am having trouble starting 5jj R1. it was starting first time every time but now it wont fire.there is no spark with any plugs shorted to earth and no voltage at ignition coils. could it be ecu/cdi unit? thanks

1 check fuses.
2 battery fully charged.
3 getting fuel
4 what could have changed since last running ( knocked a wire of - sensor)

regards

agriv8

Previous Thread

it could be the ecu. A couple of things to check:

1. Are you in neutral?
2. Can you hear the relay clicking over?
3. Is the battery fully charged
4. fuses blown?

If the relay isnt clicking over then you have probably disturbed the cables when disconnecting the speedo - If you are using the standard R1 loom then you need to check that :

5. clutch wires are still bypassed
6. side switch is still by passed
7. kill switch not activated

Probably best to try and find someone with the R1 wiring diagram and start finding where there is/isn't power.

[Edited on 20/5/09 by 001Ben]

all fuses checked.
battery charged.
getting fuel.
cant have knocked any wires off as there is too seperate looms. 1 for bike loom and a new loom for lighting etc.all bike loom wires are hidden under scuttle

Is it the R1 loom?

You mention not voltage on the coil. I'm not sure about bike engines, but I think on most car engines the coil negative is switched and the coil is energised on a seperate circuit. So if there's no power to the coil I'd start with the fundamentals like fuses, battery, bad connections.

it was an r1 loom.but as it was originally built for sprints and hill climbing all un necessary wires were removed. the lighting loom is all new and not r1

according to the electrical diagram there should be 12v on the coils - The power should go through the ignition main switch ( keys) then through a fuse then to the coils,( red & black cable) the orange and grey cables go to the ecu.

yeah, i spoke to auto electrician today and he said there should be battery voltage on red wire at coils but there is nothing. could it be starter solenoid? if so how do i check this? thanks ben

if its turning over I doubt its the starter. When you disconnected the second speedo there was a cable with a spade on that you didnt know what it did, can you do a continuity test on it to see if its the feed to coils

i have been assured that every conection on that speedo had nothing to do with engine but as soon as i touch it to ignition it turns all savage illuminations on. so i would imagine its a live. i was told that was the illumination for speedo though!

I would bet that removing that 12v has also removed the 12v from the coil, there is also 12v from the coil to the starting relay so that probably isn't clicking over either when you attempt to start it.

it started fine even before second speedo was added though and i think its just been tapped into a solid live leaving a spare tail. could i put a direct link from +ve on ignition direct to coil or is that not recommended?

anythings worth a try, ideally from the back of a fuse if you can. dont take off the current connections as they should still be connected to the relay which will be needed to start it

i cant help thinking its something i have done but all my engine wiring isout of reach and out of sight so dont think even i could have pulled something out. my dash is veypor vr2 which has a sealed wiring loom

Right, forget all the talk of R1 relays. Its not there. Its wired like a car so its not the usual stand or neutral switches. The starter solenoid is a Lucas unit as seen on Landies etc. A solid click should be heard wheb the start switch or whatever you use now is pushed. The engine will then turn over. I'm on the BB at the moment so can't remind myself what the R1 loom looks like but I seem to remember two or three wires. (Orange, grey and ?) coming from the ECU to the coils. You need to check power to the ECU off the plug. Its damn tight in there mind.

I'll check the R1 diag when I hit work and will be available if you want to give me a bell to try to work through it together.

TC

[Edited on 20/5/09 by TimC]

orange and grey wires do come from ecu but i think they produce pulses and not voltage. there should be battery voltage at coils but i have nothing

Yes, I"m sure you're right so check that power is getting to the ecu. You should then be able to say if the break is pre-ecu or at or beyond the ecu. This must be driving you nuts!

If its not getting power, I'd next see if the power is getting to the out-end of the old fuse box.

No fun at all.

all fuses are ok but its so tight in that footwell and all cables seem to run along top rail of scuttle so cant trace any of them! i dont have the experience i need to solve the problem i dont think.

Dan,
on the coils, you have 4 wires going in.
2 are red, 1 orange, 1 grey.
orange & grey come from ecu
reds should be 12v from ignition switch
via a fuse and (on the bike) a stop switch.

Have you got 12v at the red on the coils
when you switch the ignition on?

GeorgeM

Right.

You should be able to lie on your back with your feet over the roll bar and be able to unbolt the ecu. Unclip the plug and then use a multimeter to see what you have in terms of lives with the ignition on. If you have nowt....

Take out the fuses one at a time and put a pointy multimeter where the fuse was. Use a small mirror to help you see. Repeat this for each fuse.

Let me know what you learn. I can't believe that my wiring has been disturbed - its solered, heat-shrunk and taped up.

will try tim,thanks.
george, i have no vltage on red wires on coil input. spoke to gary who wires mnr's cars and he told me to check input voltage. i have nothing

Dan connect a 12v supply to the red
on the coils through a fuse. Pretty sure
the car will start

GeorgeM

Tim, you know the car better than anyone.
You havn't left the stop switch hidden
somewhere as an immobiliser have you??

GeorgeM

the car has a fia battery switch. then a key ignition then a start switch. i am also sure it will start but how have i lost voltage and should i be doubling up another fuse as its full at moment

Dan, not suggesting a permanent solution,
but at least we will know where the problem is!

just use a length of wire with an in line fuse
to test it

GeorgeM

[Edited on 20-5-09 by GeorgeM]

thanks george. your help today and yesterday is very much appreciated. if i catch you at a show i will buy you a beer.but only if your correct! lol.

I'm still intrigued about this loose wire.
You say it puts the savage lights on
when you touch it to where??

GeorgeM

if i remove ignition key barrel and connect to spare terminal.it lights up switches when key is turned

so when you put 12v on it through the
ignition it lilluminates the savage bulbs?
Sounds like it has been added to give
illumination for the 2nd speedo then.
I would tape it up for now so it can't touch
anything, then once everything is working
you can remove it if you wish. Can you
see where the other end of the wire is?

GeorgeM

i was told it was illumination and it is just twsted and taped on to a cable which goes into a conector block.

Ok - if its a connector block, its not from my loom. Having said that, I'm not sure where MNR took the live from for the lighting loom.

Ah-ha.... check each of the blade connections on the FIA master switch.. one of them goes to the coils!!!