Irony
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 01:12 PM |
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RV8 IVA Emissions
I have (foolishly or not so foolishly) ploughed along with my engine build thinking that I could choose a fueling method at a later date.
I got conformation from Land Rover that my engine was built in 1994. This means it will sadly be tested on the more stringent IVA regs. I was going
to purchase a Webber 500 off a fellow locoster but now it seems it wont get through the IVA.
I could get a Hotwire system from a scrapyard I suppose. Trouble is I don't know anything about EFI? What would be involved with this. Would
it be a simple case of stripping one out of a another truck and putting it in?
What are my options now? Cost is a serious factor for me.
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A1
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 01:24 PM |
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If im right in thinking, youll need crank/cam position sensors,throttle position, ecu, fuel rail, throttle bodies, fuel return line...It is possible,
might take a while to set up though
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scudderfish
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 01:32 PM |
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Apparently, dumping the Rover EFI kit onto a carbed V8 is a matter of a bit of fuel plumbing and 4 wires (I think, ground, 12v, switched 12v and
coil). No trigger wheels or anything like that as it runs a dizzy. I've not done it myself, but this was according to a conversation I had
with http://myworld.ebay.co.uk/rrdoctoruk&ssPageName=STRK:MEFSX:SELLERID a while back. He was offering to sell me the complete setup for £150.
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Irony
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 01:36 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by scudderfish
Apparently, dumping the Rover EFI kit onto a carbed V8 is a matter of a bit of fuel plumbing and 4 wires (I think, ground, 12v, switched 12v and
coil). No trigger wheels or anything like that as it runs a dizzy. I've not done it myself, but this was according to a conversation I had
with http://myworld.ebay.co.uk/rrdoctoruk&ssPageName=STRK:MEFSX:SELLERID a while back. He was offering to sell me the complete setup for £150.
Emailed him, no response as yet. Cheers
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cd.thomson
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 01:46 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Irony
I have (foolishly or not so foolishly) ploughed along with my engine build thinking that I could choose a fueling method at a later date.
I got conformation from Land Rover that my engine was built in 1994. This means it will sadly be tested on the more stringent IVA regs. I was going
to purchase a Webber 500 off a fellow locoster but now it seems it wont get through the IVA.
I could get a Hotwire system from a scrapyard I suppose. Trouble is I don't know anything about EFI? What would be involved with this. Would
it be a simple case of stripping one out of a another truck and putting it in?
What are my options now? Cost is a serious factor for me.
as long as the engine is pre-1995 and you can prove it then youre tested against the lax numbers if you follow the full CAT flowchart.
3.5% CO 
Craig
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Agriv8
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 01:48 PM |
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if you are going through IVA you need the hotwire with Lambda sensors you will also need to fit the correct tune resistor to tell the ECU which engine
it is controlling.
I may have enough bits to make up a full system.
Which include
Plenum,
injectors,
fuel rail,
Throttle Pot,
Flow Meter
ECU
High presure fuel pump,
Return
Water Temp Sender.
Hotwire ECU loom
Feed from Dizzie
Clean Power
Earth
1 down side in the range rover the Ecu in under the rivers seat mens you can have quite a bit of loom to hide.
regards
Agriv8
[Edited on 1/6/10 by Agriv8]
Taller than your average Guy !
Management is like a tree of monkeys. - Those at the top look down and see a tree full of smiling faces. BUT Those at the bottom look up and see a
tree full of a*seholes .............
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Irony
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 01:52 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by cd.thomson
quote:
Originally posted by Irony
I have (foolishly or not so foolishly) ploughed along with my engine build thinking that I could choose a fueling method at a later date.
I got conformation from Land Rover that my engine was built in 1994. This means it will sadly be tested on the more stringent IVA regs. I was going
to purchase a Webber 500 off a fellow locoster but now it seems it wont get through the IVA.
I could get a Hotwire system from a scrapyard I suppose. Trouble is I don't know anything about EFI? What would be involved with this. Would
it be a simple case of stripping one out of a another truck and putting it in?
What are my options now? Cost is a serious factor for me.
as long as the engine is pre-1995 and you can prove it then youre tested against the lax numbers if you follow the full CAT flowchart.
3.5% CO
I can prove the age of the block is 1994 as I have the letter from Land Rover. I have never put a car through IVA/SVA as this is my first build. I
don't know if 3.5% CO is a lot or not a lot. I am just going on what people said.
I emailed the man at V8 Tuner and he didn't think Carbs are a good idea and RPI engineering haven't bothered to email me back.
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cd.thomson
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 01:55 PM |
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well post-95 you need to be below 0.5% CO, as well as having O2 tests etc  .
My car runs carbs (on an engine designed for EFI + a cat) and it should be easy getting under 3.5%.
Should add this isnt an RV8.
Craig
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AdamR
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 01:56 PM |
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As above, I think the crucial date is August '95. Anything manufactured earlier than that gets tested against more lenient standards. Certainly
hope that's the case, as although I am using EFI, I'm not using cats for that reason...
Anyone got a link to the definitive answer?
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Paul (Notts)
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 03:19 PM |
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i AM SURE THAT IN THE iva ITS AUG 92 THEN THE EMMISIONS DROP down to 0.3%co2
hc <200ppm
but may be wrong....
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pdm
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 03:27 PM |
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IVA seems to say:
If after 1/8/92 do a BET
If it fails i.e. doesnt meet Fast Idle CO <= 0.3 HC <= 200ppm and lamba 0.97-1.03/ Idle CO <= 0.5% then go to CAT1.
CAT 1 says:
Between 1/8/92 and 31/7/95 if you can't find manufacturer figures it should be Non CAT test CO <= 3.5 and HC <= 1200ppm otherwise test to
specific vehicle limits.
Presumably the vehicle specific limits aren't found for a kit so it would be CO <= 3.5 and HC <= 1200 ppm ?
Or are actual engines rather than vehicles listed somewhere ?
[Edited on 1/6/10 by pdm]
[Edited on 1/6/10 by pdm]
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cd.thomson
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 03:30 PM |
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http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/viewthread.php?tid=136581
Page 46:
http://online.businesslink.gov.uk/Transport_files/124_IVA_M1_Inspection_Manual__Version_4_0510.pdf
"exact matches" require engine code, date of manufacture, VIN code etc etc etc which obviously you cant provide 
[Edited on 1/6/10 by cd.thomson]
Craig
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pdm
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 03:34 PM |
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So if you gave your engine number and donor's VIN etc etc when you go to IVA - can you be "held" to the donor's emissions
rather than 3.5% ?
Would your donor's emissions data be more restrictive than 3.5% generally ?
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cd.thomson
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 03:37 PM |
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yes, dont do that.
theres no need to give that amount of data on the donor engine.. you'll only trip yourself up.
Craig
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Irony
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 03:50 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by pdm
IVA seems to say:
If after 1/8/92 do a BET
If it fails i.e. doesnt meet Fast Idle CO <= 0.3 HC <= 200ppm and lamba 0.97-1.03/ Idle CO <= 0.5% then go to CAT1.
CAT 1 says:
Between 1/8/92 and 31/7/95 if you can't find manufacturer figures it should be Non CAT test CO <= 3.5 and HC <= 1200ppm otherwise test to
specific vehicle limits.
Presumably the vehicle specific limits aren't found for a kit so it would be CO <= 3.5 and HC <= 1200 ppm ?
This is the way I saw it as well. A trip to the IVA place might be in order. But are these figures to strenuous for a Carb or is EFI the ownly
option?
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Paul (Notts)
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 03:53 PM |
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ahhhhh...
Craig is wright it fails the first test but then is tested on
Carry out a non
CAT test
CO <= 3.5%
HC <= 1200ppm
if its between 92 and 31st July 1995...
as they cant find a data base match!
Paul
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Paul (Notts)
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 03:54 PM |
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My 3.5 passed the above test with a quick turn of the idle screws....on the webber 500 carb.
Paul
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pdm
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 04:15 PM |
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So to get a 3.5 CO test, the plan would be:
Get a pre Aug 95 engined donor.
Get proof of age of engine but don't tell IVA man anything else about the car. Get tested at "higher" levels.
Hopefully pass and then the MAC cert doesn't get any figures put into it as it's a kit
Get it registered either a Q or age related.
Get to MOT 3 years later and get either a 3.5 CO test (or if they fill in figures on the MAC use those )
That sound about right ?
PS Sorry to hijack original thread...
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Irony
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 04:30 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Paul (Notts)
My 3.5 passed the above test with a quick turn of the idle screws....on the webber 500 carb.
Paul
If yours passed on the above CO% then there should be no reason my engine being a Feb 94 engine should not pass. Would it make a lot of difference
that mines a 3.9?
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russbost
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 04:47 PM |
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Any halfway modern engine which can't meet 3.5% CO & 1200 ppm HC would have something wrong with it (unless running something like full
race cam etc). Should require no more than the carb being set up correctly
I no longer run Furore Products or Furore Cars Ltd, but would still highly recommend them for Acewell dashes, projector headlights, dominator
headlights, indicators, mirrors etc, best prices in the UK! Take a look at http://www.furoreproducts.co.uk/ or find more parts on Ebay, user names
furoreltd & furoreproducts, discounts available for LCB users.
Don't forget Stainless Steel Braided brake hoses, made to your exact requirements in any of around 16 colours.
http://shop.ebay.co.uk/furoreproducts/m.html?_dmd=1&_ipg=50&_sop=12&_rdc=1
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NOTE:This user is registered as a LocostBuilders trader and may offer commercial services to other users
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robinj66
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 05:40 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Irony
quote:
Originally posted by Paul (Notts)
My 3.5 passed the above test with a quick turn of the idle screws....on the webber 500 carb.
Paul
If yours passed on the above CO% then there should be no reason my engine being a Feb 94 engine should not pass. Would it make a lot of difference
that mines a 3.9?
It makes no difference what block etc you're using - the thing that will affect the emissions is the fuel/ignition system.
You need to decide which distributor and which carb and which cam you are going to use.
Standad dizzy's on the RV8 are D8 (points - try P5/P6), DE8 (aka OPUS - try SD1/R/R 1976-82ish), DM8 and DLM8 - they have the electronics in a
box either on the sie of the dizzy or unde the coil.
Carbs could be twin SU's or Strombergs (standard fare on RV8) which should have no problems meeting the emissions.
With an aftermarket inlet manifold you could then fit an edelbrock or Holley 4- barrel carb. You can also get manifolds adapted for 38 DGAS or quad
downdraft carbs.
Choice of cam is huge.....
Each of the above will affect the likely emissions
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craig1410
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 05:46 PM |
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Yeah you should be okay getting below 3.5% on the RV8 unless you are having some sort of problem. Make sure you have good high voltage electrics
(Dizzy cap, rotor arm, leads and plugs) and make sure your carb is set correctly with good float level.
At SVA last year I got something like 1.5% with a 1977 RV8 running twin SU's. I got proof of engine age based on my engine number from the
British Motor Heritage Society. Cost about £19 IIRC.
If in doubt then talk to your local IVA inspector.
Good luck!
Craig.
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scudderfish
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| posted on 1/6/10 at 06:11 PM |
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If you're after something simple, I've got a 38DGAS on a modified Rover manifold that I took off my engine a few months ago.
On the MOT I just found, it achieved 2.83% and 325ppm
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