BaileyPerformance
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| posted on 23/11/13 at 11:47 PM |
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Zetec turbo big BHP
Hi all,
We have been developing a full race zetec turbo for a customer who has it installed in a Escort RS Turbo.
Mapping not complete yet as we have a spark blow out issue that we temporarily fixed by closing the plug gaps, at 1.8BAR of boost the car made 462BHP
and over 380lb/ft tq, still pulling at 7K.
We need to install a better ignition system so we can revert back to 1.1mm plug gaps from the 0.8mm we have set now, we intend to run at least 2BAR of
boost and we are hoping to see over 500BHP, probably more if we optimize the cam timing as we have it set at standard at the mo.
Brief spec....
2.0L silvertop
ported head on standard valves
N/A rally cams
Jenvey inlet with custom plenum
625cc injectors
4.5BAR weber alpha FPR
MS2 extra code
The car idles a little high (1000rpm) and is slightly lumpy but can be driven around like a shopping car, starts well from cold and should give
reasonable MPG if driven normally. When you boot it it is very very quick, spinning the wheels at speed in top gear!
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NigeEss
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 01:03 AM |
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Nice 
Is the bottom end good enough for that amount of grunt or is it beefed up ?
Time is an illusion. Lunchtime doubly so.................Douglas Adams.
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jeffw
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 07:33 AM |
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Have you changed the pistons and rods?
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bi22le
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 08:50 AM |
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Spill the beans, stick bottom?
I was talking to a guy at llangdow this year that had a stock zetec with a rotrex. He was running abot 250bhp whixh is no biggie on a stock bottom but
surely ypur brave tobe knocking on for twice that with ne Iissues. Reduction in CR must be a minimum to prevent pre det at 2 bar?
Track days ARE the best thing since sliced bread, until I get a supercharger that is!
Please read my ring story:
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/forum/13/viewthread.php?tid=139152&page=1
Me doing a sub 56sec lap around Brands Indy. I need a geo set up! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EHksfvIGB3I
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beaver34
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 08:54 AM |
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Impressive, is it dry stumped, and what's it revving to?
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six mad
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 09:18 AM |
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I would guess fully forged at this power and a BIG turbo
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imp paul
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 09:36 AM |
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it sounds like a nice engine ,hope you manage to get to your target spec, but from memmory rs turbo gear boxs are a pile of cheese lol a pal of mine
killed more than a few lol 
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CNHSS1
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 09:38 AM |
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Its common on cossie YBs and the nissan engines im used to, to run narrower plug gaps on race engines. I run 25thou from the oem 1.1mm (38 thou
iirc). Cant see any real detriment to running narrower gaps, its not as if a 500hp motor is likely to give great mpg or emissions anyway lol
"Racing is life, everything else, before or after, is just waiting"---Steve McQueen
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BaileyPerformance
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 11:43 AM |
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Thanks for the interest, full spec as follows....
Standard crank and rods, forged pistons
7.5/1cr
standard oil pump
fully synthetic 10/50 morris's oil
standard sump
GT3071R turbo with custom 3" exhaust
Peak power at 6100RPM, rev limit 7350RPM, peak torque around 5500RPM
Running 1.8BAR at the mo, which is low boost for 460BHP, my cosworth YB runs 28-30PSI and makes 360BHP so the zetec is far more efficient than a stock
YB.
hoping to see over 500BHP when the ignition is sorted out and we have optimised the cam timing ;-)
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coozer
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 11:53 AM |
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Just my kind of motor, keep at it!
1972 V8 Jago
1980 Z750
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six mad
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 12:08 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by BaileyPerformance
Thanks for the interest, full spec as follows....
Standard crank and rods, forged pistons
7.5/1cr
standard oil pump
fully synthetic 10/50 morris's oil
standard sump
GT3071R turbo with custom 3" exhaust
Peak power at 6100RPM, rev limit 7350RPM, peak torque around 5500RPM
Running 1.8BAR at the mo, which is low boost for 460BHP, my cosworth YB runs 28-30PSI and makes 360BHP so the zetec is far more efficient than a stock
YB.
hoping to see over 500BHP when the ignition is sorted out and we have optimised the cam timing ;-)
WOW  Standard Rods Thats amazing, are they that good stock. Have you had previous
experience of what the rods can take?
What torque is it making?
[Edited on 24/11/13 by six mad]
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BaileyPerformance
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 12:10 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by CNHSS1
Its common on cossie YBs and the nissan engines im used to, to run narrower plug gaps on race engines. I run 25thou from the oem 1.1mm (38 thou
iirc). Cant see any real detriment to running narrower gaps, its not as if a 500hp motor is likely to give great mpg or emissions anyway lol
Your right, most factory ignition systems do not have enough energy to fire at very high cylinder pressures - so the way around this was to close up
the plug gaps. The problem is this will effect idle and part throttle, also in some cases the top end power - the bigger the plug gap the better
assuming the ignition can handle it.
My own 3 door cosworth runs 28PSI of boost on megasquirt with MSD coilpack and MSD DIS4 multispark driver, i'm using BCPR8E plugs (very hard)
set at 1.1mm without spark blowout.
We intend to install MSD on the RS Turbo and revert back to stock plug gaps but with 2 grades harder plugs, with MSD there is no need to worry about
fouled plugs.
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NOTE:This user is registered as a LocostBuilders trader and may offer commercial services to other users
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bi22le
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 12:14 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by BaileyPerformance
Thanks for the interest, full spec as follows....
Standard crank and rods, forged pistons
7.5/1cr
standard oil pump
fully synthetic 10/50 morris's oil
standard sump
GT3071R turbo with custom 3" exhaust
Peak power at 6100RPM, rev limit 7350RPM, peak torque around 5500RPM
Running 1.8BAR at the mo, which is low boost for 460BHP, my cosworth YB runs 28-30PSI and makes 360BHP so the zetec is far more efficient than a stock
YB.
hoping to see over 500BHP when the ignition is sorted out and we have optimised the cam timing ;-)
OoO 7.5:1 CR and a turbo to suck in small children, boggier than your average serial killers burying ground!!
FWD I hope to? Im still a Ford man at heart, many back to back years at Ford Fiar and still love the way you guys push the boundaries. Ford fans are
definatly not stuck in the past.
Keep it up.
Track days ARE the best thing since sliced bread, until I get a supercharger that is!
Please read my ring story:
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/forum/13/viewthread.php?tid=139152&page=1
Me doing a sub 56sec lap around Brands Indy. I need a geo set up! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EHksfvIGB3I
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BaileyPerformance
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 12:22 PM |
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WOW Standard Rods Thats amazing, are they that good stock. Have you had previous
experience of what the rods can take?
What torque is it making?
[Edited on 24/11/13 by six mad]
Yep, stock rods, we have seen over 400lb/ft on standard slivertop rods without and issue, we do use HD bearing and our engine builder is very very
careful when building these motors, that has alot to do with it.
Also, oil is very important, it needs to be thick to maintain oil pressure at high RPM and load with a hot engine.
Its worth noting that the customer makes full use of the power, he texted me this morning to say the car smokes the tyres 5th at 120mph, straight to
the 7350rpm limiter!
He now needs to work on the suspension and transmission, the standard IB5 RS Turbo box will probably die soon.
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coozer
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 12:30 PM |
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Curious, can you give us a ball park price to build the motor?
1972 V8 Jago
1980 Z750
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ashg
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 12:32 PM |
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just stick a saab b234 in it. it will make that power with a turbo and some injectors
good going for a zetec though
have you tried the ls truck coils they are meant to provide plenty of power especially if you move to sequential.
[Edited on 24/11/2013 by ashg]
Anything With Tits or Wheels Will cost you MONEY!!
Haynes Roadster (Finished)
Exocet (Finished & Sold)
New Project (Started)
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BaileyPerformance
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 01:09 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by ashg
just stick a saab b234 in it. it will make that power with a turbo and some injectors
good going for a zetec though
have you tried the ls truck coils they are meant to provide plenty of power especially if you move to sequential.
[Edited on 24/11/2013 by ashg]
The saab motor will make same sort of power but you would need more boost to do it, the good thing about this build is it makes loads of power for the
boost its running, years ago it was normal to run 36PSI on a cosworth YB to see 500BHP.
We are already running an MSD coilpack and leads, i had assumed this would be enough as we are running 5mS of dwell too.
The LS coils have about the same output as the MSD coilpack, we are getting misfires around peak torque (which makes sense) so at that RPM there is
plenty of time to charge the the coils so sequential would not help.
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Proby
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 01:13 PM |
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Blimey, that sounds like a right handful!! Impressive.
Visit GraphicMonster
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BaileyPerformance
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 01:20 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by coozer
Curious, can you give us a ball park price to build the motor?
I'm converting a westfield to turbo zetec at the moment, not quite as higher spec as the RS Turbo but will make around 320bhp.
I will ask the owner if i can post here the details, probably more applicable to locost than the RS Turbo conversion.
Anyway, just the basic engine (without any bolt on bits) is £3500 for that you get steel rods, forged pistons, piper cams, fully ported head, ARP
everywhere, good for 500BHP
The inlet, turbo, exhaust, ecu and mapping is extra and depends on the car it is to be installed in.
Just as a rough estimate the complete conversion is a locost would be around £7500 fitted including high pressure fuel system, clutch and exhaust.
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six mad
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 02:40 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by BaileyPerformance
quote:
Originally posted by coozer
Curious, can you give us a ball park price to build the motor?
I'm converting a westfield to turbo zetec at the moment, not quite as higher spec as the RS Turbo but will make around 320bhp.
I will ask the owner if i can post here the details, probably more applicable to locost than the RS Turbo conversion.
Anyway, just the basic engine (without any bolt on bits) is £3500 for that you get steel rods, forged pistons, piper cams, fully ported head, ARP
everywhere, good for 500BHP
The inlet, turbo, exhaust, ecu and mapping is extra and depends on the car it is to be installed in.
Just as a rough estimate the complete conversion is a locost would be around £7500 fitted including high pressure fuel system, clutch and exhaust.
How much is a bare short engine build without the rods and forged pistons?
[Edited on 24/11/13 by six mad]
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BaileyPerformance
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 04:51 PM |
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How much is a bare short engine build without the rods and forged pistons?
[Edited on 24/11/13 by six mad]
Do you mean a stock motor?
we wouldnt normally build an engine with stock internals, when we have been asked to do a conversion upto 250BHP we just get a complete second hand
engine from the scrap yard and use that.
i would think a stock short motor rebuild would be around £700
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six mad
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 06:19 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by BaileyPerformance
How much is a bare short engine build without the rods and forged pistons?
[Edited on 24/11/13 by six mad]
Do you mean a stock motor?
we wouldnt normally build an engine with stock internals, when we have been asked to do a conversion upto 250BHP we just get a complete second hand
engine from the scrap yard and use that.
i would think a stock short motor rebuild would be around £700
Apologies for been unclear.
What i mean is if I bring you a short motor how much would the short motor cost to build
as per your post. With the hd bearings and forged pistons, but using the standard crank and rods?
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beaver34
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| posted on 24/11/13 at 09:42 PM |
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Have you got a graph for this engine?
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BaileyPerformance
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| posted on 25/11/13 at 03:44 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by beaver34
Have you got a graph for this engine?
if someone can tell me how to post a pdf i will post the dyno printout ;-0
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ludsonline
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| posted on 29/11/13 at 02:06 PM |
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Do a screen dump of the PDF and save it as an image file.
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.JPG)
