scootz
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| posted on 22/12/11 at 08:27 PM |
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Modern Tip-Tronic Auto Boxes
How are these (generally) controlled? Engine ECU? Stand-alone gearbox ECU? Other remote electrickery? Or are its functions all preset mechanically
/ hydraulically in the gearbox unit itself?
I guess what I'm asking is... can they be used outside of the donor car without too much hassle?
It's Evolution Baby!
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HowardB
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| posted on 22/12/11 at 08:40 PM |
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bet it's all smoke and mirrors, and probably magic spells in German too
Sorry not too helpful, but it's been one of those days.
How's the build coming on?
Howard
Fisher Fury was 2000 Zetec - now a 1600 (it Lives again  and goes zoom)
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Mr C
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| posted on 22/12/11 at 08:45 PM |
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This is something that I'm watching also as well. Race Car Replicas are currently fitting a TSI / DSG combo in one of their cars though its
gone a little quiet on the news front.
Girl walks into a bar and asks for a double entendre, so the barman gave her one
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PeterV
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| posted on 22/12/11 at 09:52 PM |
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Only know about the SAAB ones but they are managed by a totally dedicated ECU. The thing is hard wired to the Engine ECU and ICE unit to manage the
gearbox. My WLR B204 power plant was plumbed into a tiptronic gearbox. Nightmare wiring kinda like separating Siamese twins.
Beautiful extensions to the engine ECU though as touque managment features are available that can really help in a lightweight kit with way to much
power on tap.
Just hurts the little grey cells until it all clicks 
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snapper
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| posted on 22/12/11 at 10:47 PM |
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There tends to be a lot of communication between the engine and gearbox ECU's, if one is missing or sensors not giving the expected signals a
lot of functionality is lost.
I had big problems with an autobox on a VR6 Galaxy, it was a complete nightmare, specialist autobox company needed to plug it in to £50k worth of
diagnostics, Ford dealer was lost, VW dealer said new ECU and new box... Gulp!
I eat to survive
I drink to forget
I breath to pi55 my ex wife off (and now my ex partner)
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Chippy
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| posted on 22/12/11 at 11:34 PM |
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My wifes C5 has a tiptronic box, she never uses it and the fuel consumption is always 32.8 mpg. When I use her car I always use the tiptronic mixing
stick, and invariably get near 40 mpg, so from that point its better. The only thing that makes me annoyed is that at times it thinks it knows best
and will change down. On the C5 it has its own ECU, but I think that is also linked into the engine ECU. Cheers Ray
To make a car go faster, just add lightness. Colin Chapman - OR - fit a bigger engine. Chippy
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speedstar
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| posted on 23/12/11 at 12:30 AM |
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Had a C2 VTR for a period, with one of the sequential electronic manual/flappy paddle ones. Had an auto mode which was dim witted and crap clutch
control (both manoeuvring and gear changes). Was fun for 10 minutes to feel like a racing driver but not actually nice to drive.
As i say, that was a full manual gearbox with proper clutch, just controlled with electronic actuators. Lots of sensors which dont let the car start
if they go wrong (i discovered this the hard way), and yep, seperate ECU which talks to the engine ECU to control rev matching (ha!) and the like.
Ive heard fantastic things about the DSG's but have also heard they get through clutches at a fair rate, and theyre not cheap to change.
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Mr C
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| posted on 23/12/11 at 08:01 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by speedstar
...Ive heard fantastic things about the DSG's but have also heard they get through clutches at a fair rate, and theyre not cheap to change.
I would love one in a kit as I run one in my daily driver, which is a common rail Diesel 170BHP/DSG combination ( paddles etc) after being a staunch
manual only driver, I'm a total convert.
Girl walks into a bar and asks for a double entendre, so the barman gave her one
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scootz
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| posted on 23/12/11 at 08:17 AM |
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Cheers all.
I suspected it might be a complex one!
It's Evolution Baby!
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MikeRJ
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| posted on 23/12/11 at 09:35 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by snapper
I had big problems with an autobox on a VR6 Galaxy, it was a complete nightmare, specialist autobox company needed to plug it in to £50k worth of
diagnostics, Ford dealer was lost, VW dealer said new ECU and new box... Gulp!
Main dealers in not knowing arse from elbow shocker!
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matt_gsxr
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| posted on 23/12/11 at 06:00 PM |
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As well as the complexity, these DSG boxes are pretty heavy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Direct-Shift_Gearbox
90, 73 or 141kg depending on variant
Difficult to justify that in a lightweight car.
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Volvorsport
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| posted on 23/12/11 at 06:07 PM |
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sequential manual box must be the simplest option for a kit.
if you have an auto box , with electronic valves , you can control the change of the box , but itll take a while too change like a normal auto box.
if you use a DSG box , its preselected the next gear for you until you actually press it , thats why the shifts are really quick , its much harder to
control electronic wise .
www.dbsmotorsport.co.uk
getting dirty under a bus
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scootz
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| posted on 23/12/11 at 06:26 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Volvorsport
Sequential manual box must be the simplest option for a kit...
Absolutely, but they are super-pricey!!!
It's Evolution Baby!
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