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Author: Subject: Weight distribution
clutch_kick

posted on 11/10/06 at 04:42 PM Reply With Quote
Weight distribution

I'm still contemplating on the engine, I know a light setup is best but i was wondering how the Alfa 2.5 litre V6 engine would effect the car's (Vortx RT) weight distribution, and most importantly handling. Given that the weight of the engine without ancilliaries is around 138kgs, i'd use a Type 9 box. Engine won't realy remain in stock configuration, But will most probably have lightened/strengthened internals, for higher revs, higher compression, some headwork, and run on a haltech ECU. Stock intake will go, in favor of TB's.

Considering that braking will be well taken car of, and the car would need a relatively soft set-up due to my country's state-of-the-art roads, how do the handling Guru's envisage the car's handling? Any suggestions are welcome, so are different ideas.

it's either that V6 or a Busa engine. The V6 is cheaper

[Edited on 11/10/06 by clutch_kick]

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Krismc

posted on 11/10/06 at 04:52 PM Reply With Quote
big ian has a v8 in his and he has never complained about the handling so i persume it is still ok, wait a while and im sure he will comment further.

kris





Built, Ivaed, Drove and now Sold - 2011 MNR VORTX RT+ 2000cc Zetec on R1 Throttle boddies.

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v8kid

posted on 11/10/06 at 04:56 PM Reply With Quote
If the front and rear tyres are the same size a 50/50 weight distribution is about right. If you are OK with having rear tyres wider than the front there are significant advantages on smooth roads and with a skilled driver in having a 40/60 weight distribution.

If on the other hand not so able drivers have to be accomodated it reverses.

Hence road cars are generally nose heavy and race cars are tail heavy.

Good Luck!

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TimC

posted on 11/10/06 at 04:57 PM Reply With Quote
That'd sound lovely!

Sounds like an interesting route to take - why follow the crowd?

Good luck!






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clutch_kick

posted on 11/10/06 at 05:17 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
....If you are OK with having rear tyres wider than the front there are significant advantages on smooth roads and with a skilled driver in having a 40/60 weight distribution.


I was being sarcastic about our state-of the-art roads ..... they're realy crap!

[Edited on 11/10/06 by clutch_kick]

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smart51

posted on 11/10/06 at 05:31 PM Reply With Quote
Most sevens are about 50/50, with car engined cars being slightly front heavy and bike engined cars neutral or fractionally rear biased. Your V6 is about the same weight as a pinto and there are plenty of them about.

having more front end weight may help braking although a heavier car will make it worse. probably the same overall.

having more front weight will meal less traction at the rear. a bit.

There is loads of grip but with more weight at the front you'll start to lose grip slightly earler.

basically, you'll be fine.

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Agriv8

posted on 11/10/06 at 09:20 PM Reply With Quote
ohh nice engine.

I have driven a GTV with a 2.5 v6 and a 33 cloverleaf with a 3.0 v6. both were absoloute screamers Mr Clarksons rule of 3 fits well.

regarding the weight distribution in a Vortx you will have no problems I would suggest going inboard as the springs can be adjusted to get the ride spot on. can get mine with the v8 50/50 with me in the drivers seat.

MNr would require the engine and box for chassis finalisation.

extra costs or problems that may need to investigate. exhaust X 2, steering column. gearing final drive with type 9 ratio's

owt else give me a shout.

all the best Agriv8





Taller than your average Guy !
Management is like a tree of monkeys. - Those at the top look down and see a tree full of smiling faces. BUT Those at the bottom look up and see a tree full of a*seholes .............


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clutch_kick

posted on 12/10/06 at 03:23 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Agriv8
ohh nice engine.



Thanks

quote:
MNr would require the engine and box for chassis finalisation.


I'm sure there are plenty of donors running about the UK

quote:
extra costs or problems that may need to investigate. exhaust X 2


... I'll get that done locally by my mate.


quote:
steering column


... due to engine being in the way? Hmmm I did not think of that.

quote:
gearing final drive with type 9 ratio's


... working on it.

quote:
owt else give me a shout.


... better still I'll try and visit MNR this winter. But the company i fly for stops it's charter flights to Leeds/Bradford during the winter, and i'm too busy flying in summer.

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Agriv8

posted on 12/10/06 at 07:55 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by clutch_kickI'm sure there are plenty of donors running about the UK


... better still I'll try and visit MNR this winter. But the company i fly for stops it's charter flights to Leeds/Bradford during the winter, and i'm too busy flying in summer.



re the donners would still need gearbox and bellhousing v6 to type 9 as this will depict how far back MNR can get the engine.

if you do get over let me know or get marc or chris to contact me and if I am back on the road will take you out in the V8 wont rev like the alfa but makes all the right noises.

Regards

agriv8





Taller than your average Guy !
Management is like a tree of monkeys. - Those at the top look down and see a tree full of smiling faces. BUT Those at the bottom look up and see a tree full of a*seholes .............


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clutch_kick

posted on 12/10/06 at 10:13 PM Reply With Quote
There is a guy in the Forum, who built a viento with the 3.0 Litre V6 and a type9 box, so hopefully i can get some help from him, re the bellhousing. I don't fancy shipping an Engine and a Gearbox to the UK from Malta ... expensive!!

Although i will take a quick trip to scicily with the ferry to buy myself a spare V6, they are cheap there. Tune it up ... italian hillclimb style (9000 rpm limit, high comp., 300deg duration cams, smell of racing fuel,etc ... it's so nice to dream)

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Agriv8

posted on 13/10/06 at 07:51 AM Reply With Quote
Ahh missed the MALTA bit.

Sure there is a way to sort it

Regards Agriv8





Taller than your average Guy !
Management is like a tree of monkeys. - Those at the top look down and see a tree full of smiling faces. BUT Those at the bottom look up and see a tree full of a*seholes .............


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TimC

posted on 13/10/06 at 07:55 AM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Agriv8
re the donners would still need .....


How did we get onto kebabs?






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marc n

posted on 13/10/06 at 01:45 PM Reply With Quote
quote:

How did we get onto kebabs?





ideal world we would have the engine and gearbox so we can place all the mountings there no fabricating / making on the customers part, just bolt bits together
also when we mount the engine we can place the chassis on scales to get the perfect position for the weight distribution

[Edited on 13/10/06 by marc n]





please email rather than u2u
direct workshop email ( manned 8am till 6pm )
www.mnrltd.co.uk enquireys to :-
chrismnrltd@btinternet.com

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Agriv8

posted on 13/10/06 at 01:49 PM Reply With Quote


ok i cant spell or type

regards

Agriv8





Taller than your average Guy !
Management is like a tree of monkeys. - Those at the top look down and see a tree full of smiling faces. BUT Those at the bottom look up and see a tree full of a*seholes .............


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chockymonster

posted on 13/10/06 at 02:17 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Agriv8
ok i cant spell or type

regards

Agriv8


You forgot drive my car too





PLEASE NOTE - Responses on Forum Threads may contain Sarcasm and may not be suitable for the hard of Thinking.

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clutch_kick

posted on 13/10/06 at 04:33 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
ideal world we would have the engine and gearbox so we can place all the mountings there no fabricating / making on the customers part, just bolt bits together
also when we mount the engine we can place the chassis on scales to get the perfect position for the weight distribution

[Edited on 13/10/06 by marc n]


Well ... hopefully i can find a doner, well maybe just the engine, I won't be using the stock ECU anyway, and a Type 9 gearbox from the UK ... so that you can use it during the chassis fabrication.

I'm doing my best to visit you this winter i promise I just cannot find any flights to leeds/bradford in winter ... it will have to be manchester, and a whole lot of trains!!!

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iank

posted on 13/10/06 at 04:36 PM Reply With Quote
What about Newcastle or Middlesborough airports?
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clutch_kick

posted on 13/10/06 at 04:54 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by iank
What about Newcastle or Middlesborough airports?


yeah ... we fly to newcastle it seems on mondays and thursdays ..... but that means 4 days ... I was kind of hoping to limit it to 2 days.

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