chunkytfg
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| posted on 6/6/07 at 08:14 AM |
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Quick Dry sump question
Yes yes yes i know this has been covered many times before.
Am i right in saying the reasoning behind dry sumps in ZX12 and Busa lumps and not in R1's GSXR's etc is purely a question of cost?
R1 engines are redily avaliable for less than a grand where as busa's will set you back 3k?
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adamhay
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| posted on 6/6/07 at 08:32 AM |
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Certainly in the case of the Busa motor, it's because when the bike motor is put in a car, it is very susceptible to oil surge. If the Busa
engine loses oil pressure, even for a short spell, it can very easily damage the bearings, score the crank, and land you with a huge repair bill as
the crank can not be reground.
So, a dry sump, or on a smaller budget; a rotating pickup, protects the engine from the problems of oil surge.
As far as I know, R1, Blade, etc. motors are less susceptible to oil surge, and as such, do not require a dry sump. It's not a money thing -
after all, it would be stupid lunching one blade motor after another just because a reusable dry sumo system cost the price of one blade engine. You
may as well use a dry sump on the first engine and not have it blow up.
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chunkytfg
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| posted on 6/6/07 at 08:44 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by adamhay
Certainly in the case of the Busa motor, it's because when the bike motor is put in a car, it is very susceptible to oil surge. If the Busa
engine loses oil pressure, even for a short spell, it can very easily damage the bearings, score the crank, and land you with a huge repair bill as
the crank can not be reground.
So, a dry sump, or on a smaller budget; a rotating pickup, protects the engine from the problems of oil surge.
As far as I know, R1, Blade, etc. motors are less susceptible to oil surge, and as such, do not require a dry sump. It's not a money thing -
after all, it would be stupid lunching one blade motor after another just because a reusable dry sumo system cost the price of one blade engine. You
may as well use a dry sump on the first engine and not have it blow up.
fair enough i suppose
whats the cost of a dry sump kits and who makes them?(preferably online so i can chekc em out)
[Edited on 6/6/07 by chunkytfg]
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worX
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| posted on 6/6/07 at 08:49 AM |
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this is the first place I found when putting dry sump hayabusa in google!
I am sure there are more out there, but it'll give you an idea!
http://www.bigccracing.com/shop/product.asp?idproduct=90&source=thumb
Steve
edited to add - http://www.bigccracing.com/shop/product.asp?idproduct=204&source=thumb this is the only thing I can find on the ZX12R sump... (on
that site!)
[Edited on 6/6/07 by worX]
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chunkytfg
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| posted on 6/6/07 at 09:35 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by worX
this is the first place I found when putting dry sump hayabusa in google!
I am sure there are more out there, but it'll give you an idea!
http://www.bigccracing.com/shop/product.asp?idproduct=90&source=thumb
Steve
edited to add - http://www.bigccracing.com/shop/product.asp?idproduct=204&source=thumb this is the only thing I can find on the ZX12R sump... (on
that site!)
[Edited on 6/6/07 by worX]
cheers worX.
Not bothered about the ZX12 one as i'm going suzuki, it's who i'm brand loyal to. not to mention the fact i race motorbikes for a
suzuki dealership
PLus more cc's is better IMO
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adamhay
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| posted on 6/6/07 at 09:38 AM |
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It's not just the sump pan you need to think of . .. there's the scavenge pump, how it's powered, tanks, pipes, and everything else
you need.
Certainly, as far as a Busa is concerned, I would only use a dry sump that's driven off the water pump drive(seen several cases of belt driven
dry sump systems where the belt/pulley/bolt has failed - all motors were knackered). These water pump drive driven oil scavenge pumps necessitate a
seperate electric water pump and controller.
The rotating pick-ups are adequate in most circumstances but they do not work as well as a dry sump. And they are no good where high lateral G forces
are experienced, e.g. winged single seater sprint cars as they feed the oil pump directly, not via a big oil tank.
It would be easier to offer advice if you said what you have and how you are planning on using it
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chunkytfg
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| posted on 6/6/07 at 09:53 AM |
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Well at the moment i have a dream and a hope that that my bank manager will be kind to me
But as for plans i'm looking at a MNR vortX of some description.
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fesycresy
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| posted on 6/6/07 at 12:32 PM |
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Speak to Holeshot, they use a swinging pick up pipe and not a dry sump.
Lyn.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The sooner you fall behind, the more time you'll have to catch up.
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ChrisGamlin
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| posted on 6/6/07 at 12:32 PM |
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You also get a shallower engine if you fit a dry sump which may be the difference between needing a bonnet hole / bulge, or not.
[Edited on 6/6/07 by ChrisGamlin]
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chunkytfg
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| posted on 12/6/07 at 06:41 PM |
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Cheers guys.
Been speaking to a mate of mine who runs the car dyno at PDQ's over the weekend and have a few options to think about now.
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richard thomas
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| posted on 13/6/07 at 09:58 PM |
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I've been using a Powertec baffled sump for a year with no problems, but no track days either. For road use it's fine.
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matt_gsxr
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| posted on 14/6/07 at 04:59 PM |
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Has no-one mentioned that Pace
make dry sumps for these applications?
well let me be the first.
They have spruced up their website too, for what it is worth. Good to talk to for advice.
Matt
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