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cataclean liquid
jacko - 3/3/14 at 04:17 PM

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Cataclean-Catalytic-Converter-Cleaning-Treatment/dp/B002BVXM92

Do these cleaners work or are they snake oil
Thanks
Jacko

britishtrident - 3/3/14 at 04:45 PM

Two well known ways to clean a cat either add a couple of litres of cellulose thinners to the tank and take the car out for a good hard drive or take the cat off and physically wash it.


If you. do a Google you will find info on both methods..

DW100 - 3/3/14 at 05:00 PM

Not sure I would want to put cellulose thinners in the tank. The potential for damage far out ways the cost of a new catalytic converter.

Have you actually got any real evidence for this? Other than some lunatic that has put some in his car and can't really be sure but thinks it may of helped?


What car is it? and why do you think it needs cleaning?

renetom - 3/3/14 at 05:49 PM

Hi
We failed our 1st IVA on emmisions with all new parts, took it to Austec Racing who detuned it
as much as possible & managed to get it close, they said that it was all they could do.
stuck a bottle of cataclean in the tank , closed the air intake to the AIS system & it sailed through the IVA
was it the cataclean or what ????? , I will never know,
Give it a whirl. its only money
Good luck

jacko - 3/3/14 at 05:59 PM

quote:
Originally posted by DW100
Not sure I would want to put cellulose thinners in the tank. The potential for damage far out ways the cost of a new catalytic converter.

Have you actually got any real evidence for this? Other than some lunatic that has put some in his car and can't really be sure but thinks it may of helped?


What car is it? and why do you think it needs cleaning?


Its a old 1000cc corsa its the original cat on the car but the light keeps coming on codes say its the lambda sender
The thing is we are getting rid of the car in a few weeks so don't want to spend money on the car
It is a good car for say a new driver apart from the above
Jacko

johnemms - 3/3/14 at 06:29 PM

Will lower emissions for MOT - you should only have a few gallons in tank for it to work..
However IVA needs a full tank of fuel - so no good for IVA really ..

ian locostzx9rc2 - 3/3/14 at 06:32 PM

Check for air leaks around the inlet manifold and throttle body as there may not be a O2 sensor issue.....

britishtrident - 3/3/14 at 08:44 PM

quote:
Originally posted by jacko
quote:
Originally posted by DW100
Not sure I would want to put cellulose thinners in the tank. The potential for damage far out ways the cost of a new catalytic converter.

Have you actually got any real evidence for this? Other than some lunatic that has put some in his car and can't really be sure but thinks it may of helped?


What car is it? and why do you think it needs cleaning?


Its a old 1000cc corsa its the original cat on the car but the light keeps coming on codes say its the lambda sender
The thing is we are getting rid of the car in a few weeks so don't want to spend money on the car
It is a good car for say a new driver apart from the above
Jacko



It sounds like the sensor has just reached the end of its life and has got old and too slow to respond.
However Corsa are prone to wiring & connection problems with the Lambda sensors.
Visual check on the wiring. and check inlet and exhaust for leaks.
What code is being generated ?
If it isn' a lambda heater circui or failure you need to look at the live data stream from the sensor.? The signal from upstream lambda should switch from about 0.2 volt to 0.8 volt and back at least once per second. Your engines ECU checks this signal by taking a count of the number of high to low changes that take place in the first mile or so once the car warms up and switches to closed loop control.
Lambda sensors get slower as they get older. so eventually fail the test.
In contrast the signal from the downstream lambda sensor (if fitted) should only change slowly and should not follow the the high low pattern of the upstream sensor.

britishtrident - 3/3/14 at 09:03 PM

quote:
Originally posted by DW100
Not sure I would want to put cellulose thinners in the tank. The potential for damage far out ways the cost of a new catalytic converter.

Have you actually got any real evidence for this? Other than some lunatic that has put some in his car and can't really be sure but thinks it may of helped?


What car is it? and why do you think it needs cleaning?


Thinners is basically Tolulene. adding it to the fuel raises the operating temperature of the cat regenerating it by burning off deposits.
Tolulene was used by Honda F1 as a fuel it has an Octane Number of 121 RON. 107 RON
It has been illegally added in large percentages to roadside petrol in Australia to avoid fuel duty.

perksy - 3/3/14 at 09:19 PM

Chap at work had an engine management light come on in his Volvo.

Read the codes it showed a Catalytic converter issue, Checked the live data and the pre and post sensors seemed ok.

Reset the light and put a bottle of Cataclean in it and told him to take it for a good run on the local motorway.

No more issues at present, so hopefully all now ok, He did say that his missus does a lot of stop start driving and the car never gets that much use.

nick205 - 3/3/14 at 11:04 PM

I haven't looked, but what's actually in Cataclean...cellulose thinners or similar by any chance...?

mark chandler - 4/3/14 at 08:28 AM

quote:
Originally posted by britishtrident
quote:
Originally posted by DW100
Not sure I would want to put cellulose thinners in the tank. The potential for damage far out ways the cost of a new catalytic converter.

Have you actually got any real evidence for this? Other than some lunatic that has put some in his car and can't really be sure but thinks it may of helped?


What car is it? and why do you think it needs cleaning?


Thinners is basically Tolulene. adding it to the fuel raises the operating temperature of the cat regenerating it by burning off deposits.
Tolulene was used by Honda F1 as a fuel it has an Octane Number of 121 RON. 107 RON
It has been illegally added in large percentages to roadside petrol in Australia to avoid fuel duty.


Interesting, it then follows that if I blend in 20% I could run more boost? What's the downside, overheated pistons and burnt valves?

Thanks Mark

DW100 - 4/3/14 at 08:42 AM

If you google Cellulose thinners safety Data sheets, it lists key ingredients. This seems to vary from brand to brand, many do not contain any Toluene at all.

I do a lot diagnostics for other garages. Sorting out issues other can't. Post the actual fault codes and I'll try to help you sort it out properly.

britishtrident - 4/3/14 at 09:12 AM

quote:
Originally posted by DW100
If you google Cellulose thinners safety Data sheets, it lists key ingredients. This seems to vary from brand to brand, many do not contain any Toluene at all.

I do a lot diagnostics for other garages. Sorting out issues other can't. Post the actual fault codes and I'll try to help you sort it out properly.


xylene (acetone) has much the same effect.

DW100 - 4/3/14 at 09:58 AM

If you search Google far enough I'm sure you'll find a chap who swears that wearing a green sock on his left foot on a Tuesday cured the fault with his car and therefore all faults with all cars can be cured by wearing a green sock on the appropriate day.

Back in the real world we plug in a code reader. Code readers are dumb! They DO NOT do any diagnosis! They are not a magic machine!!!

What you get is the CARS best guess at what is wrong with it.

This may be the actual fault or just a symptom.

It is the technicians job to take these fault codes, interpret them, and test to check the actual fault.


I've seen many occasions when thousands of pounds have been wasted on guessing at a fault.

britishtrident - 4/3/14 at 11:08 AM

quote:
Originally posted by mark chandler
quote:
Originally posted by britishtrident
quote:
Originally posted by DW100
Not sure I would want to put cellulose thinners in the tank. The potential for damage far out ways the cost of a new catalytic converter.

Have you actually got any real evidence for this? Other than some lunatic that has put some in his car and can't really be sure but thinks it may of helped?


What car is it? and why do you think it needs cleaning?


Thinners is basically Tolulene. adding it to the fuel raises the operating temperature of the cat regenerating it by burning off deposits.
Tolulene was used by Honda F1 as a fuel it has an Octane Number of 121 RON. 107 RON
It has been illegally added in large percentages to roadside petrol in Australia to avoid fuel duty.


Interesting, it then follows that if I blend in 20% I could run more boost? What's the downside, overheated pistons and burnt valves?

Thanks Mark


4% should give a an increase in RON of 1 although the effect deminishes as the percentage increases, the downsides are it doesn't lubricate as well as petrol, cold starts are difficult, and it is a powerful solvent but modern pump petrol is a fairly powerful solvent even compared to the petrol of 20 years ago.

To illustrate the coldbstarting issue at the end of WW2 my uncle and my father shared ownership of a. jag SS100, my uncle a a PO mechanic on MTBs obtained some 107 octane aviation fuel intended for the. V12 aero engines in the MTBs . The Jag just would not start th the high octane fuel in it until it was well diluted with pool petrol.

AndyW - 4/3/14 at 11:36 AM

quote:
Originally posted by DW100
If you search Google far enough I'm sure you'll find a chap who swears that wearing a green sock on his left foot on a Tuesday cured the fault with his car and therefore all faults with all cars can be cured by wearing a green sock on the appropriate day.

Back in the real world we plug in a code reader. Code readers are dumb! They DO NOT do any diagnosis! They are not a magic machine!!!

What you get is the CARS best guess at what is wrong with it.

This may be the actual fault or just a symptom.

It is the technicians job to take these fault codes, interpret them, and test to check the actual fault.


I've seen many occasions when thousands of pounds have been wasted on guessing at a fault.


Back in the day when I worked for Vauxhall technical, that is exactly what was taught. Code reader gives an indication of fault, then its down to the technician to find the actual fault. Fault code just gives a good idea of where to start. I have fixed many a fault which had wiring problems and not the actual sensor.

Good luck and hope you get it sorted.

DW100 - 4/3/14 at 11:48 AM

quote:
Originally posted by AndyW
quote:
Originally posted by DW100
If you search Google far enough I'm sure you'll find a chap who swears that wearing a green sock on his left foot on a Tuesday cured the fault with his car and therefore all faults with all cars can be cured by wearing a green sock on the appropriate day.

Back in the real world we plug in a code reader. Code readers are dumb! They DO NOT do any diagnosis! They are not a magic machine!!!

What you get is the CARS best guess at what is wrong with it.

This may be the actual fault or just a symptom.

It is the technicians job to take these fault codes, interpret them, and test to check the actual fault.


I've seen many occasions when thousands of pounds have been wasted on guessing at a fault.


Back in the day when I worked for Vauxhall technical, that is exactly what was taught. Code reader gives an indication of fault, then its down to the technician to find the actual fault. Fault code just gives a good idea of where to start. I have fixed many a fault which had wiring problems and not the actual sensor.

Good luck and hope you get it sorted.


Keeping to the original post. Just because it is logging a Lambda sensor code doesn't mean it is a lambda sensor fault. It could be something simple like a wiring fault, a blown fuse, or an air leak. The ECU has logged a code because something is happening that is outside the values it is expecting.

Post the actual fault code and we can start to guide you to the actual cause.

[Edited on 4/3/14 by DW100]

[Edited on 4/3/14 by DW100]

Mr Whippy - 4/3/14 at 12:09 PM

cataclean does work but not always depending on what's wrong with the car. Used it before and it then passed no problem, following year nothing worked and scrapped the car.

jacko - 4/3/14 at 12:31 PM

This is all very interesting about using thinners etc
The problem i have at the moment is my make did the test for me and i am on sick so can't get the code until i get back to work
he did say it comes up as lamber censer.
WE are getting rid of the car soon so its not to important but i was just thinking of trying catclean to see if it helped /stop the light coming on
What i have found it comes on more when we are in a lot of traffic give the engine a good rev and the light goes out.
Its been like this for about a year or so and has passed MOT's like this
By the way its a 1998 1000cc coras B
Thanks for any help
Jacko

britishtrident - 4/3/14 at 02:04 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Mr Whippy
cataclean does work but not always depending on what's wrong with the car. Used it before and it then passed no problem, following year nothing worked and scrapped the car.


I don't know if your car has one or 2 lambda sensors, modern cars have 2 but many older models may only have 1.
The fault codes for both these sensors fall in two categories either they are for a sensor heater fault or that the ECU detects something wrong with the signal from the sensor.
Where a fault code indicates something wrong with the sensor signal it can be be a senor or wiring fault but it can also be an engine fault upstream of he sensor.

First of all looking at the primary upstream lambda sensor B1S1 this the sensor that allows the the ECU to control the injection system, when the engine is warmed up the ECU uses the signal from this sensor to run what is called closed loop control.

A fault code from the B1S1 sensors is nothing to do with a worn out catalyst as the B1S1 sensor is before the catalyst.

A fault code from this sensor can point to a few things not all of are directly connected with the sensor, this is why it is important to check the wiring and connector and also check for anything that could affect the mixture before condemning the sensor. The wiring to the sensor on the 3 cylinder Corsa is a not uncommon fault. The sensor is a heated type and if the code is for B1S1 heater circuit then it is highly likely to be down to burnt or corroded wiring. Also make sure the inlet or exhaust manifolds are no drawing air as this will cause a false signal.
However in your case from your description I would suspect a geriatric sensor, the way to tell is when looking at the live data stream B1S1 only changes high to low quite slowly then the odds are the sensor is too old.

The other sensor on an inline engine is B1S2 this is downstream of the the catalyst or catalysts. The job of B1S2 is purely to check if the emission system is doing its job.
The signal from this down stream sensor should be completely different from B1S1 it should. produce a very flat signal very different from the jittery looking signal from B1S1.
B1S2 generates the infamous P0420 code which indicates a catalyst fault but really means the signal from B1S2 indicates something could be wrong with any part of the emission system.