13372 Pioneer DVR-111DBK Black 16x16 DVD±RW Dual Layer DVD Writer (Reduced Length) OEM £18.71 £21.98

1 x LN5889 Sony Black 16x DVD-ROM + 48x CD-ROM IDE £9.99 £11.74

1 x LN13435 Coolermaster Centurion RC-532 Black+Silver Trim Case w/o PSU £33.99 £39.94

1 x LN13695 500W Xclio X12S4P2 SLI Goodpower 12cm Fan Dual 12v EPS SATA PCI-E with Anti-Vibration 24x7 Use Ready £28.95 £34.02

LN5487 Scan 3.5" Black Internal 52 in 1 Card Reader (SM/MMC/SD/mSD/CF/Mdrive/MS/ MSPro/MSDuo/MSDuoP) £4.49 £5.28

1 x LN16381 Microsoft Windows XP Home Edition SP2b OEM - 1 pack £49.59 £58.27


All from Scan Computers

quote:

---

Originally posted by Jasper
Eclipse are 4-5 weeks delivery, so I'm goona build it myself, here's the spec, comments and suggestions gratefully received:

QTY Price (ea) Ex VAT Total Inc VAT Remove
1 x LN15048 Intel Core 2 Duo E6400 775, 2.13 GHz, 1066MHz FSB, Allendale Core, 2MB Cache, Retail £129.89 £152.62

---

quote:

---

1 x LN15170 ASUS P5B Deluxe/WiFi-AP iP965, S775, PCI-E (x16), DDR2 533/667/800, SATA II, SATA RAID, ATX £110.96 £130.38

---

quote:

---

1 x LN12201 2Gb (2X1Gb) Corsair Value Select, DDR2 PC5300 (667), 240 Pin, Non-ECC Unbuffered, CAS 5-5-5-15 £119.53 £140.45

2 x LN14162 320 Gb Seagate ST3320620AS Barracuda 7200.10, SATA300, 7200 rpm, 16MB Cache, 8.5 ms, NCQ £57.92 £136.11

---

quote:

---

1 x LN16065 512MB ASUS 7950GT, PCI-E (x16), Mem 1400MHz, GPU 550MHz, 24 Pipes, Dual DVI/HDTV £170.65 £200.51

---

quote:

---

1 x LN13372 Pioneer DVR-111DBK Black 16x16 DVD±RW Dual Layer DVD Writer (Reduced Length) OEM £18.71 £21.98

---

quote:

---

1 x LN5889 Sony Black 16x DVD-ROM + 48x CD-ROM IDE £9.99 £11.74

---

quote:

---

1 x LN13435 Coolermaster Centurion RC-532 Black+Silver Trim Case w/o PSU £33.99 £39.94

1 x LN13695 500W Xclio X12S4P2 SLI Goodpower 12cm Fan Dual 12v EPS SATA PCI-E with Anti-Vibration 24x7 Use Ready £28.95 £34.02

---

quote:

---

LN5487 Scan 3.5" Black Internal 52 in 1 Card Reader (SM/MMC/SD/mSD/CF/Mdrive/MS/ MSPro/MSDuo/MSDuoP) £4.49 £5.28

1 x LN16381 Microsoft Windows XP Home Edition SP2b OEM - 1 pack £49.59 £58.27

---

quote:

---

All from Scan Computers

---

Thanks mate - that's very useful

Couple of questions:

Third party cooler for the processor - no idea what this is or why I need it

Gigabyte for a motherboard - can't find any on Scans web site for this processor, seems to be more for AMD. I would have gone AMD but from what I've read of the Intel they've finally got their poo together with these.... if you can find a good one let me know

With the graphics card I'm confused (easily done I know). Are you saying get a genuine Nvidia one, or get a generic Nvidia one? I thought the Asus was Nvidia based? I clearly don't know what I'm talking about here, but I recon I want a 512Mb card, so any specific recommendations?

As for the DVD reader, I do quite a lot of 'backing up' of DVD's that I have 'bought' - so it's quite useful

Any recommendations on a good quiet PSU?

XP - your right there, I do have a few copies I'll probably upgrade to Vista anyway

Gonna get a smart ali case with lots of fans to house it all in to - with some Max Power blue lights

quote:

---

Originally posted by Jasper
Thanks mate - that's very useful

Couple of questions:

Third party cooler for the processor - no idea what this is or why I need it

---

quote:

---

Gigabyte for a motherboard - can't find any on Scans web site for this processor, seems to be more for AMD. I would have gone AMD but from what I've read of the Intel they've finally got their poo together with these.... if you can find a good one let me know

---

quote:

---

With the graphics card I'm confused (easily done I know). Are you saying get a genuine Nvidia one, or get a generic Nvidia one? I thought the Asus was Nvidia based? I clearly don't know what I'm talking about here, but I recon I want a 512Mb card, so any specific recommendations?

---

quote:

---

As for the DVD reader, I do quite a lot of 'backing up' of DVD's that I have 'bought' - so it's quite useful

Any recommendations on a good quiet PSU?

---

quote:

---

XP - your right there, I do have a few copies I'll probably upgrade to Vista anyway

Gonna get a smart ali case with lots of fans to house it all in to - with some Max Power blue lights

---

ASUS Nvidia cards do normaly have a few extra features, I've gone with them in the past purely because they are well built and reliable (but others are cheeper and will probibly work fine)

The GF7950 is basicaly two GF7900's stuck together (ie ~SLI on a single card = about the most powerfull card you could buy for this motherboard)
If your motherboard was up to it you can get another of these and go to 'quad' SLI later (needs to be identical cards and there arn't that may boards that can do this yet)

put XP pro on if you can get it (gives you more network options)

the board your looking at dosen't do SLI, but with that type of graphics card (regardless of brand) and the rest of your spec your heading for a nice machine

Quad SLI is basicaly just bragging rights so far..... i think theres only about 3 games that support it, the drivers from Nvidia are still in Beta stages last i herd and they are saying the third party drivers are better for it

John

Did go with the Asus Nvidia 7950GT in the end, it was only 10 quid more than the generic card.

And I bought proper OEM XP Media centre software. I was going to get it from another source if you know what I mean, but after spending over a grand on the hardware it seemed stupid not to spend the extra 70 quid on proper software that I know will load properly and not give me any grief.

Got the whole package from Scan in the end, just waiting for the XP to come into stock, then I can get playing!

Thanks again for all the input, really useful.

And no, Linux was never an option - I need to keep life simple.......

no problem..... give us a bell if u have any problems hammering it all together !

John

Thanks John, will do..

Here's a question for you. I'll have two 320Gb HDD, can I get them to run so that they are perfect mirrors of each other? This way if one goes down, I'll have it all on the other drive. (I do also intend to back-up to DVD as well)

Ya u can use RAID in a variety of ways, but i wouldn't recommend it. thing is if u have a problem like a virus that is the problem its the problem on both so you lose everything anyway. Ide just copy files i wanna backup on to the second drive (thats what i do anyway)

OR

If you wanna use both drives as one you can, makes things alot quicker n then just back up on DVD. thing with that is if one goes you lose everything.

Its best to just drag things on to the second drive.

I have about 5 folders on my desktop n once a week i just drag them all over n then its backed up

[Edited on 1/11/06 by JackNco]

quote:

---

Originally posted by JackNco
Ya u can use RAID in a variety of ways, but i wouldn't recommend it. thing is if u have a problem like a virus that is the problem its the problem on both so you lose everything anyway

---

lol sorry i can never remember the raid numbers, always seemed like something that only had a real use on a server, i wouldn't risk *striping* them

ok

Well - it's all built and running great - graphics are awesome. Thanks for all the advise.

Had a little trouble getting it to boot from the Windows CD - ending up taking it up to Hicost as I thought I'd cocked it up - turns out I was using the wrong disc - Dohhhhhhh

ya you will need the one with Microsoft written on it. ah well its done now. well done on the build

John