I have a 2.0 blacktop on hayabusa throttle bodies running emerald k3 ecu. I've re wired my TPS as the wires were mixed about an re set it on the
ecu. It fires and ticks over first time and after a minute on tick over my lambda levels off to 14.7. When I go to rev the engine it splutters and
tries to stall almost instantly, then levels back off again. I'm pretty sure it's a fuelling issue but as I'm no emerald wizz I'm
not sure where to start.
I have got the TB's almost balanced across all 4 but they are still out a little as mid adjustment i noticed a loose screw on no4 that now
tightened has scewed things off a little. Does anyone have a a base map they could send me. I have a laptop with maps on it but they all run the same
when loaded.
cheers
What injectors are you using? If you PM me your email address I have a couple of maps I am send you
u2u sent.
I'm using the hayabusa injectors on a danst manifold. It was reving ok but a little rough before the TPS was was reset to emeralds
Instructions. I think that maybe because it wasn't wired right the ecu wasn't running the fuel correctly/not leaning off, it was running
rich and smoking (13 lambda). Now the TPS is wired it's doing the opposite, tick over settles at 14.7 and up to 17 lambda when revved.
2.0 blacktop
1300 hayabusa TB's and Injecors
Emerald K3 ECU
Innovate LC-2 lambda.
Crank, TPS, air temp, and coolant sensors
I've been through a similar thing myself with a similar set up on my car, I'll send you some maps later when I'm at my other laptop,
couple of questions though:
- Have you set the TPS up - the min value and the WOT value?
- Have you scaled the injectors on the base map for the Hayabusa TBs? CC per min etc?
- Have you been running it just closed loop or adaptive looping?
- Is the wideband set up in the Emerald software correctly?
- When you open the throttle a little bit can you get it to idle steady at say 2krpm? What does lambda do then?
-TPS was set from the Emerald setup page 293/903. (inverted it reads 26/143)
-Not sure about scaling injectors, the ecu came programmed/running on the same set up as mine
-I have had it running both closed loop on narrow band and adaptive on Wideband, ran rich on narrow and lean on adaptive.
-The ECU seems to be reading the lambda correctly. I've not adjusted anything yet as I'm still trying to digure it out 
-I could get it to rev to a smokey rich 2k when running narrow band, 12-13 AFR.
It spluters and revs to 2k on wideband but leans off to 16+ AFR and trys to stall.
-TPS was set from the Emerald setup page 293/903. (inverted it reads 26/143)
Ok we'll assume that's okay then
-Not sure about scaling injectors, the ecu came programmed/running on the same set up as mine
This could quite possibly be the issue, have a look at your injectors there should be some part number on them somewhere and using this try and find
out the CC per min of them - there are tables on the web if you just put the part no in. If the map was supplied by Emerald they have probably put in
the front info page of the map what the CC the injectors in that map are. If the two values are different this is probably the problem - there's
an option in the software to scale them. For example the base map I used had 250cc vauxhaul injectors but I was using 315cc focus ones - you simply
put in the 250cc and also the 315cc and bingo it does it all for you!
-I have had it running both closed loop on narrow band and adaptive on Wideband, ran rich on narrow and lean on adaptive.
If it's running lean on adaptive and it's not fixing itself that suggests that your fuelling is too far off for the wideband to sort out.
Have a look at the correction table - if all the fields are empty then it's not sorted itself out. The map needs to be fairly close to start
with.
-The ECU seems to be reading the lambda correctly. I've not adjusted anything yet as I'm still trying to digure it out
-I could get it to rev to a smokey rich 2k when running narrow band, 12-13 AFR.
It spluters and revs to 2k on wideband but leans off to 16+ AFR and trys to stall
I would suggest starting with the base map again just in case the adaptive mapping has made a mess of things, set up all the TPS and other sensors etc
but keep lambda in the open loop mode so it doesn't adjust the map. It's essential to get the injector CC right too.
One final thing is the fuel pressure, what FPR are you using? The base map will be set to a specific pressure and yours may well be different - again
Emerald usually put the fuel pressure in the front page of the map and there is the option to scale the map based on your own fuel pressure. If I
remember correctly it's in the same options bit as the "injector scaling"
Let me know how you get on....
Checking the MAP the injectors are set at 200cc @2.7 bar. In the discription it says 310cc @3bar. I'm pretty sure they are standard gen1
injectors which online info gives anywhere from 240-270cc upto 400cc. now i'm getting confused...
my fuel pressure regulator is adjustable and is set to roughly 3bar
I think when you open the injector scaling bit in the map it could say anything in there - the fact that it says 200cc and 2.7 bar shouldn't
matter. You'll need to put in the 310cc and 3 bar yourself in the current or existing section and then your new values (270cc & 3 bar) and
then scale the map.
What FPR are you using? I've heard some horror stories about the cheap adjustable ones of eBay being massively out. It might be worth fitting the
stock Hayabusa or Ford one with a known FPR, just a few PSI out can make a mess of things! (Don't ask how I know this 
)
It's a none gen adjustable but with a sytec gauge on it. That doesn't mean its reading right though. I'll scale the injectors this
afternoon and see what happens, hioefully i can get the TB's synced properly.
I'll look at the FPR then and see if i can sort a gen busa or zetec one.
Well, that was somewhat successful, not completly but a lot better.
I have re scaled the injectors to 270cc @3bar and re-set the tps again to make sure. Tickover is good at just under 1000rpm TB's still need a
little tweek but it rev's more freely and drops back to idle. The only issue now seems to be an occasional puff from one of the inlets, is that
still a lack of fuel or to much air?
Might be worth aligning your TBs now, a puff could be a misaligned TB - it's quite surprising how a small misalignment can make for bad running,
especially at lower RPM and idle. Might be worth saving this MAP now as a good starting point, I'd try the wideband again now in adaptive mode -
make sure the voltage output graph/range is set correctly in the ECU and it should start learning.
Glad you're having progress though - nothing more satisfying than when it starts to 'sound right'!
Thanks for the help Daf.
I can only get the TB's balanced on 3 of the 4cylinders. 1,3 and 4 are all flowing at around 4.5-4.5 on my syncrometer whilst No2 won't
budge from 2.5. its reving and idling smoothly and tick over is roughly 900rpm, theres a nice throaty roar from the TB's and no splutering. I
need to check the clamps and trumpet are all tight and aligned properly.
I've had a look at the voltage graph but I'm not sure what to change. And i can't seem to get it back into adaptive mode?
Getting the balancing within a reasonable amount should be easy as purely a physical adjustment. If a cylinder is way off I would check for air leaks etc. Out of balance TBs will cause idle issues and pick up from idle, less effect on wider openings. It only takes a few small things to cause a good engine to run rough. Do you have access to a AFR meter to you can check what is actually happening to the mixture rather than using your existing Lambda sensor and ECU? I used to always fined the best tick over and pick up was with a ratio of 12.5-13 at idle. Also found checking the TPS settings every time I did something on the linkages, only takes seconds and was surprised how it had changed.
I wouldn't recommend having the AFR at 12.5-13 as it will never get through the IVA test. If you're struggling to get that one cylinder to
balance as said above I would be looking for an air leak or sticky butterfly etc.
To get it into closed loop mode you need to go into the "injection" tab and then into the tabs above go into "feedback mode" in
here you can set each individual speed and load site to be open/closed or adaptive. Select the speed and load sites you want to change and use the +
or - keys to change from open loop (white) closed loop (dark green) and adaptive (light green).
To set up the wideband lambda open the "AFR/lambda input calibration" and you'll need to set the input voltage to the corresponding AFR
for your wideband controller - this data should be readily available from innovative.
I've just been out in the garage for an hour listening to it running and adjusting untill the idle smoothed off, your right it doesn't take
a huge amount of adjustment to throw things off. When I put the synchometer in each of the trumpets I had managed to get it at within a fraction of
each other, I then tweaked the rest using the syncrometer. It's a nice smooth idle and a clean rev upto 4k. I'll see how it is tomorrow when
i drive her I'm planning on going down to a mates garage next week to get the tracking done and lights aligned properly so I'll get him
to whack it on the MOT kit and check emmisions etc.
I might have an issue with temps, my fan kicks in at 96 and off at 90 and I'm not sure if this is ok on a zetec, should it run cooler? I need to
flush the system again now it's ran for a bit so I can get a different temp switch if i need to.
AFR settles around 14ish on tick over
quote:
Originally posted by furryeggs
AFR settles around 14ish on tick over
I've got the voltages in the innovate manual so I'll sort that in the morning.
Should i set a closed range 14.7 from idle-a set rpm and the rest at adaptive?
quote:
Originally posted by furryeggs
I might have an issue with temps, my fan kicks in at 96 and off at 90 and I'm not sure if this is ok on a zetec, should it run cooler? I need to flush the system again now it's ran for a bit so I can get a different temp switch if i need to.
My fan control is off a temp switch in the radiator as this was the easiest way when using the tiger loom, it meant I didn't have to run new wires. My ECU uses the ford temp sensor in the thermostate for its readings and my temp gauge uses a 2nd one in the coolant oioe work.
quote:
Originally posted by furryeggs
I've got the voltages in the innovate manual so I'll sort that in the morning.
Should i set a closed range 14.7 from idle-a set rpm and the rest at adaptive?
Daf you have an email...
cheers
Well, I seemed to of cocked things up a little. I have entered the new lambda voltages from Innovate into the map and it now runs like a bag of snot,
the splutterings back and it dies and stalls when revved.
I've re loaded the original base map voltage settings and double checked everything and it does run better but not as good as I had it yesterday.
I'm on nights for the next 4 so won't get much done and I have ordered some 100ohm resistors for the lambda/ecu connection to help smooth
things off. All the starting and stopping when programming has drained the battery (fuel pump runs) so thats on charge too.
Plus I've found a few little leaks one of which might scupper my IVA target this year. Hopefully its just an overfilled g/box.
These are the voltage settings from Innovate. The 0v and 5v match the manual but everything else seems to mess up the map. The previous setting were
0v=11,1v=12,2v=13,3v=14,4v=15,5v=16... Putting them back to the original ones have helped but its thrown off the map elsewhere and brought back the
stutter and stall.
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I've managed to get it back to an almost steady idle. At some point the injector scaling had reset the mbps number to 12. i checked some video of
the good map running and it was set to 45. I've adjusted the fueling whilst running and it's now up to 32 and a lot smoother and not
spluttering. I should now be able to re balance the TB's then reset the TPS.
I've also fitted a 100ohm resistor into the Lambda circuit as suggested by emerald, so hopefully now I can try the new Lambda voltage corrections
and Dafs map.
All maps have been saved to USB and laptop so if anything happens i have 2 copies of the original to go back to.
I need to double check the Lambda corrections so I decided to draw up a graph to confirm the readings. The LC-2 gives a linear reading from the sensor
so it's a straight forward graph.
Taking the corrections from the graph they match up with the info I had earlier on in the week.
[img]
[/img]
With these confirmed I can now program them into the map and hopefully everything will run ok...ish
so it continues, I am finally almost back to a good idle and free reving. A few base map adjustment on the fueling and live adjustments page and the
idle is steady.
I've had to strip the TB's off as no mater what i tried they wouldn't re balance at all. Looking along the 4 they seemed twisted and
wven with the adjustment screws all the way out No1 was still open, I've loosened off the 3 retaining rids and moved them all back inline, then
with them off and using a feeler gauge i set them to as close to balanced visually as i could get them. 1 is still slighty out to the other 3 but
importantly when fitted back on they only needed a very slight tweek. They are reading 4 across 3 of them and 7 on No1.
I've also rescaled the lambda voltage in the LC-2 software to match emeralds set up guide. This however has made it read a constant 11afr so i
might have to re look at the LC-2 settings.
Impotantly it's getting back to where It was.
I'm pretty much back to were I was before cocking it all up.
-I've re scaled my LC-2 to emeralds suggestion of 0v=11AFR - 5v=16AFR and re calibrated the controller
-I've then matched it in the emerald MAP
-Throttle bodies are as close to balanced as I can get them
-Daf's amended Map loaded (part adaptive)
-Tick over is 950rpm ish
-TPS is reset
-Injection checked at 270cc @3bar
-MSPB number set to the last known good idle (28)
-Small adjustment made in the live adjustments page to smooth off idle
-AFR hovering at about 13AFR, I've not had the engine running for long at this setting (90s maybe) so not sure if this is getting close to were
it should be.
-There was 1 slight splutter when started but that went straight away and hasn't returned.
If the AFR reading is correct then I'm still a little rich so there is still a little tweaking to be done, hopefully I can get it close enough to
pass emissions.
So my splutter comes back occasionally once the temps are up.
I have let the engine run upto temprature until the fan kicked in at 95, once the temps started to get up towards 75-80 an occasional splutter
returned, but my AFR does level off to between 14.5 -15.2.
I think I'm rich on start up idle but lean on hot idle. Does this seem to be about right? I should be able to adjust the fuelling to get rid of
the splutter but I'm not to keen to play around to much until i can get out for a drive. I don't want to cock things up again.