Krismc
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| posted on 16/9/08 at 04:06 PM |
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Help- megasquirt and Failed SVA...Again!
Help needed, my car is in birmingham at a company who is svaing car for me(well cannock) and im in newcastle, car has now failed Sva for emmisions a
few times now... althought its been finished for 20months and now im sick of the megasquirt but cant afford to fit anything else.
can anyone help? Soon?
its a 2.0 zetec, with cams and gsxr k5 throttle boddies, fuel regulator, lc1 lamda kit etc is all fitted, the car runs fine on occasions and ive payed
out to a few people to have a look but they dont seem to know the megasquirt.
Every time it goes to sva it runs lumpy now again causing me to fail sva. sorry cant be too exact i havent seen car for ages.
my options now are.....
1)Could anyone offer advice on what problem could be?
2) is nearby and could take a look?  (beertokens)
3) would like a trip down/up, ill pay for your services
4)Or reccomend a professional that could help me.
Either way at the moment i feel a match and a petrol can may be the only way to sort it!!
cheers in advance
u2u me or ring me........
Kris 07747693671, 07929167193
Built, Ivaed, Drove and now Sold - 2011 MNR VORTX RT+ 2000cc Zetec on R1 Throttle boddies.
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McLannahan
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| posted on 16/9/08 at 04:15 PM |
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Kris - I'm sure Worx (Steve) could look at this for you? Are you Ant & Dec Newcastle or Stafford Newcastle?
If you're Midlands he's only in Middlewich so not really that far. I know he's a lot on and he's just come back from honeycomb
but I'm sure he'd help you.
What company is KC at now and what have they done to try and sort it?
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MikeR
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| posted on 16/9/08 at 04:28 PM |
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when it runs lumpy what does the megasquirt logger say is happening?
Are the radiator fans kicking in (perhaps combined with an earthing problem).
have you got fresh fuel in there?
Do you have a swirl pot with the return line to it or the tank (wondering about fuel temperature)
Do the temperature sensors work / is your "engine hot" settings correct?
These are random questions, but as you state it only happens occasionally i'm trying to think of things that happen occasionally in the car.
have you checked all the wiring / replaced it? Wondering if something is getting hot, expanding and a break becoming too much, then cooling and being
ok.
HAve you tried running someone else's megasquirt map?
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Paul TigerB6
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| posted on 16/9/08 at 04:53 PM |
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Cannock - well that pretty much gives away where it is i think!! I do hope that they are paying for the retests as they clearly aren't able to
do the job they have taken on!! Did you have a fixed price to get the SVA done for you??
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chasmon
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| posted on 16/9/08 at 04:56 PM |
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What emissions have you got to pass fella?
I assume you have a CAT in there? If so best to get them to test it first thing when you get there so its hot and prior to getting there, make sure
its HOT!
HTH
C
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Krismc
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| posted on 16/9/08 at 05:17 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by McLannahan
Kris - I'm sure Worx (Steve) could look at this for you? Are you Ant & Dec Newcastle or Stafford Newcastle?
If you're Midlands he's only in Middlewich so not really that far. I know he's a lot on and he's just come back from honeycomb
but I'm sure he'd help you.
What company is KC at now and what have they done to try and sort it?
Well you all know in anycase, i didnt want to say but My car is @ BEC owners club at moment, before it went in he did say he knew nothing about
megasquirt!
That was ok as we had lined a guy up to tune the megasquirt.... which never materilised!!
So a bit of my own fault, im in newcastle-upon-tyne but the car is in Cannock stafforshire (going to birmingham SVA)...again)
[Edited on 16/9/08 by Krismc]
Built, Ivaed, Drove and now Sold - 2011 MNR VORTX RT+ 2000cc Zetec on R1 Throttle boddies.
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Krismc
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| posted on 16/9/08 at 05:20 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by MikeR
when it runs lumpy what does the megasquirt logger say is happening?
Are the radiator fans kicking in (perhaps combined with an earthing problem).
have you got fresh fuel in there?
Do you have a swirl pot with the return line to it or the tank (wondering about fuel temperature)
Do the temperature sensors work / is your "engine hot" settings correct?
These are random questions, but as you state it only happens occasionally i'm trying to think of things that happen occasionally in the car.
have you checked all the wiring / replaced it? Wondering if something is getting hot, expanding and a break becoming too much, then cooling and being
ok.
HAve you tried running someone else's megasquirt map?
Im not entirly sure what is going on with megatuner/logger or squirt as im not that competent with it....i managed to get the car running in the
first place over a year back, then passed it on.
they company was going to finish my whole build as well as my engine.
its got fresh fuel, swirl pot, new fuel pump, fuel filter, fuel regulator etc and a return feed.
my car is running a wideband lambda which i didnt fit i left them too do it
Built, Ivaed, Drove and now Sold - 2011 MNR VORTX RT+ 2000cc Zetec on R1 Throttle boddies.
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McLannahan
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| posted on 16/9/08 at 05:25 PM |
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Kris - May be worth giving Worx a go then since he's only round the corner?
I'd be itching to get the KC on the road if I were you - That's some wait!!
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Krismc
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| posted on 16/9/08 at 05:28 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Paul TigerB6
Cannock - well that pretty much gives away where it is i think!! I do hope that they are paying for the retests as they clearly aren't able to
do the job they have taken on!! Did you have a fixed price to get the SVA done for you??
Well i knew most people knew where my car is and it isnt really there fault. he is paying for the retest out of good will, and he has done me a fair
price for rest of build which is superb.....just this engine which like i say we where promised by someone else to tune it correctly, which at first
he thought it may be a fuel regulator so i bought a new one.
Built, Ivaed, Drove and now Sold - 2011 MNR VORTX RT+ 2000cc Zetec on R1 Throttle boddies.
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BenTyreman
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| posted on 16/9/08 at 06:03 PM |
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As stated previously the cat has to be VERY hot. At the test I saw the emissions go from 10 times over the limits to almost none as soon as the cat
got up to temp. It was quite tricky to keep it hot as they have a settling period between the fast and slow tests. Perhaps lagging the cat with
exhaust wrap would help?
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Krismc
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| posted on 16/9/08 at 06:12 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by McLannahan
Kris - May be worth giving Worx a go then since he's only round the corner?
I'd be itching to get the KC on the road if I were you - That's some wait!!
ive u2u..ed him i await his reply!
Built, Ivaed, Drove and now Sold - 2011 MNR VORTX RT+ 2000cc Zetec on R1 Throttle boddies.
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chasmon
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| posted on 16/9/08 at 06:19 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by BenTyreman
As stated previously the cat has to be VERY hot. At the test I saw the emissions go from 10 times over the limits to almost none as soon as the cat
got up to temp. It was quite tricky to keep it hot as they have a settling period between the fast and slow tests. Perhaps lagging the cat with
exhaust wrap would help?
I'd echo that, definately worth doing what you can to get the CAT hot...
...If its just emissions that you're stuck on and not that the car doesn't run well enough to get through the test.
Maybe I can help with adapting the MAP I have to suit you? I have both Speed density and Alpha-N maps that work on my car and a map which worked for
me that came from a car running wilder Cams...
I have MS1 V3 using EDIS on a internally standard 2L zetec with GSXR 1000 TBs and injectors...
I started up and drove to SVA having never driven the car before 80 mile round trip 
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TPG
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| posted on 16/9/08 at 06:21 PM |
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cat temp/Lag the cat..A very good point.A hot cat is needed to get most modern tin tops through now..
..Which was nice..
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Krismc
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| posted on 16/9/08 at 06:37 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by chasmon
quote:
Originally posted by BenTyreman
As stated previously the cat has to be VERY hot. At the test I saw the emissions go from 10 times over the limits to almost none as soon as the cat
got up to temp. It was quite tricky to keep it hot as they have a settling period between the fast and slow tests. Perhaps lagging the cat with
exhaust wrap would help?
I'd echo that, definately worth doing what you can to get the CAT hot...
...If its just emissions that you're stuck on and not that the car doesn't run well enough to get through the test.
Maybe I can help with adapting the MAP I have to suit you? I have both Speed density and Alpha-N maps that work on my car and a map which worked for
me that came from a car running wilder Cams...
I have MS1 V3 using EDIS on a internally standard 2L zetec with GSXR 1000 TBs and injectors...
I started up and drove to SVA having never driven the car before 80 mile round trip
Sounds Good...its worth a try... kris.mcgough@sky.com and Cat is already lagged and very hot!
Built, Ivaed, Drove and now Sold - 2011 MNR VORTX RT+ 2000cc Zetec on R1 Throttle boddies.
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chasmon
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| posted on 16/9/08 at 07:07 PM |
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Ok, not wishing to be condescending but how familiar with the MS are you? I can always make some changes to the MAPs to suit you're setup to
make it a bit more likely to run...
Are you currently running Speed density or Alpha_N?
As I understand it your requirements are:
Fast idle 2500-3000rpm
CO no more than 0.3%
HC no more than 200 parts per million
Lambda between 0.97 and 1.03
Normal idle 450-1500rpm
CO no more than 0.5%
Now this should be easily sorted by adjusting the fuelling in this region at fast idle ie partial throttle under no load.
Simply holding the engine at the right revs and adjusting the fuelling to be stoichiometric within 3%. The CAT should do the rest in reducing the CO
levels.
I didn't have to pass this part of the test so I don't know how well suited the maps I have will be. Only that the CO on mine was over the
limit (I don't have a CAT) but the HC levels were low (159ppm).
***Edited to add***
Keep the faith, its a very tidy setup you have looking at your avatar and I seem to remember photos on here before somewhere... Will be great once you
get over this hurdle!
[Edited on 16/9/08 by chasmon]
[Edited on 16/9/08 by chasmon]
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martyn_16v
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| posted on 16/9/08 at 07:25 PM |
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Where is the IAT sensor? If the engine is progressively running worse after being sat still at idle for too long it's likely to be IAT sensor
heatsoak. Extend the wiring and get the sensor out of the engine bay temporarily for the test.
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Krismc
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| posted on 16/9/08 at 08:18 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by chasmon
Ok, not wishing to be condescending but how familiar with the MS are you? I can always make some changes to the MAPs to suit you're setup to
make it a bit more likely to run...
Are you currently running Speed density or Alpha_N?
As I understand it your requirements are:
Fast idle 2500-3000rpm
CO no more than 0.3%
HC no more than 200 parts per million
Lambda between 0.97 and 1.03
Normal idle 450-1500rpm
CO no more than 0.5%
Now this should be easily sorted by adjusting the fuelling in this region at fast idle ie partial throttle under no load.
Simply holding the engine at the right revs and adjusting the fuelling to be stoichiometric within 3%. The CAT should do the rest in reducing the CO
levels.
I didn't have to pass this part of the test so I don't know how well suited the maps I have will be. Only that the CO on mine was over the
limit (I don't have a CAT) but the HC levels were low (159ppm).
***Edited to add***
Keep the faith, its a very tidy setup you have looking at your avatar and I seem to remember photos on here before somewhere... Will be great once you
get over this hurdle!
Simple answer...not very!! ha ha
Your values seem about right but im not totally certain what my car is doing at moment, im going to ring 2moro and find out!
I sort of can use megatune software but not sure what im doing half the time, would you need my current map to change a few settings??
[Edited on 16/9/08 by Krismc]
Built, Ivaed, Drove and now Sold - 2011 MNR VORTX RT+ 2000cc Zetec on R1 Throttle boddies.
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Krismc
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| posted on 16/9/08 at 08:22 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by martyn_16v
Where is the IAT sensor? If the engine is progressively running worse after being sat still at idle for too long it's likely to be IAT sensor
heatsoak. Extend the wiring and get the sensor out of the engine bay temporarily for the test.
its right infront of throttle boddies and in quite a cool place, but ill give anything a shot.
P.s im not totaly sure what engine is doing now!
Built, Ivaed, Drove and now Sold - 2011 MNR VORTX RT+ 2000cc Zetec on R1 Throttle boddies.
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chasmon
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| posted on 16/9/08 at 08:28 PM |
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I can send you the MAPs,
One is a Speed density one which runs my car fine but needs the Acceleration enrichments sorting (I ran this for a few weeks after SVA)
One is a Alpha_N map that I have been working on for a while originally from FBB . This one will need tweaking depending on you TPS setting on the
car.
I'd try the speed density if that's what you're set-up to run already as it will tkae less fiddling to just try...?
Do you have complete details of your setup? ie ignition, injectors sizes etc?
[Edited on 16/9/08 by chasmon]
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Krismc
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| posted on 17/9/08 at 02:13 PM |
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kris.mcgough@sky.com if you could mate!!
im busy searching for the injector details, they are standard gxsr ones, when i told the lad who built my megasquirt he knew what they where from part
number and adjusted to map etc to suit. but his map didnt even start the car.
Built, Ivaed, Drove and now Sold - 2011 MNR VORTX RT+ 2000cc Zetec on R1 Throttle boddies.
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chasmon
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| posted on 18/9/08 at 08:26 PM |
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OK I will send the maps...
You will need to modify the TPS values in the fuel table for the Alpha_N one and also the req fuel, make this 0.64 times your suggested one in
Megaune... If you tell me which GSXR they came off I can advise! In MS1 the raw TPS values are used to you need to work these out from your setup.
If you use the Speed density Map go with the suggested req fuel and you shouldn't need to change much else. Maybe spark settings?
Cheers
Charlie
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Krismc
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| posted on 21/9/08 at 08:28 PM |
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cheers for that, im using k5 750 Tb's with standard injectors(not sure on size).
ive forwarded some inofr to the guy who has my car, but im not sure if he has had any luck!
Built, Ivaed, Drove and now Sold - 2011 MNR VORTX RT+ 2000cc Zetec on R1 Throttle boddies.
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martyn_16v
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| posted on 22/9/08 at 12:49 PM |
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We really need to be dealing with whoever is trying to get the tuning sorted direct. It's difficult enough to diagnose running problems over the
internet as it is, but relaying info between several people without actually knowing EXACTLY what the engine is/isn't doing isn't going to
get you anywhere.
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chasmon
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| posted on 22/9/08 at 05:27 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Krismc
cheers for that, im using k5 750 Tb's with standard injectors(not sure on size).
ive forwarded some inofr to the guy who has my car, but im not sure if he has had any luck!
Sorry for not replaying sooner but I have been bobbing around in the solent for the last few days
Your old map should be saved somewhere already as you would have had to load it in... Really don't want to get into step by step guides on how
to load a new map as I will likely miss something important and there is lots written on this already!
I know its daunting but you really would benefit from spending a few hours (that's genuinely all it is) reading the manuals accessible from the
megasquirt site and then posting specific questions you have.
Probably not what you want to hear but you need to be a little way along from how to load a map or save a map for help on here to be particularly
helpful... Chin up though it is worth it!
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Krismc
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| posted on 23/9/08 at 07:51 PM |
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Spent 20 hours reading it, but still not sinking in, im studying and also working 55hrs a week, plus being in scotland and flying to belfast on fri
doesn thelp!
cant get in touch with where my car is at moment so all this is on hold!
just thought i could get a company or a person to look at it, but seems there isnt one- i give up with this car, i finished the thing 2yrs ago, i wish
i hadnt took it off sale a year ago after every one on here said to carry on and complete it, and there would be loads off people with megasquirt info
and hands on be willing to help, and plenty of companys will tune it. well ive been emailed and talking none stop every night and dinner break, Now im
another £1k poorer and no further forward.
Built, Ivaed, Drove and now Sold - 2011 MNR VORTX RT+ 2000cc Zetec on R1 Throttle boddies.
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