hughpinder
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| posted on 24/6/10 at 09:53 AM |
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water welder
Has anyone tried one of these?
http://www.watertorch.com/buytorch/buybg1.html
Just wondered really if they are any good for aly welding for bodywork thickness - no gas cylinders (oxy/acetylene or argon) to pay for when
you're not using it!
I know jewellers use the same technology for their benchtop welders and also for 'polishing' quartz etc.
Regards
Hugh
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coozer
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| posted on 24/6/10 at 09:59 AM |
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Dead cheap eh? How do they work? I'm puzzled.....
1972 V8 Jago
1980 Z750
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wilkingj
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| posted on 24/6/10 at 10:06 AM |
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Err... one of the constituents of the gas is Oxygen. Water Being H2O is 1 molecule of Hydrogen and 2 molecules of Oxygen.
When welding you have to aviod any oxygen to prevent the weld from oxidizing.
I am not sure how you can weld with this Gas, when the whole point of using C02, or Argon is to expell all the Oxygen from the weld area.
It doesnt make sense to me.
1. The point of a journey is not to arrive.
2. Never take life seriously. Nobody gets out alive anyway.
Best Regards
Geoff
http://www.v8viento.co.uk
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suparuss
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| posted on 24/6/10 at 10:07 AM |
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its a browns gas electrolyser it says, so- probably a big tank of water inside and some plates with electric going through them, this serperates the
oxygen and hyrogen through electrolisys which comes out of the pipes at the end. so basicaly a gas torch which you plug into the wall!
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designer
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| posted on 24/6/10 at 10:07 AM |
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I'm totally confused!!
What is it?
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suparuss
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| posted on 24/6/10 at 10:08 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by wilkingj
Err... one of the constituents of the gas is Oxygen. Water Being H2O is 1 molecule of Hydrogen and 2 molecules of Oxygen.
When welding you have to aviod any oxygen to prevent the weld from oxidizing.
I am not sure how you can weld with this Gas, when the whole point of using C02, or Argon is to expell all the Oxygen from the weld area.
It doesnt make sense to me.
yeah, i thought you could only cut with them, maybe you can braze with flux?
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coozer
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| posted on 24/6/10 at 10:14 AM |
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If it was any good Machine Mart would have them in surely?
1972 V8 Jago
1980 Z750
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skinned knuckles
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| posted on 24/6/10 at 10:36 AM |
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when the gasses burn, the only bi-product (other than flame) is water. this surely would make it a rubbish welder? i can see how it would work as a
cutter but then i think a plasma cutter would be better. the only applications where it could be useful is somewhere where you aren't permitted
to store flamable gasses as its produces on demand. IMO
good idea? yes, probably
would i ever buy one? absolutely not
A man isn't complete until he's married, then he's finished
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BenB
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| posted on 24/6/10 at 11:04 AM |
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Still intrugued by the people running their cars off it......
And the electricity comes from.....
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RIE
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| posted on 24/6/10 at 11:23 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by wilkingj
Water Being H2O is 1 molecule of Hydrogen and 2 molecules of Oxygen.
Other way round: 2 hydrogen atoms and 1 oxygen atom in a single water molecule.
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r1_pete
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| posted on 24/6/10 at 11:45 AM |
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Its the old Browns Gas hoax, gets ressurrected in one form or another every year or so.
Google 'Browns Gas'
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mad4x4
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| posted on 24/6/10 at 12:25 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by BenB
Still intrugued by the people running their cars off it......
And the electricity comes from.....
What a bout a Petrol Engine with a Dynamo or a generator attached.....
Scot's do it better in Kilts.
MK INDY's Don't Self Centre Regardless of MK Setting !
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Stott
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| posted on 24/6/10 at 12:56 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by r1_pete
Its the old Browns Gas hoax, gets ressurrected in one form or another every year or so.
Google 'Browns Gas'
Tuh, It's not a hoax, it's the worlds answer to neutralization of radioactive watse don't ya know!!
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bartonp
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| posted on 24/6/10 at 01:08 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by wilkingj
Err... one of the constituents of the gas is Oxygen. Water Being H2O is 1 molecule of Hydrogen and 2 molecules of Oxygen.
When welding you have to aviod any oxygen to prevent the weld from oxidizing.
I am not sure how you can weld with this Gas, when the whole point of using C02, or Argon is to expell all the Oxygen from the weld area.
It doesnt make sense to me.
...and oxy acetylene uses..? I think you can weld with that.
All it might do is burn a hydrogen flame in the available oxygen. Don't know how hot that gets...
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iank
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| posted on 24/6/10 at 01:15 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by bartonp
quote:
Originally posted by wilkingj
Err... one of the constituents of the gas is Oxygen. Water Being H2O is 1 molecule of Hydrogen and 2 molecules of Oxygen.
When welding you have to aviod any oxygen to prevent the weld from oxidizing.
I am not sure how you can weld with this Gas, when the whole point of using C02, or Argon is to expell all the Oxygen from the weld area.
It doesnt make sense to me.
...and oxy acetylene uses..? I think you can weld with that.
All it might do is burn a hydrogen flame in the available oxygen. Don't know how hot that gets...
3200 degreesC The problem is going to be the amount of steam that's being put into the weld pool.
[Edited on 24/6/10 by iank]
--
Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level, then beat you with experience.
Anonymous
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hughpinder
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| posted on 24/6/10 at 01:33 PM |
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Ah ha - The welders really do work when you electrolyse the water you produce hydrogen and oxygen- Because they are not separated and pressurised into
cylinders but remain mixed, you get exactly the right stoichiometric ratio to burn with no excess oxygen - this bit I'm ok with - I've
just never seen one in use and wondered if they're confined to the jewelry business or if they are powerful enought to use for
'proper' welding as the linked one was. I think underwater welding as done on oil rigs and the like use to be done with oxy hydrogen
welders. I won't be buying one as the cost is too high, but I might have a play at making one. We use hydrogen from cylinders as a reagent where
I work, so I am fairly familiar with some of the dangers of working with the stuff.
All the stuff about running your car on the resulting gas as a self sustaining thing is guff I'm sure. Injecting some of the gas into the air
stream of your car while still using your normal fuel may have some effect on fuel economy - I don't know - it may just confuse the lambda
sensor as you're sticking ionised gas into the engine - could make it run leaner I suppose. With engines being relatively cheaper than fuel
(well mainstream engines anyway) I guess it may be worth sacrificing the engine over 100000 miles if you save 20% on fuel.
From the replies so far I guess no one has had a go with one! Theres a place in cheshire 'siam water flame' that stocks an equivalent
unit, but its too far for me to go to just play with it.
Regards
Hugh
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iank
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| posted on 24/6/10 at 02:35 PM |
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Looks like they're being separated (two hoses to the mixer gun) or at least being kept separate as they come off the two electrodes - probably
for safety reasons - you really don't want a flashback into pre mixed hydrogen and oxygen.
--
Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level, then beat you with experience.
Anonymous
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smart51
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| posted on 28/6/10 at 11:32 AM |
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Brown's gas is a mixture of exactly 2 parts of Hydrogen to 1 of Oxygen. When burned it only produces heat and water. The flame can be used for
welding or other heating purposes. I guess you use it in place of Oxy-acetelene. Browns gas is an explosion waiting to happen though.
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