John Bonnett
|
| posted on 5/2/08 at 09:41 AM |
|
|
Anyone know of an Inline Gearbox for 205GTI
Year ago there was a Talbot with rearwheel drive, a derivative being the Sunbeam Lotus but since then I believe from memory that all PTS cars have
been either front or 4 wheel drive.
I just wondered if there is an available gearbox/bellhousing kit to enable such a lightweight engine to be used in a Seven for example. This train of
thought follows on from the BEC vs BAC(Boat Anchor Cars) in the Driving section. I know there are other lightweight engines such as the Rover but they
can be expensive as well as reliability issues. I've fitted the 1.6 205gti engine in the trials car and it is really impressive. It has occurred
to me that this engine might give some advantages of a BEC and take away the weight problems of a BAC.
So tapping into our impressive data base, can anyone point me in the direction of a Locost solution to rear driving from a front mounted 205gti
engine.
As alway, thank you in advance
John
|
|
|
|
|
whitestu
|
| posted on 5/2/08 at 10:00 AM |
|
|
Sumbeams used ond Hillman engines.
Possibly the peugeot 504 might fit?
I think the engines are leaned over too much to fit in a seven.
IMHO they aren't much good [in standard tune at any rate].
I had a 309 GTI and BX GTI and they weren't very quick.
Stu
|
|
|
TimC
|
| posted on 5/2/08 at 10:06 AM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by whitestu
I had a 309 GTI... weren't very quick.
Stu
Not a rocket ship in a straight line but could carry serious speed in the twisties!!
|
|
|
nick205
|
| posted on 5/2/08 at 10:11 AM |
|
|
This comes up regularly on here.
The simple answer is no, there isn't a readily available gear box or off the shelf bell housing/adapter. It has been done however and there was
a one off fabricated bell housing floating around on Ebay no too long ago.
The Peugeot XU engines are undoubtedly light and have very good power as standard with a good base of tuning knowledge and parts available.
But....they are very tall engines, hence why they are generally laid back by around 30 degrees in the 205/309/405 etc. If you followed this
installation in a RWD set-up, particularly in a 7, then the exhaust manifold and steering column would be a PITA to get right. Although the standard
intake and injection system would almost certainly fit under a 7 bonnet (unlike Ford systems) as it all sits below the level of the cam cover in
it's native installation. On top of that there are myths about oil surge, particularly with Mi16 engines, although this is easily overcome with
re-worked sumps and/or dry sumps (£££).
On paper, as you say, the engines are very well suited to the 7 type car. In reality I suspect the practicalities and increased cost prevent most
from attempting this route. Particularly when you look at the power to weight and ease of use of bike engines and all alloy car engines like the
Duratec.
All said though I would still like to see it done just because I have a real soft spot for the engines 
Concur with TimC - these cars weren't about straight line speed (although they were quicker than most in their day) it was all about the
complete package of handling, speed and driver involvement. I miss my 205's every day 
Edit to say...
I'll bet you were wondering about the "205" bit of my username weren't you 
[Edited on 5/2/08 by nick205]
[Edited on 5/2/08 by nick205]
|
|
|
John Bonnett
|
| posted on 5/2/08 at 10:25 AM |
|
|
Thank you Nick for your very concise and complete answer. The Duratec is a superb engine probably better in every respect than the XU but as you, I
have really good memories of my Peugeot days and my thoughts were probably prompted by nostalgia.
Thank you for taking the time to reply.
ATB
John
|
|
|
dhutch
|
| posted on 5/2/08 at 10:27 AM |
|
|
As a 306 owner (1.6 tu first, now 1.8 xu) i can say i like it.
- And 2l Gti6 engines have a fair bit of poke if you can afford the insurence.
I did wonder for about 3seconds why i'd not heard of anyone use one in a locost.
- Then i drew a total blank trying to come up with rwd pugs, and droped the thought!
Im sure it can be done. But maybe its not worth it.
Ive never really considered the size eather, but the xu does fill up a lot more engine bay than the tu did.
Daniel
|
|
|
Memphis Twin
|
| posted on 5/2/08 at 11:22 AM |
|
|
There's a guy up in Yorkshire who's used the 16v Citroen/Peugot engine in his Sylva Striker, and has had great success in sprints and
hillclimbs, generally with times as quick, if not quicker than the fastest roadgoing BEC cars.
Wish I could remember his name...
I'm sure he used a Ford gearbox with adaptor plate. IIRC he started off with the 1.6 8valve engine (heavily modified of course!) before
upgrading to the 2litre.
Chris and Anthony Happer - I knew I'd remember in the end...
[Edited on 5/2/08 by Memphis Twin]
[Edited on 5/2/08 by Memphis Twin]
|
|
|
DarrenW
|
| posted on 5/2/08 at 11:48 AM |
|
|
I bet mooky knows who the yorkshire guy is. Might also get a name if you look at the Harewood hill climb website.
|
|
|
PhilCross66
|
| posted on 5/2/08 at 01:23 PM |
|
|
I thought there was some rear wheel drive van that used a peugeot motor that had a bellhousing that would fit. Im sure someone will know it.
|
|
|
procomp
|
| posted on 5/2/08 at 01:30 PM |
|
|
Hi Shenpar where the guys who where doing a RWD conversion kit with ford G/box if i remember.
But the engine needed to be dry sumped to get it to survive. The wet sump version they did kept suffering with oil problems at speed round
circuits.
And we had tried the MI16 unit but no success in rwd format round circuits. Unless fully speced and dry sumped. But by that time a ford unit was
easier to install and use with same power.
Cheers Matt
|
|
|
PerS
|
| posted on 5/2/08 at 02:33 PM |
|
|
Copied (and translated) from the Swedish Locost forum:
"A gearbox from a Rover SD-1 will fit bolt on with a bellhousing from a LDV-Pilot diesel (brittish van)"
Per
Per
|
|
|
Danozeman
|
| posted on 5/2/08 at 04:59 PM |
|
|
You want a gear box from an ldv pilot or later 200 series. They use the Peugeot XUD. The bolt patern is iirc the same for petrol xu and diesel xu as
they are the same block. They have an easily modified gear shift aswell and arnt that bigger box. IIRC you can use the diesel flywheel and clutch
and it mates straight up. Just get the flywheel lightened as theyr quite heavy,.
The bell housings come off so could be modified for a different box also.
Theres loads in breakers. Look for ones with yellow stripes down the side and a crown on. The the rear floors of the early pilots rot away.
AS already said the XU is a big engine in terms of space it needs as it leans over alot and apparantly they wont run very well if theyr mounted
upright. They are very tall upright also. I have looked into this as i work on pilots all day as im a Post office mechanic.
[Edited on 5/2/08 by Danozeman]
Dan
Built the purple peril!! Let the modifications begin!!
http://www.eastangliankitcars.co.uk
|
|
|
minordelay
|
| posted on 5/2/08 at 05:10 PM |
|
|
Sherpa gearbox as used in the 200 series with the pug diesel engine will do the trick. I think it's a r380 if you are lucky otherwise it will be
the earlier rover box.
Cheers
|
|
|
MikeRJ
|
| posted on 5/2/08 at 08:59 PM |
|
|
The diesel box ratios will probably not be well suited to an Mi16 engine though...
|
|
|
Danozeman
|
| posted on 7/2/08 at 06:21 AM |
|
|
quote:
The diesel box ratios will probably not be well suited to an Mi16 engine though...
1st gear will get you off the line quickly..
Im actually putting a clutch in a Pilot aswe speak. Any info wanted get in quick..
Dan
Built the purple peril!! Let the modifications begin!!
http://www.eastangliankitcars.co.uk
|
|
|
NS Dev
|
| posted on 7/2/08 at 02:46 PM |
|
|
Flowtech used to make an alloy bellhousing to bolt the pug engine to ford type 9 box. The 8v pug used to be the engine to have in hot rod oval racing
before they allowed 16v motors.
One went on ebay a couple of weeks ago for around £200 iirc.
unfortunately Flowtech went bust ages ago so you can't get them new.
Retro RWD is the way forward...........automotive fabrication, car restoration, sheetmetal work, engine conversion
retro car restoration and tuning
|
|
|
phil clegg
|
| posted on 12/2/08 at 06:08 PM |
|
|
gearbox
i have been told the xud is same bolt pattern,this means sherpa with xud inline box should fit also tata has xud inline,ratios might be low ,,phil
|
|
|
.JPG)
