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riddle
hellbent345 - 22/1/09 at 12:37 PM

i ask you,
if a tree falls in the woods and there is noone around to hear it, does it make a sound?


r1_pete - 22/1/09 at 12:40 PM

How do we know the tree fell if no one was around to witness it, or even hear it?


iank - 22/1/09 at 12:40 PM

Yes, unless it's a subatomic tree in which case Schroedinger gets involved.


cd.thomson - 22/1/09 at 12:41 PM

yes definitely:

Sound is vibration transmitted through a solid, liquid, or gas.

Doesnt matter if there are any people their to percieve it or not.


omega 24 v6 - 22/1/09 at 12:41 PM

Yes. All moving objects disturb air flow which creates noise. take into account also that the energy in the momentum of the falling tree will (some of it) be absorbed by the ground thas creating movement of particles and there again noise..


however how long is a piece of string??


hoots_min - 22/1/09 at 12:41 PM

sound is waves in air that has frequency and wavelength that our ears convert into sound in the brain. The further from the sound source we get the less intensity the noise has until the point that we could not hear it. However, if we had a suitable microphone and amplifier we could still discern the sound an infinite distance away. So my answer would be, yes it does make a sound, we may just not hear it.


omega0684 - 22/1/09 at 12:42 PM

simple answer is YES my friend


paul the 6th - 22/1/09 at 12:44 PM

surely, there are far more complicated things going on in the world to which all the philisophical brainpower could be applied.

yes it does.


omega 24 v6 - 22/1/09 at 12:44 PM

OH DEAR aren't we all in serious mode today


02GF74 - 22/1/09 at 12:45 PM

yes, but will it sound like a bark?


DarrenW - 22/1/09 at 12:46 PM

How can you prove it fell. maybe it was pushed..........


David Jenkins - 22/1/09 at 12:46 PM

If a man says something in a forest with no woman to hear him, is he still wrong?


hellbent345 - 22/1/09 at 12:50 PM

lol to the last, and a piece of string is quite simply, twice as long as from the middle to one end my friend.


Mr Whippy - 22/1/09 at 12:51 PM

There are some in the fields of research that think that the universe would not exist if not observed and I’ve read about some very strange experiments (for example Quantum entangled particles and the old slit experiment) that make it appear that the world operates in a very bizarre way when you look closely at it. Plus some theorists have got quite carried away with the Schrödinger's cat thing, read about it and you’ll see what I mean.

IMO the answers yes and these apparent oddities in physics and this whole observer thing is just due to a branch of physics yet to be discovered and once it has, these problems will all make sense. Rather like the effect of time slowing down at near lightspeed but not knowing about relativity would make it seem just as bizarre.

Here’s a Schrödinger's Cat linky that describes one of the oddest concepts in physics



[Edited on 22/1/09 by Mr Whippy]


Benzine - 22/1/09 at 12:54 PM

the wood might be in space


kipper - 22/1/09 at 12:57 PM

what would you rather be or a wasp?
Kipper.


DarrenW - 22/1/09 at 12:57 PM

personally i would be sceptical that the person who said they werent there wasnt actually there. Maybe they protest too much and have something to hide.


Mr Whippy - 22/1/09 at 01:03 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Benzine
the wood might be in space


you've been watching 'Alien' haven't you


David Jenkins - 22/1/09 at 01:04 PM

quote:
Originally posted by DarrenW
personally i would be sceptical that the person who said they werent there wasnt actually there. Maybe they protest too much and have something to hide.


Especially if they have an axe in their hands...


davie h - 22/1/09 at 01:15 PM

quote:
Originally posted by omega 24 v6

however how long is a piece of string??



twice as long as half its length

Davie


coozer - 22/1/09 at 01:18 PM

and, where does all the noise go? What about all the bombs and explosions in wars. Where does all the bangs go ???


paul the 6th - 22/1/09 at 01:27 PM

would you rather:

A) be a stain on the seat of john prescotts underpants

- OR -

B) be a stain on the front of john prescotts underpants

Which is it to be?


paul the 6th - 22/1/09 at 01:37 PM

and as for the cat, the answer is simple. 50-50-90


iank - 22/1/09 at 01:41 PM

quote:
Originally posted by coozer
and, where does all the noise go? What about all the bombs and explosions in wars. Where does all the bangs go ???


Either the arms companies are eco friendly and recycle the bangs into new bombs and missiles.

or they get converted to heat.

[Edited on 22/1/09 by iank]


Mr Whippy - 22/1/09 at 01:47 PM

quote:
Originally posted by coozer
and, where does all the noise go? What about all the bombs and explosions in wars. Where does all the bangs go ???


Noise is eventually turned into heat through the friction of everything it moves, the tree's, grass, buildings, even the sea. It’s a totally imperceptible amount of heating as it is so vastly spread out over a large area. Massive explosions like volcanoes produce sound waves that can travel several times round the world before the energy is absorbed. If the world was totally smooth like glass such big bangs would probably travel for days echoing around the globe.

[Edited on 22/1/09 by Mr Whippy]


Benzine - 22/1/09 at 01:59 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Mr Whippy
you've been watching 'Alien' haven't you


Dougal! We are not watching Aliens!

Bishops love sci-fi!


Rosco - 22/1/09 at 02:07 PM

Me thinks there are too many techy types on this forum - including me. But I shall attempt to switch off that side of my brain for a moment and focus on this being a riddle not a scientific problem.

Perhaps if "Tree Falls" is the name of a place the answer would be no.


02GF74 - 22/1/09 at 02:36 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Mr Whippy
There are some in the fields of research that think that the universe would not exist if not observed.


How would we know if we couldn't see it?

It is like the laws of physiscs - are they something fundamental or exist only because we observe their effect, come up with a theory then prove or displrove.

and what about numbers - again something fundamental to the fabric of everything or something again we observe and can theroise about?


scudderfish - 22/1/09 at 03:56 PM

How Long is a bay in Vietnam.


JoelP - 22/1/09 at 07:08 PM

it really depends if you define a sound as 'vibration of air molecules' or as 'a human's perception of air molecules vibrating'. If the former, than the falling tree does indeed make a sound. If the latter, then it doesnt (as no human percieved it).

Like the colour red is only red if observed, otherwise its just another batch of EM radiation and some given frequency.