First try to start today...it turned over then wouldn't turn the starter just clicked....just like a flat battery. However if I hot wire the
stater it turns over....and starts but only runs while the starter is engaged.
so before I get deep into diagnostics is there some common issues to look at?
It's a 1.8 on the oem ford ecu.
one other thing, the starter inhibit relay seemed to work as it should.....now it does nothing or the symptoms like a flat battery. I have changed the
relay.
sometimes you are the pigeon, most of the time the statue.
quote:Originally posted by rusty nuts
Ignition switch wired so that the coil pack/fuel pump/ECU is only live when cranking the engine over?
i did think that however the ignition switch turns on a relay that supplies all the ECU relays and fuses....... the fuel pump primes up the car tries
to crank....but if i hotwire the starter it will turn over fine. it will also start but not run afterwards its as if it isnt getting enough fuel.
however pressure looks good.
sometimes you are the pigeon, most of the time the statue.
quote:Originally posted by snowy2
First try to start today...it turned over then wouldn't turn the starter just clicked....just like a flat battery. However if I hot wire the
stater it turns over....and starts but only runs while the starter is engaged.
so before I get deep into diagnostics is there some common issues to look at?
It's a 1.8 on the oem ford ecu.
one other thing, the starter inhibit relay seemed to work as it should.....now it does nothing or the symptoms like a flat battery. I have changed the
relay.
Clicking starter/solenoid in my experience is always earth related. How are you hot wiring? Have you got a good earth running from the block? This has
scuppered me more than once.
New earth cables to cyl head and one to chassis the ecu earth's share the chassis connection to earth.
the starter hot wire is by shorting the pin 30 and 87 on the inhibit relay (pin 87 is ign 12v. Pin 30 connect to starter, pin 85 to ign. switch
(start) and pin 86 to ecu)
To rule out ignition switch issues. The ignition "on" relay is now connected to battery to keep relay "live" whilst checking
everthing else.
if I use the starter switch the starter solinoid just clicks but the engine does not turn over.......if I hot wire as above it cranks just fine. I
have swapped the relays.....no difference.
all fuses are new. And checked.
do I need the LED light connecting for the ecu to work?
sometimes you are the pigeon, most of the time the statue.
are you getting the same voltage at the starter/solenoid when you hot wire and when you use the starter switch?
the clicking is the solenoid firing I believe, but it doesn't have enough juice to turn the flywheel, hence why i asked about earthing. Cant
offer anything boyond that i'm afraid as I no nothing about the standard ECU.
I think Bigwasa on here successfully ran with one - might be worth messaging him?
With out the led your only guessing at what the Immobilizer is upto. So yes connect it, it's only two wires.
It will run happily with out the inhibit relay and the engine control relay. You can add them back in when you work out what the problem is.
check you have 12v at all the bits that need it. Ecu, coil, idle valve ect when cranking.
When it fires crack the throttle open a tiny bit and see what it does. If the idle valve is dead it won't run.
Another big one is air leaks. If your using the factory inlet check the vaccume take offs. Brake servo often gets missed. It will try to start but
won't as you say.
i was pretty confident my wiring was right but i started to check it out......i also took several fuel injection books to read at work.
it turns out that the ford ECU with the type of idle valve the Zetec E generally comes with needs to see a voltage from the MAF and not just engine
rpm and TPS as i thought. my plan was to give the idle control valve its own air supply via a little air filter........
anyway once i cut into the air ducting in front of the TB and piped in the idle valve it started and ticked over fine.....Result! it seems that if
the ECU doesn't see an air flow via the MAF it cuts the fuel. even at tick over it will generate some thing.......and the ECU needs to see it.
there was one other problem as well.....my new battery (the same one as the one that starts my 2.0L pinto car.... 45AH , 330CCA........) don’t like
cranking the Zetec.......as soon as i jumped it from the wife’s car it fired up....bigger battery i think........
since my wiring worked i will publish my working diagrams on here for all......using the Focus 60 pin ECU turns out to be very straight forward.
sometimes you are the pigeon, most of the time the statue.
I got out of the mechanics game in 1991 (i worked for a BMW dealership) when i got a written warning on the first of august because i arrived at work
1 hour late after spending all night until 3 in the morning the night before prepping two cars for a customer to pick up the next day (fitting alarms
stereos etc,) my boss was a prick saying he didn't care that i worked that late i was late the next day so written warning!..... i told him to
poke his job and went to driving HGV's.
Fuel injection systems were just becoming standard when i left but most cars we serviced were carbs....
all of my kit cars have been carbs until the one i am building now...its been a steep but fun learning curve.
sometimes you are the pigeon, most of the time the statue.
It's a hobby, it's all good fun. I am no expert and don't know everything. I've just played with more of these ecu's
than most. They seem to be designed before the limp home mode standard and are very tolerant to buggering about with.
As a side note, Andy has been running his car with out the idle valve for over a year. It does give a code but runs fine and to Iva emsion standards.
He just manually adjusted the throttle butterfly and blips the throttle a few times when it's cold.
interesting issue.....i thought i would fit my ECU in a tablet bag under the dash for "belt and braces" to make sure it doesn't get
wet........
fitted it looks ok.....BUT everything stopped working no power to the ECU nothing.
so out came the OBD reader.......nothing.......right multimeter time.
i removed the ECU from the laptop bag and placed it on the chassis to check for power......and the OBD lit up! i moved the ecu and off it
went......
turns out the body of the ECU needs to be earthed.
easily solved but a surprise to me.
sometimes you are the pigeon, most of the time the statue.
Oh and the engine runs sweet as a nut......ticks over from cold......only issue is it does what a car with an auto choke would...as it warms up it
gets a little "spluttery" unless i give it a quick rev when it settles down...once warm its all hunky dory.
sometimes you are the pigeon, most of the time the statue.
All good. Any chance you have missed the seperate Earth as the ecu in the donor is mounted in a plastic cradle. It works fine sat on my pine dining
table and so on. The case does not need to be earthed.
I did get a fair few earth’s and made sure they were properly grounded...it is possible i missed one. i thought that i recently checked them all. i
have been looking at the unused sensor wires (Lambda 2 and speed sensor)
it couldn’t hurt for the ECU to be earthed.....
however i will recheck the wires.
All in all its been a straight forward experience fitting the 60 pin Focus ECU. I may post pictures of my car on here sometime what i have done to it
i might as well have built a Haynes or Locost it would certainly be worth more money. but i am not doing this for the value but for fun and what i am
restoring is a 1977 Dutton Phaeton S1.
i have fitted some 15M of 1/2" square tubing (only weighs 10Kg) to make a transmission tunnel then i decided to make a fuel tank (46L) to save
the hassle of finding and removing one from a scrap yard car. then i modified the type 9 gearbox bell housing to accept the Zetec starter. i also made
my own inlet plenum and fitted the standard ford TB, i made the plenum so that i could retain the standard alternator......saves loads of hassle. just
had to make a tensioner and fit it to the PAS bracket with a tensioner bracket....seems to work well. the car has home made front wish bones to accept
ford Cortina uprights and the live axle with a 3.77 diff is now 5 link mounted with a full width panhard rod instead of the short thing Dutton used
and Dutton also only used only 3 links onto the axle not 4.
the list goes on. its been about a year in the building, the car will soon be back on the road after last being on the road in 1981/2.....Spalding is
not so far from me...once fully road legal i could pop down for a drive and let you look it over whilst we make short work of a coffee and a few
biscuits
sometimes you are the pigeon, most of the time the statue.
It's all good fun. I am up in Hull later this month on a coarse as head office is there. Or if it takes a little longer to get it finished you
can pop over and have a look at the current project. A £50 zetec with a turbo strapped on running with a Focus Rs ecu.
Happy to report that once all the cooling system was fitted and working with no leaks I let the car get up to full temp and the ecu controlled fan cut
in and out as it should.
In getting there there were some.....er...issues.
my heater matrix split and leaked coolant all over the interior. ...... :-(
and my alternator didn't charge...the excite wire had broke at the soldered joint......inside my newly wrapped loom....bum!....once
repaired.....the alternator still didn't charge.....it's knackered. Down the scrappers £20 later and all is well.
[Edited on 19/6/16 by snowy2]
sometimes you are the pigeon, most of the time the statue.
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