Hi,just starting my first build,ive decided i fancy a nice juicy duratec lump for my build,has any one ever used the duratec ST170 lump? as i know a
normal duratec can go roughly 220bhp quite easy,what about the 170? still able to use bike carbs etc?
Also whats the advantage of the duratec over the zetec? just lighter etc...
Also....great site! ive been on here reading for weeks! lol
Thanks
Right ,Duratec is out,as there about 1k, ive located a ST170engine 600quid posted to my door,do i go for that?
Or ive been talking to some1 who says a redtop might be easier work?
What gearbox etc do i use with a redtop vauxhall??
What do you think?? Red Top or ST170???
what power could i get out of both??
Lots of questions for you guys!
wheres hellfire ?
JAG ENGINE
Hi
whats wrong with the Mega Bike Engine
no no no no
BEC!!!!
Isn't the ST170 a Zetec engine?
All the engines you suggest work well in a 7 and all would typically be mated to a Ford type 9 g/box although mods are required to do this. The VX
red top engine would need a different bell housing to match the bolt patterns, but these are readily available.
quote:
Originally posted by nick205
Isn't the ST170 a Zetec engine?
All the engines you suggest work well in a 7 and all would typically be mated to a Ford type 9 g/box although mods are required to do this. The VX red top engine would need a different bell housing to match the bolt patterns, but these are readily available.
quote:
Originally posted by Kingacx
Engine.....which....
hey, isnt that the one which is 2 bike engines stuck together?
ST170 is a Zetec with variable valve timing. As previously said, it really depends upon what you want, how much u wanna spend etc. Red Top is good, as
they are plentiful (within reason), make very good power standard and probably wont require cat (pre-95). They do need a few mods to make 'em
reliable (nothing major) and you will need a new bellhousing (£100+). Zetec is much cheaper to purchase engine (from free upwards), and bolts straight
to Type-9. However, they do produce less grunt and require a lot more work for serious power (200bhp). Furthermore, early Zetecs (2.0) command a
premium as they wont require a cat.
Don't just think about the cost of the bare engine, as some may require a lot of other mods to fit in a 7 (eg Duratec). For cheap bang/buck, Red
Top would be hard to beat....
Finally, the best choice until last - a bike engine! Screaming soundtrack, cheap(ish), light weight and a free sequentila gearbox - what more could
you ask for!?
quote:
Originally posted by james h
hey, isnt that the one which is 2 bike engines stuck together?
. From memory the only bits from
the bike engine are the two busa cylinder heads, the rest is bespoke. 
to go with those stats. But if money were no object then.....
Would you need some trick electronics to make the variable cam timing of a ST170 Zetec work in a 7??
I seem to recall some people using the variable cam MGF engine and having a 2 position switch. Ie cam timing not truly variable but still able to
switch presumable between road and track modes.
I cat help thinking a true zetec with head work and decent fuel system would be similar cost and power and poss more reliable. (less tricky bits to go
wrong?)
quote:
Originally posted by DarrenW
Would you need some trick electronics to make the variable cam timing of a ST170 Zetec work in a 7??
I seem to recall some people using the variable cam MGF engine and having a 2 position switch. Ie cam timing not truly variable but still able to switch presumable between road and track modes.
I cat help thinking a true zetec with head work and decent fuel system would be similar cost and power and poss more reliable. (less tricky bits to go wrong?)
The Emerald ecu can apparently deal with VVC.
http://www.emeraldm3d.com/em_projects_VVC.html
I'm sure megasquirt/megajolt could be persuaded as well, but carb tuning might be 'entertaining' - you wouldn't be able to use the
switch on the dash hack in that case.
audi power, proper power!
Now that's the bugger to use! How I wish to build a car with something like that uner the bonnet.
quote:
Originally posted by Duncan_P
quote:
Originally posted by Kingacx
Engine.....which....
THIS ONE
Ultimate se7en engine?
[Edited on 19/7/07 by Duncan_P]
Most (all?) VVT systems just switch between 2 profiles at a certain RPM and Megasquirt can easily deal with this. If the timing was somehow genuinely 'variable' then it would be more difficult, but a clever person could probably make it work.
I had a conversation with dave walker about VVT and he reckoned vvt was all about emmissions, and nothing to do with performance, so i would have to
guess it would be possible to lock the cams at full advance, or as said have it switching on/off at a certain pre determined RPM. The engine in
question was this, its sat in a corner of my workshop waiting for the right chassis/body to live in. 
Al.
Description
Originally posted by matt_claydon
Most (all?) VVT systems just switch between 2 profiles at a certain RPM and Megasquirt can easily deal with this. If the timing was somehow genuinely
'variable' then it would be more difficult, but a clever person could probably make it work.
quote:
2.8 liters
88kg (Dry Weight)
450bhp (ish)
Thats not bad A red top is a good engine, personally if ur a first time builder a pinto is a nice easy start and will give u of fun. Bascily picking an engine you have to find 1 that is popular becuase parts and cheap and easy to come by and there will be loads of knowledge about the engines. Redtop or zetec are good.
Most of the VVC gear on the K series can be removed and more normal cams put in. A decent k can go to 200+ bhp with a VVC head with that done. If I remember right that is.
I thought the ST170 was a modifyed 5 cylinder Volvo engine?
Adrian
quote:
Originally posted by adithorp
I thought the ST170 was a modifyed 5 cylinder Volvo engine?
Adrian
right so im guessin the st170 isnt as straight forward as i thought!!
With the sounds of all this il go for a redtop i think,only think that put me off it before was the fact there all going to be 1324252miles on the
engines,an i was sure what box to use,but if you still use a type 9 thats ok as i have one
Lastly ,ive given up the idea of a bec in this one as there just to heavy,il wait an get an avon or something smaller to drop on into,otherwise il
sound daft when im using the car for everyday ish stuff an setting of with 8k of revs lol
thanks then guys,an tips on choosin a redtop??
Where in Doncaster are you, there's a few of us here if / when you need inspiration!
omg....how have i not seen your bright black n chrome car before??
I live in hatfield,but often in town and warmsworth
yours looks very nice btw
quote:
Originally posted by Kingacx
With the sounds of all this il go for a redtop i think,only think that put me off it before was the fact there all going to be 1324252miles on the engines,an i was sure what box to use,but if you still use a type 9 thats ok as i have one
I have a 90,000 mile redtop on throttle bodies, untouched internally, which makes 204hp and 168lbft of torque and the base engine (yes its the thin
end of the cost) was 200 quid.
Throttle bodies, ecu, dizzyless coilpack, air filter, manifold etc etc etc was 600 quid, used a s/h caterham hpc wet sump and the usual ally
bellhousing.
Went for this engine as I know they always make the power and I have several already.
Those that have been in the car will testify to the performance, I don't need to bother trying to sell that side of the deal!!
right....deffinatly going for a redtop,for the 600quid i was going to throw at a st170,i can throw into a redtop an get a nice juicy lump
But one thing i was thinking,is the wieght of the type9 box is not good im sure you'll agree,does anywhere do lightend housings?
What can i do to the redtop to reduce the weight?
cheers guys,legends!!
The redtop-XE bellhousings are alloy anyway - well all the ones I've seen are.
If you want to spend LOTS of money with quaife they'll supply you with an ally alloy type-9 too.
I've got a redtop in my phoenix and it does go rather well. I've recently put throttle bodies on it so i've got some carbs and a
megajolt already set up for an XE looking for a new home. (Ebay sale fell through a little while ago)...
what gives the best power an result out of the two? throttle bodies or the carbs?
Pro's n Cons?
Cheers
Id be interested in the 4age but not sure of the tunning levels you can take it too,im after over 200bhp which ever engine,anyone got any 4age tunning
advice? how much light than the redtop are they?
Thanks again
From the amount of fuel I'm having to put in I think my ITBs are producing more power than my carbs were. This is based on the required injector
flow rate calculations around the net. Not exactly scientific I know but i've not been to a rolling road yet because I think my injectors are too
small.
My carbs and megajolt setup were dyno'd at 180bhp, 156lbft at Northampton Motorsport.