matt.c
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 posted on 6/9/11 at 11:19 PM |
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Ethernet cables
After doing flak's head in with loads of questions i decided to give his brain a rest. 
Im thinking of either hard wiring (ethernet) or wireless for my new pc. It will be mainly used for online gaming and have read on the net that
hardwiring would be the way to go?
To be honest i havent got a clue which is best!
If i hardwire it then i need a long ethernet cable to go from my living room, up the loft and to a couple of rooms away (20M away)
There seams to be so many different quality ethernet cables on the market? Which on will be best for me?
I think my head is going to blow!!
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MikeFellows
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| posted on 7/9/11 at 12:26 AM |
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for a 20m run any cat5e cable will be fine
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Madinventions
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| posted on 7/9/11 at 12:44 AM |
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The easiest way to rationalise this decision is to look at the relative speeds of each method of making a network. Note that there's a lot of
generalisations in what I'm about to say!
A wired network typically runs at 100Mbps. Ignore the 'Mbps' bit and think of it as a percentage. Therefore, we'll say that a
network running via wires is full speed (100%).
Most current wireless networks run at 54Mbps, so about half the speed of a wired network.
I'll assume that your broadband is fairly healthy and runs at 8Mbps?
This means that either a wired or wireless network is plenty fast enough to handle online gaming as it will only use 8% of a wired connection, or
16%-17% of a wireless connection. (And that's flat out, on a good day!)
In a domestic situation, network speed only really becomes a factor if you're sending huge files between PCs on the same network. If you plan
on running LAN parties or doing a lot of media streaming then faster networks are better, so go with good old copper wire. For simply accessing a
broadband connection, you'll probably be limited by the speed of your broadband connection so a wireless setup is just as good in most
circumstances. It all comes down to how easy it is to run a cable in your setup, and it sounds like you've got a pretty good plan for this from
your post. If you go for a wired connection then pretty much any CAT5e cable will be ok for this length.
All IMHO of course and based on my experience! We've got 4 laptops, 2 desktops, an Xbox and a PS3 all running on a 54Mbps wireless connection
and there are very few times that the network itself is the bottleneck...
Hope this helps,
Ed.
[Edited on 7/9/11 by Madinventions]
Mojo build diary: http://www.madinventions.co.uk
Solo music project: Syrrenfor http://www.reverbnation.com/syrrenfor
View my band website:
http://www.shadowlight.org.uk
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britishtrident
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| posted on 7/9/11 at 05:44 AM |
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When setting up a wireless apart from security the most important thing is to use a channel that isn't too congested, I know of streets where
every single network is on a single channel. If you have an Android smart phone you can check channel usage using a free app WFI Analyser.
The other alternative is of course networking over mains using Home Plug adaptors.
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Proby
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| posted on 7/9/11 at 06:33 AM |
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I'd personally always use a cable where possible. I have a 30m cable from my office upstairs to my living room downstairs for my apple tv/360.
Tried streaming HD content on a 54Mbps connection (with my genuine 50mb cable connection) and it's useless. I use my iPhone & iPad wireless
but everything else, kids computer, office computer, NAS drive, printer are all hard wired to network.
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Agriv8
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| posted on 7/9/11 at 06:39 AM |
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cat 5e just done a 25 meter run to a second IP camera and all seems OK
Printer, NAS drive, and 2 IP cameras are all hard wired just laptops and phones that are wireless.
ATB Agriv8
Taller than your average Guy !
Management is like a tree of monkeys. - Those at the top look down and see a tree full of smiling faces. BUT Those at the bottom look up and see a
tree full of a*seholes .............
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graememk
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| posted on 7/9/11 at 08:04 AM |
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Madinventions has hit the nail on the head with his post..... i would go with that advice.
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splitrivet
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| posted on 7/9/11 at 08:04 AM |
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We've always got roll ends of Cat5 cluttering up the workshop free, gratis and for nowt, your welcome to plus postage, same goes to anyone else
reading this.
If you need Cat5 sockets, faceplates or patch leads at trade price give me a shout.
Cheers,
Bob
I used to be a Werewolf but I'm alright nowwoooooooooooooo
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britishtrident
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| posted on 7/9/11 at 08:25 AM |
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Both the Windows and Linux Wifi applets are quite poor at showing just how strong a signal you get from your neighbours wifi.
Using Wfi analyszer on an Android phone I can see viable signals from 8 neighbours, step outside my front door it rises to 14 ---- and this
is in an estate with traditionally built houses. Excluding my own router and access point all but one of these are on channel 1 or channel 6.
The reason is ISP supplied routers even when set to auto channel selection are invariably on channels 1 or channel 6. I once went to client who
was having wifi network speed and drop out problems. From the computers location in an upstairs home office a site survey found viable signals from
8 wifi networks every single one on channel 1. I moved the router wifi on to channel 8 and the problems disappeared
Interestingly a surprising number of people switch their routers off during the day, so if your connection mysteriously slows in the evening could
be part of the problem.
With wired ethernet over cat5 I find the main niggle is RJ45 plugs coming loose
On my own home network the priority is always reliability to the extent I used to have 2 separate cat5 networks available each with a separate
broadband phone line.
Now it is all on homeplug and wifi with a 3 Mobile dongle as backup broadband connection the wifi also has an additional access point. The
most important PC on the network has both a Homeplug and wifi connctions.
[Edited on 7/9/11 by britishtrident]
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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MikeRJ
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| posted on 7/9/11 at 08:31 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Madinventions
The easiest way to rationalise this decision is to look at the relative speeds of each method of making a network. Note that there's a lot of
generalisations in what I'm about to say!
A wired network typically runs at 100Mbps. Ignore the 'Mbps' bit and think of it as a percentage. Therefore, we'll say that a
network running via wires is full speed (100%).
Most current wireless networks run at 54Mbps, so about half the speed of a wired network.
It's really not that simple - if you take the peak transfer speeds then WiFi is more than capable of fully saturating most cable or ADSL
connections, but in practice you simply don't get 54Mbps from a 'G' standard Wifi system, even if that is shown as your connection
speed. You can get maybe 4MBytes/s from a good wifi connection, less if you have multiples devices sharing the router or any interference (e.g.
bluetooth, microwave oven, DECT phones). The lartency is also worse on a wireless connection, and this is important for gaming. Then take into
account security issues, and apart from the convenience factor, a wired connection wins hands down.
The 'N' standard is better, but again not as much as the figures suggest. Under ideal conditions, transfer speed will be about 30% higher
than 'G', rather than the doubling that the bit rates suggest.
[Edited on 7/9/11 by MikeRJ]
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splitrivet
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| posted on 7/9/11 at 09:39 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by britishtrident
With wired ethernet over cat5 I find the main niggle is RJ45 plugs coming loose
[Edited on 7/9/11 by britishtrident]
Thats because crimped plugs are designed for multi strand patch cable not solid drawn Cat5. The knife of the brass terminal just sits on the top of
the solid conductor not cut through the multistrands to effect a connection.
I'm gobsmacked that on some jobs Ive seen IT guys sitting for 2 hours making 20 .5 meter patch leads with a box of Cat5 and a bag of plugs
which after a bit of movement go open circuit when pukka flexible patch leads are about 50 P each.
Best and neatest solution is to fit a Cat5 outlet and use a patch lead between this and equipment.
Cheers,
Bob
I used to be a Werewolf but I'm alright nowwoooooooooooooo
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britishtrident
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| posted on 7/9/11 at 09:56 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by MikeRJ
quote:
Originally posted by Madinventions
The easiest way to rationalise this decision is to look at the relative speeds of each method of making a network. Note that there's a lot of
generalisations in what I'm about to say!
A wired network typically runs at 100Mbps. Ignore the 'Mbps' bit and think of it as a percentage. Therefore, we'll say that a
network running via wires is full speed (100%).
Most current wireless networks run at 54Mbps, so about half the speed of a wired network.
It's really not that simple - if you take the peak transfer speeds then WiFi is more than capable of fully saturating most cable or ADSL
connections, but in practice you simply don't get 54Mbps from a 'G' standard Wifi system, even if that is shown as your connection
speed. You can get maybe 4MBytes/s from a good wifi connection, less if you have multiples devices sharing the router or any interference (e.g.
bluetooth, microwave oven, DECT phones). The lartency is also worse on a wireless connection, and this is important for gaming. Then take into
account security issues, and apart from the convenience factor, a wired connection wins hands down.
The 'N' standard is better, but again not as much as the figures suggest. Under ideal conditions, transfer speed will be about 30% higher
than 'G', rather than the doubling that the bit rates suggest.
[Edited on 7/9/11 by MikeRJ]
Any properly setup wifi connection will take everything current UK broadband will throw at it. My home broadband speed at just under 6mbps
isn't brilliant but no matter if I connect directly to the router or by wifi or by via networking over mains the speed test results remain
the same.
Only 4 mbps from a wifi G connection points to something wrong --- interference or reflections or just too much brickwork between the router and
the PC.
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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MikeR
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| posted on 7/9/11 at 10:05 AM |
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This is all well and good but if you want to play games latency is also important - ie how long it takes to get a packet of information from your
machine to the competitors. Lots of things come into play with latency but you want to do your best to minimise everything you can to give you the
best latency possible. Wireless is poo for latency.
(that was a technical description).
Although despite knowing this i still have my xbox set up via wireless cause its easier 
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britishtrident
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| posted on 7/9/11 at 10:16 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by splitrivet
quote:
Originally posted by britishtrident
With wired ethernet over cat5 I find the main niggle is RJ45 plugs coming loose
[Edited on 7/9/11 by britishtrident]
Thats because crimped plugs are designed for multi strand patch cable not solid drawn Cat5. The knife of the brass terminal just sits on the top of
the solid conductor not cut through the multistrands to effect a connection.
I'm gobsmacked that on some jobs Ive seen IT guys sitting for 2 hours making 20 .5 meter patch leads with a box of Cat5 and a bag of plugs
which after a bit of movement go open circuit when pukka flexible patch leads are about 50 P each.
Best and neatest solution is to fit a Cat5 outlet and use a patch lead between this and equipment.
Cheers,
Bob
Or where possible the not so neat solution of just running a bought in (proper flexible stranded) patch cable all the way from the router to the
work station.
[Edited on 7/9/11 by britishtrident]
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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britishtrident
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| posted on 7/9/11 at 10:19 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by MikeR
This is all well and good but if you want to play games latency is also important - ie how long it takes to get a packet of information from your
machine to the competitors. Lots of things come into play with latency but you want to do your best to minimise everything you can to give you the
best latency possible. Wireless is poo for latency.
(that was a technical description).
Although despite knowing this i still have my xbox set up via wireless cause its easier
Wireless is seductive ----- but Homeplugs are also handy though security bad dream.
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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ChrisW
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| posted on 7/9/11 at 10:29 AM |
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Rule of thumb:
If it's portable, use wifi. I'm talking phones, laptops, tablets, etc
If it's fixed, wire it. IE PC's, TV's, consoles, security cameras, etc.
Wifi latency is terrible for games and can break up easily due to interference. I know it works fine 99% of the time and for some people that's
enough but there's nothing more frustrating than being in the middle of a streaming HD film, or at a critical point in a game only for your next
door neightbour to put the microwave on and suddenly cripple your connection.
CAT5 cables are so cheap it's pointless doing it any other way. Even little switches to break out one cable into multiple devices are under a
tenner these days. I bought half a dozen Dynamode 5 port switches for £7.50 each just for that job.
Try minitran for the bits. www.minitran.co.uk. No connection, just a company I use a lot and have had excellent service from.
Chris
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jossey
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| posted on 7/9/11 at 11:31 AM |
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i have kingspan'ed all my house so my wireless router wont extend the whole house so ive gone the cat5e route. you can get outdoor wiring now so
just route round the outside of the house or even better under the house and up the rear wall if you cant do if through the house.
hard wiring is great if you can. try get a ethernet cable to back of your tv ready for media centre.
I have 3 cat5e cables going everywhere into every room meeting in the loft.
you can send HDMI over cat5e to 50meters with adaptors which cost a few quid.
Thanks
David Johnson
Building my tiger avon slowly but surely.
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