Ghostrider1911
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 posted on 23/2/20 at 01:24 PM |
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ST170 Ignition Table? Dwell Time? Some Questions ;)
Hello people!
I am currently building an ST170 Conversion.
This is my Setting:
- Fully VVT Control
- GSXR 750 ITBīs
- ST170 Injectors
- Self Made Exhaust (From ST170 Exhaust)
- Standart ST170 Coilpack
- ME442 ECU
- Alpha-N Fueling
If anyone here has questions to my Settings, feel free to ask i will answer with pleasure.
So now i have the engine running, couldnīt make a testdrive because itīs to cold and wet.
The Engine starts really bad at the Moment, i think this is an issue with coil dwell time at low voltage.
I would be very glad if some people here can help me out with there maps, especially ignition tables and Ignition dwell time tables.
The ECU which is used doesnīt matter, i am able to convert this into my ecu tables.
Of course i must tune the engine by myself, but if i had an starting point where i can work on, i would be very glad.
Also i dont want to kill my engine by knock because ignition timing.
Sorry for my bad english, i am giving my very best, i hope you can forgive me 
Any help is welcome!
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cliftyhanger
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| posted on 23/2/20 at 01:41 PM |
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I have a similar setup (VERY similar, using ME221)
I could send you my full calibration? Should be very close to what you want.
The only problems could be with water and air temperature sensors?
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Ghostrider1911
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| posted on 23/2/20 at 02:24 PM |
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Hello cliftyhanger!
Thank you for your answer.
I sent you an U2U Message with my E-Mail Adress in it
I dont think IAT and CLT Temp Sensors are a problem, i already configured mine.
How many HP have you gained? Maybe you have visited a dyno already ?
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cliftyhanger
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| posted on 23/2/20 at 02:41 PM |
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I have been to 2.
ME tuned it but "had issues" and got is roughly correct and 155bhp
I did some stuff, took it to Bailey Motorsport, about 175bhp.
But nobody seemed to alter the VVT mapping, ME had a VVT map that increased cam advance with revs. Even though they have videos explainging that
won't work. Mine now has lots of advance at low rpm, mush less in the middle, and 40degrees above 3000rpm. Much better to drive.
And for some reason, my timing pattern from the flywheel is 180degrees out (I reckon the loom from ME had 2 wires connected the wrong way round!)
I will see if I can find the calibration on my laptop, or download it from the car, then send it to you.
And I am using GSXR throttle bodies with ST170 injectors. The fuel pressure I can't remember, but it is a Ford Zetec regulator on a blacktop
fuel rail.
Engine is in a Triumph Spitfire.
[Edited on 23/2/20 by cliftyhanger]
[Edited on 23/2/20 by cliftyhanger]
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Ghostrider1911
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| posted on 23/2/20 at 04:56 PM |
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That sounds great,
would be very glad if you can send me the file 
I run single fuel line, with pressure regulator in fuel tank.
Engine is in Westfield SE
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big_wasa
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| posted on 23/2/20 at 07:26 PM |
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Standard zetec fuel reg is 3.8 bar
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Ghostrider1911
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| posted on 25/2/20 at 07:01 AM |
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cliftyhanger did help me a lot !
thank you so much 
I am running the ST170 Fuelrail, and also the intake manifold part with the injectors in it.
Then i resized the space between the throttle bodies to fit the GSXR750 ITBīs to it.
Does anyone here know what a good trumpet length is for this configuration?
My Fuel pressure is 3.0bar, single line feed. GSXR1300 Fuel pump in the tank with the pressure regulator built in.
(If it works in motorcycle, why shouldnt it work in a car? )
Also i managed to get the original ST170 Fuel pressure sensor, which is originally used to regulate fuel pressure, running.
So i can log the fuel pressure and detect failures etc.
Any tips on my build are welcome
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SPYDER
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| posted on 25/2/20 at 09:14 AM |
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I have the same GSXR750 ITBs on my 3SGE engined car.
There are a few sources of information related to trumpet length online and based on these I made the
inlet tract length 14"/355mm from valve head to end of trumpet.
This is aimed at a tuned rev-band between 6-7K.
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Ghostrider1911
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| posted on 25/2/20 at 02:28 PM |
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Thank you for the Answer!
I have read something about the Trumpet Length (From opening to valve)
Some say a good value for such an engine and rpm is 350mm ( matches your statement)
But most say for an car engine longer is better, so the space is the limitating factor.
Do you use an Air filter?
What is the neccesarry distance between air filter and trumpet, so no limitation is there?
I will use an oval big RAM-AIR Filter at the top of all 4 IBTīs
My thought was to let an distance of ca. 2 cm between air filter and trumpet.
What do you think?
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cliftyhanger
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| posted on 25/2/20 at 06:02 PM |
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I pressed weber45 trumpets into the GSXR throttle bodies. And I have made an airbox, fed by 100mm tube to a big K+N filter (good for 400bhp!!!)
DanST makes/sells trumpets and backplates etc for air filters
https://danstengineering.co.uk/Parts-and-Accessories/Velocity-stack-kits
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SPYDER
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| posted on 26/2/20 at 11:26 AM |
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If you could get a length of 21" under your bonnet then that might be even better than 14".
I would try to have a bigger gap between filter and trumpets. Mine is around 40mm. I am using K&N filters.
I've just had a look on K&N, ITG and Ramair websites and none of them make any reference to this gap.
 
Description
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Ghostrider1911
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| posted on 26/2/20 at 12:16 PM |
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Hello cliftyhanger, this sounds like an easy idea! Maybe you can send me some pictures if you would like to 
Hello SPYDER,
your Air Filter System looks very nice!
My Air Filters will look outside the bonnet. (All together too long, also i have Westfield Narrow Body)
i will use such an RAMAIR Filter which has no Front plate made off metall.
So my suggestion is that the clearance could be a bit less then 4mm. I hope you can understand what i am trying to explain.
[img]https://i0.wp.com/www.ramair-filters.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/RT-CAT.jpg?fit=935%2C240&ssl=1[/img]
[Edited on 26/2/20 by Ghostrider1911]
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SPYDER
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| posted on 26/2/20 at 12:47 PM |
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If your filters are outside then buy the deepest one you can get. Ramair do 100mm deep ones.
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Ghostrider1911
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| posted on 26/2/20 at 02:35 PM |
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I think that today i will post some pictures of my build, so that you can see what i am building
There is absolute no chance of getting the air filter under the bonnet, but because the "old" air filter was already outside the bonnet, i
have no problem with it.
I have already bought the ramair filter, i think its 10cm big. There are only 2 types that would fit my build, i bought the smaler one, because the
other was reealy big.
My Old Engine was Ford OHC (Pinto) 2.0 with sport camshaft and solex carburators, run really awfull.
Itīs a shame i have no clue how many hp it really made, there is a diagram that tells 122hp, but i canīt really believe it.
I hope the ST170 Engine is a real jump in power, because the old engine felt really slow for the little weight.
Altough i hope the mileage goes down a bit. The old engine has 12l / 100km (19,6 mpg) at normal driving. I think this is quite much for a car that
weights less than 600kg.
Maybe the ST170 Alpha-N drivers here can give me an clue what the engine needs at normal driving?
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cliftyhanger
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| posted on 26/2/20 at 03:27 PM |
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My spitfire does about 32-35mpg touring scotland plus motorway there. That is 8-9L/100km
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BaileyPerformance
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| posted on 28/2/20 at 06:41 PM |
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Just for info a stock ST170 makes around 155hp.
As a rule VVT advanced mid range, less at the high RPM, but whatever works really, exhaust is critical.
175hp is about right, they do seem to vary, best i have ever seen 190hp.
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Ghostrider1911
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| posted on 29/2/20 at 02:09 PM |
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I think 8-9 l / 100km is just ok.
Maybe your Spitfire has around 800kg, my westfield should have around 500-600kg, but i have not weighed it already.
So maybe my mileage can be a bit lower.
I think my exhaust isnīt to bad at all, i have 4-2-1, modified the stock st170 exhaust.
170hp would be enough i think.
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