Hello chaps, thought I'd introduce myself before I start bombarding the forum with technical questions!

Just bought a 5PW powered Vortx that could best be described as a project car...sort of a non-runner in as much as it wasn't entirely in one piece when I bought it but I've been assured it was running (badly) before. I guess time will tell.

It is cosmetically challenged too but it was cheap so hopefully decent value as a trackcar with limited road use. It's FFTS's old car from doing a bit of snooping; not sure if anyone knows it.

Anyway I have it back in one piece barring a few missing bolts so will be trying to start it tonight when I get some fuel and water in it. Electrics seem to be working and it's getting a spark so fingers crossed!

I know almost nothing about these cars yet so I expect I will have a few questions as I work on it. Anyone have a link to the build manual? It's an outboard suspension model built in 2005 I think.

Welcome to the forum

Get some photos up when you can

Just had a look at some of the pics on FFTS, whats your location it can help.

Yep, there are some pics on the "show us your vortx" thread that show the car in one piece. Not the best looking Vortx in the world to be honest but I bought it to drive it so won't worry too much about the looks just yet.

I'm in Peterborough but work in Bury St Edmunds which will be handy for visiting AB performance as I'm sure I will be doing fairly frequently!

Just drained, flushed and refilled the cooling system, chucked some fuel in and...it started on the first turn of the key Revved up to 7k then settled down and started popping and banging, at which point I turned it off and put down my fire extinguisher...

Sounds like a promising start

Welcome to the forum, I'm not to far from Peterborough & I'm running a 5pw in my Vortx so if you need any advice or spares I'll be able to help you out

Thanks Mark. I'm getting it MOTed this weekend hopefully so I'm sure I'll start discovering its faults as I start driving it!

Do you take yours on track or just use it on the road? On-track reliability is my main aim at the moment but I think I have a fairly good idea of what's required. Just wondering how well the cooling system will cope though...

I mainly used mini on the track, I've not had any problems with cooling yet with my polo rad

I think the fan only turned on once last year at a trackday but it was one of the hottest days of the year

Mine has a switch to turn on the fan manually, not sure if that means it wouldn't turn on automatically too though?

Just been out tinkering again and I'm having second thoughts about MOTing it this weekend! Think it needs a little more work as the indicators are hit and miss (it's the switch on the stalk playing up) and the speedo isn't working. It's also decided it's new idle speed is about 5k rpm now...previously it just shot up to that then came back down.

Sounds like throttle position sensor fault to me, I'm using mine for road mainly but I'm going to sneak in a few trackdays in for good measure! Are you running standard 5pw clocks if so then diagnostic mode built in mate

Not got the original clocks unfortunately; revotec gauges.

I just had a look at the power commander map. No idea at all what I'm doing with this but at idle it was showing the throttle position as 55%. I'm going to start a separate thread about this as I need to learn how to use the thing.

If in doubt disconnect the power commander & let it run off standard ecu, I've got plenty of maps that I have run if you want to play around with it

I'll give that a try tomorrow. Also downloaded a standard map to suit which I can try.

I'm wondering about the power commander reading a closed throttle as 55%...Could that indicate an issue with the TPS or has the map got messed up at some point? It seems to read consistent values for the throttle position so the TPS must work to some extent. I've recalibrated it so it now reads 0-100% again which seems to have helped but not cured the issue.

[Edited on 14/5/14 by T0MMY]

Turns out in addition to the PC being calibrated wrong, the idle was just set WAY too high! Car is now running nicely and, amazingly, passed it's MOT today with just advisory on the rear tyres and a couple of bulbs replaced.

This car is starting to look like a bit of a bargain as the issues it was meant to have have been very easy (and free) to fix so far. Just need to work on the clutch action now as it's a real pain in the arse to pull away at the moment.

quote:

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Originally posted by T0MMY
Just need to work on the clutch action now as it's a real pain in the arse to pull away at the moment.

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Thanks for that Cerbera, very interesting reading that. Seems like the revving issue was present for a long time on this car but it turned out to be a very easy fix! Curing that has also made it easier to use the clutch as it runs better low down so is less snatchy and prone to stalling but I think there is a more fundamental issue with the clutch set up.

I'm going to sort it even if it needs a whole new arrangement because this has the potential to be a very good car again; it's already transformed just by sorting out the mapping a bit and I drove for 3 trouble free hours today. I have a theory about it based on the fact it apparently has a locking clutch...could it be overweighted so the centrifugal force at higher revs makes it clamp too strongly? As I understand it you alter the clamping force by adding more weight. It pulls away ok at very low revs but trying to give it beans makes it too grabby...that seems to fit for me.

Anyway I'll have a look at the clutch tomorrow and see what's going on...the pivot point looks good as it's offering long pedal travel so a "wider" biting point.

Hi
This clutch mod may help


Clutch mod

This is our waterworks works fine road or track.


Waterworks R1 Indy

Good luck

Is it that the pedal is really light & your not getting much feel of the biting point? Has it had the double diaphragm spring modification? Well done on the mot pass as well mate, where did u take it? where abouts are you in Peterborough?

The clutch arm has already been extended, just a section welded in by the looks of it. The pedal feels very slightly "grabby" as you bring it up, presumably just the cable routing or lubrication, but I think the problem is more than that. It's not so much that you can't feel the biting point, more that it seems to have hardly any range of slip. Like FFTS said in that thread, it's either not engaged or fully engaged!

The best way to pull away is to bring it up infinitesimally slowly without giving it any revs at all in which case it gradually starts to move away at a snails pace at which point you can bring the clutch fully up then give it revs. You can also just give it a load of revs and dump it and it'll shoot off the line wheelspinning...basically FFTS described it quite well in his post. I'll take a look today and see what clutch arrangement it has, what is the double diaphragm spring modification?

Mark: I'm in Longthorpe but I got the car MOTed down in Graveley.

Ok, had a quick look through the oil filler hole and it doesn't look like a lock up clutch to me. It is definitely not the standard Yamaha arrangement though as it has springs rather than a spring plate so I think it's just a standard barnett clutch. From FFTS's post it seems it has very strong springs so I wonder if just weaker springs might sort it? Anyone tried different strength springs? Doesn't really seem that it would make much difference as the pedal weight is light anyway given the leverage it has.

Also, do you actually need to drop the oil to take off the clutch cover? The oil level is below the clutch so I don't see why you need to drain it but the manual seems to say you do.

[Edited on 17/5/14 by T0MMY]

on my old R1 car I ran a stock clutch but used 2 diaphram springs.
It made the clutch feel loads better. and no slip when I sold the car 8k miles later.

I tried the barnett uograde with 6 springs and it made the clutch really snatchy.

quote:

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Originally posted by gaz_gaz
on my old R1 car I ran a stock clutch but used 2 diaphram springs.
It made the clutch feel loads better. and no slip when I sold the car 8k miles later.

I tried the barnett uograde with 6 springs and it made the clutch really snatchy.

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I've got a spare standard clutch basket complete & a couple of spring plates if you want to give it a go? You don't need to drop the oil to change it but you will lose a very small amount. Might need to revert Back to a standard lever though & I'm sure I've got 1 of them somewhere as well

Might take you up on that Mark, thanks.

I've ordered a clutch cover gasket and the clutch lever shaft oil seal too as there's a leak from somewhere round there so I have to get in there anyway.