will a 1600 crank fit in a 1300 crossflow block? (same dia/width mains, enough clearance at the base of the block).
Is ther enough vertaical cuslinder fothe piston (BTW stroke difference between the 2 is 15 mm)
If so, then by using less tall pistons and most likley shorter conrods, can the 1300 be stroked to 1600?
Just wondering if it has been done, but won't be locost.
In a word, no.
You will have lost about an inch in block height, this has to be made up somewhere - in this case at the bottom of the stroke. There's not enough
metal at the bottom of the cylinders to accommodate this. Interesting idea though.
I hear what you are saying -but the difference in stroke is less than the blcok height (I'll need to measure).
accordingto the tuning book, you can get a longer stroke crank fro both 1300 and 1600 engines but it falls in between the two capacities.
I am not convinced about running out of cylinder bore though - isn't it only the rings that need to contact it? Having pistons with the rings
higher up will gain a few mm so I reckon it is doable?
There doesn't appear to be enough metal in the piston to make it less tall i.e. reduce distance from gufgeon pin to piston top unless the rings
can be thinner and spaced closer together.
I thnk the showstopper is the cost of pistons and rods - maybe 1100 rods would do the job?
Anyone know the lenght of 1600/1300/1100 rods?
istr the main bearing dia are smaller on the 1100/1300 block
quote:
Originally posted by 02GF74
I hear what you are saying -but the difference in stroke is less than the blcok height (I'll need to measure).
accordingto the tuning book, you can get a longer stroke crank fro both 1300 and 1600 engines but it falls in between the two capacities.
I am not convinced about running out of cylinder bore though - isn't it only the rings that need to contact it? Having pistons with the rings higher up will gain a few mm so I reckon it is doable?
There doesn't appear to be enough metal in the piston to make it less tall i.e. reduce distance from gufgeon pin to piston top unless the rings can be thinner and spaced closer together.
I thnk the showstopper is the cost of pistons and rods - maybe 1100 rods would do the job?
Anyone know the lenght of 1600/1300/1100 rods?
quote:
Originally posted by Alan_Thomas
This seems like an awful lot of effort to get 1600cc, much easier to start with a 1600 block the only reason I can think of for doing this is if you are not going to inform your insurance / DVLA of the greater capacity :
- Alan
from what i remember the differences between the blocks are....
1100/1300 same crank/rods larger bore
1600, same bore as 1300 but longer stroke via crank.
I know you can put the 1300 pistons in the 1600 engine to make a high (er than ford ever made) compression engine. Can't remember if this is
cause the piston is bigger or if the bowl in the piston is smaller.
not palnning to do it LOL; just wondering if it can be done.
The 1300 conrods are much shorter and much weaker than the 1600 rods. To get the correct rod/stroke ratio you need the 1600 rods. Unfortunately this
means that the the pistons will be sticking out of the top of the bore by 25mm .... unless you fit a piston with a MUCH shorter compression height.
Standard is 44.75, so you need one with about 20mm compression height - and they dont make em! You could go for a flat top piston and a chambered head
and use a bike piston, but this means mucho expense and frankly I can't see the point.
1600 blocks are cheap enough....and there's more clearance for the inlet manifold over the distributor.
here we go, 1300 rods ... having shorter rods on a lnger stroke mean the cangle the move through is more and it may foul the piston skirts.
do you know how mcuh shorter thay are?
and why are they weaker ? surely if they are shorter made to the same design wold make them stronger - are they thinner or something?
Much thinner and much shorter! 107mm rings a bell wheras the 1600s are 125.25. You cant use the 1300 rod with a 1600 crank because the rod angularity
will be too great - not for clearance- but for the ability to rev and the shorter time the pistons stays at TDC which reduces power.
The rod length/stroke ratio needs to about 1.75 to 1, but if you use 1300 rods that drops to 1.38 to 1. Worse than useless! The 1600 rods are really
too short for the 1600 crank at 1.61 to 1, but seem to work OK . Most 1600 race engines use a longer rod (131mm) and a shorter piston. (39mm)
1100 rods are actually longer than the 1300 by a few mm as the stroke is shorter, but it uses the same block.
A budget F1300 race engine used to use the 1100 rods, 1300 crank, twincam pistons (39mm compression height) and a chambered head. I know 'cos I
used to have one
......
Are you trying to gain clearance under the bonnet by using a 1300 block?
[Edited on 12/4/07 by Memphis Twin]
I have a 1300 and it fits nicely under the bonnet - rough calculations show that a 16oo should fit but would need the filler moved to the rear and
shortened.
I am torn in between trying to get more oompf out of the 1300 and staying under 1549cc to save £ 65 annually on car tax so I guess ther 1600 stroking
isn;t going to do that for me unless I sleeve the bores and fit smaller pistons. ... and generally wondering if it can be done.
I know there is a longer throw crank for the 1300 pplus with an overbore can get it to somewhere aournd 1450 (?)?
quote:
Originally posted by 02GF74
I am torn in between trying to get more oompf out of the 1300 and staying under 1549cc to save £ 65 annually on car tax so I guess ther 1600 stroking isn;t going to do that for me unless I sleeve the bores and fit smaller pistons. ... and generally wondering if it can be done.
You can get x-flow cranks in many sizes, but aftermarket ones are steel and cost £1200.
Ford made 1100, 1300, 1500 and 1600 cranks that all use the same bore size of 80.98mm All the journals are the same size and width.
1100 53.29mm
1300 62.99
1500 72.75
1600 77.62
You could stick with your 1300 but go to +90 on the bore size and arrive at 1372cc. New pistons are only about £80 a set + £100 for a rebore which is
cheap enough.
But personally I'd stick a good 1700 in there and use an alloy rocker cover, (which has an almost flush-fitting filler). You'll be amazed at
the difference in grunt.