philipcurtis100
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| posted on 18/9/09 at 11:31 AM |
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4130 Chromoly tubing
has anyone got a chassis made of this?
does anyone know where to get this from?
what size tube should i use for a ladder chassis?
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JeffHs
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| posted on 18/9/09 at 11:39 AM |
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I used it for my wishbone bushes because I could get a short length with the right ID. I got mine from the US - Aircraft Spruce, but a friend of a
friend flies for Virgin, so he brought it back for me. A friend bought enough to make a Piper Cub some years ago, got it shipped from the States.
There is a British agent for Aircraft Spruce, I don't know of any other suppliers.
By the way - why? what's wrong with mild steel like the rest of us use? My chassis weighed very little until I welded the floor in
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James
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| posted on 18/9/09 at 11:57 AM |
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My roll-over bar and back stays are made of it.
I think it's 2.5" x 3mm wall thickness.
It was sponsored by a certain Formula 1 team!
Cheers,
James
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"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
- Muhammad Ali
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James
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| posted on 18/9/09 at 12:01 PM |
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... I've just fed the troll haven't I!!!
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"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
- Muhammad Ali
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hobbsy
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| posted on 18/9/09 at 12:19 PM |
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I had a few decent BMXs years back made of this stuff. Chop a few of them up 
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Mr Whippy
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| posted on 18/9/09 at 01:39 PM |
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is it strength damaged by welding and would you have to use stainless welding wire? I though it was stronger but more brittle than mild steel, which
if it was might be dangerous I suppose in a crash.
Fame is when your old car is plastered all over the internet
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Canada EH!
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| posted on 18/9/09 at 02:09 PM |
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Most US Sprint cars and old Indy cars were built with it as well as aircraft fusalage.
Some Can -Am cars used it in the suspension, very strong, rollbars can be made with thinner tubing and smaller diameter. I used it in suspension of
Datsum 1200 race car, but brazed with nickel bronze rod, no heat problems.
Tig welding is the best, gas welding possible, problem is it has a tendancy to crack along the outer edge of the bead, each weld needs to be crack
checked when finished.
CASC and SCCA used to give gauge and diameter sizes for roll bar tubing in both DOM and 4160 (chromoly)
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liam.mccaffrey
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| posted on 18/9/09 at 02:26 PM |
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my wishbones are made of it, i got it in the states from a speed shop metal stockist.
Edit
I have Mag Particle Inspected them for cracks following tig welding. Nothing found
[Edited on 18/9/09 by liam.mccaffrey]
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nasty-bob
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| posted on 18/9/09 at 02:35 PM |
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My understanding was that chromoly needs heat treating/ stress releiving after welding. Nowadays most motorsport teams use T45, as IIRC it has a
higher or similar UTS but does not require stress releiving.
Elmdon metals can supply T45 tube and can probably supply 4130 if you still want it.
Rob
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flak monkey
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| posted on 18/9/09 at 05:10 PM |
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What masty-bob says above.
But at the end of the day its not worth the extra expense for building a whole chassis out of it. It wont be any stiffer, and mild steel is plenty
strong enough for a chassis.
David
Sera
http://www.motosera.com
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James
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| posted on 18/9/09 at 06:01 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by philipcurtis100
has anyone got a chassis made of this?
does anyone know where to get this from?
what size tube should i use for a ladder chassis?
So you've decided to build your fibreglass Mini out of this instead of ali now have you? 
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"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
- Muhammad Ali
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philipcurtis100
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| posted on 18/9/09 at 06:21 PM |
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dunno yet dont wanna make out of mild steel someone suggested the chromoly he had a westfield made of it
just bought the engine fzr 1000 exup
got the diff and brakes driveshafts etc from a scorpio cosworth so just need to decide on material for chassis then make
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Theshed
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| posted on 18/9/09 at 06:53 PM |
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Try Chassisshop very reasonable - they will post to uk at reasonable rates. For racing or top end performance (god knows why people bother to get
stuck in traffic) I suspect that there are very clear benefits from using higher grade steels. T45 is said to have similar weight saving possibilities
and is less prone to cracking (apparently) - hard to find on the interweb thingy.
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nasty-bob
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| posted on 18/9/09 at 09:39 PM |
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The biggest weight savings and stiffness gains for a chassis come from the design ie where you put the tubes. Next is the tube size. Whether you use
mild steel, T45 or, 4130 will have very little affect on the weight and stiffness compared to these aspects. Weight savings with T45 and 4130 really
are limited to the parts of the car that you will be sizing for failure cases (roll structure and wishbones).
The extra cost and potential difficultly in using other materials far outweighs the potential gains unless you are competing at a high level and have
exhausted other methods
Concentrate on obtianing strength from the structure, not from the material. You'll probably want to start again when you get half way through
building it anyway
Rob
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Benonymous
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| posted on 21/9/09 at 02:34 AM |
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If the chrome moly idea doesn't work out Phillip, what's your next idea, carbon fibre or Titanium?
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Staple balls
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| posted on 21/9/09 at 02:38 AM |
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I'm thinking unobtainium alloy
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liam.mccaffrey
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| posted on 21/9/09 at 11:38 AM |
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transparent aluminium
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andkilde
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| posted on 21/9/09 at 12:15 PM |
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Hmmn, wasn't there a tasty sports racer built in the 60s of Ali with a balsa wood core?
Ahh, there we go:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mallite
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cd.thomson
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| posted on 21/9/09 at 12:33 PM |
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what are you guys even on about. you dont know nuffink.
I has a nickel chassis that is the lighterist and fasterist in the world.
it goes 14x faster than your steel ones and thats without an engine.
every1 knows steel is oldfashioned and you may aswell use cottage cheese.
Craig
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James
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| posted on 22/9/09 at 12:16 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by liam.mccaffrey
transparent aluminium
Maybe build the bodyshell (including windows) from it too....
You'd just end up with a couple of seats, engine and running gear flying through the air!
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"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
- Muhammad Ali
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James
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| posted on 22/9/09 at 12:18 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by philipcurtis100
just bought the engine fzr 1000 exup
got the diff and brakes driveshafts etc from a scorpio cosworth so just need to decide on material for chassis then make
Ouch! don't like the sounds of all that weight.
Have you investigated making the driveshafts, brakes, diff gears and the like out of ali as well?
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"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
- Muhammad Ali
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philipcurtis100
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| posted on 22/9/09 at 06:22 PM |
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no i dont like the weight aswell
i havent yet
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flak monkey
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| posted on 22/9/09 at 06:28 PM |
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Just build the bl00dy thing out of mild steel and be done with it.
CrMo is for showing off, it offers NO structural (read STIFFNESS) advantages in chassis construction if the chassis is designed correctly. The only
reason to use it is if the chassis is intended to be used in a sport where its highly likely you could be in a huge accident (drag racing etc)
Where it does offer advantages is in roll bars which need STRENGTH. Even then MS is more than adequate and MSA approved!
I would muddy the waters with how to build a light chassis from steel, but the meaning may be lost.
[Edited on 22/9/09 by flak monkey]
Sera
http://www.motosera.com
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Liam
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| posted on 22/9/09 at 08:34 PM |
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Phil - seems like you're more interested in dreaming up a spec that makes for good pub talk than actually building anything. Do you tend to
have many project ideas that remain all talk?
Exotic, hard to use materials are only worthwhile if you're building to a demanding spec for an ultra competitive race series where every gram
is crucial. Stick to a more modest approach and you might actually achieve something. If it helps the enthusiasm/mate-impressing, promise yourself
you'll fit a carbon fibre steering wheel and something made from titanium when it's finished.
Liam
P.S. Uh oh - here comes the titanium chassis thread...
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cd.thomson
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| posted on 23/9/09 at 08:00 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by James
Ouch! don't like the sounds of all that weight.
I think the irony was lost
There are a lot of vhelpful and knowledgable people getting stressed out here. It makes no odds if phil wants to (plan to) build a chassis from
unobtanium.
If it were me and the collective knowledge of the site said mild steel was the stuff to use then I know what I'd use - but if I chose something
different then have a giggle rather than wasting your time giving my crackpot ideas credence.
[Edited on 23/9/09 by cd.thomson]
Craig
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