mr henderson
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| posted on 23/5/08 at 07:56 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Macbeast
Police State ?
It depends what you mean by police state but -
You can be held without charge for 28 days and senior police want to extend this to 48 days
You can be convicted of downloading and reading (bomb-making) information from the internet even if they can't prove intention to use it.
CCTV cameras can track your car wherever it goes (except when it's stolen apparently)
The police can already demand details of your cellphone calls and there is a proposal to record details of all your landline calls and internet
surfing
If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck its name is probably Donald.
( I have no problem with individual rank and file police )
If you want to say that the government has got the balance between individual and community freedoms wrong (for instance, the freedom to download bomb
making instructions versus the freedom to be not blown up) then you should say that.
You should not suggest that the UK is a police state. Such a claim is beyond ridiculous. For more information on the subject of police states
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Police_state
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scootz
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| posted on 23/5/08 at 07:57 AM |
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Just so I understand your point...
There's around 90,000 police officers in the UK, and you've lost all respect for the whole organisation because of the actions of a tiny
minority?
So disgusted are you with this tiny minority that you are prepared to pounce on any reported hearsay and claim it as fact in order to add weight to
your agenda of Police bashing.
You then use this to make childish claims about us living in a Police State and suggesting that mob-rule would be a better alternative.
What about the 37 Officers murdered over the last two decades whilst in the line of duty.
I can't find figures of those who were killed in other circumstances whilst on duty (accidents), but I know it's a good deal more.
And what about the numbers of Officers SERIOUSLY injured in the line of duty - we're definately into the hundreds and possibly into the
thousands.
As I said before, I'm not a Police apologist - I've dealt with some great Police staff, and I've been unfortunate enough to deal
with some very poor Police staff... I do, however, have a degree of maturity that allows me to accept this.
People like you make me puke. You, and those like you, will eventually bring this country to its knees with your crass stupidity.
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oldtimer
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| posted on 23/5/08 at 08:10 AM |
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Tragedies like this accident really seem to polalize us all into 2 groups: The 'I hate the police' and the 'Hey, they're only
trying to do their job' factions. I hope the police car had working recording equipment so the real evidence can be proved one way or the other.
Police cars should not do 100mph through residential areas whilst looking for a stolen car, it's dangerous. It could be that he wasn't
doing 100mph, we don't know yet. When I was a firtefighter we would receive endless complaints for driving through residential areas under blues
and twos, so we were informed to switch off - even when we didn't feel it was safe to.
In our fire engine we would be called out to estates for non existant emergencies to be pelted with stones - very demoralising. Children apparently
deep in conversation would walk out infront of us on emergency calls just to cause near- or actual- accidents and run off laughing. IT HAPPENS. None
us us know what happened in this case yet.
Police state? I don't really think so. I suppose the people injured and the families of those killed in the London bombings wish the police had
had more powers, not less. If there were no gangs causing trouble the police wouldn't be there. If cars weren't stolen the police
wouldn't be looking for them, or persuing them. CCTV it has a role. 28 days for questioning (with the approval of a judge) may not be enough
when the law allows us to remain silent.
I have been on the receiving end of complaints from the public about speed used during an emergency call. People don't like it unless they are
the recipient of that help. People whose family are trapped in a burning building do not want you doing 30mph and waiting at traffic lights - they
want you now, now, now....
This poor girl has tragicly lost her life, her family must be shattered. She could have been home at that time of night , but she wasn't. The
police officer may be in shock too, his career over possibly, emotionally damaged too? - probably. There is no 'winner' only loosers.
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Macbeast
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| posted on 23/5/08 at 08:15 AM |
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Wikipedia -
The term police state is a term for a state in which the government exercises rigid and repressive controls over the social, economic and political
life of the population, especially by means of a secret police force which operates outside the boundaries normally imposed by a constitutional
republic. A police state typically exhibits elements of totalitarianism and social control, and there is usually little or no distinction between the
law and the exercise of political power by the executive.
Sounds about right, apart from "secret" don't you think ? 
But if it makes you happier - I think that the government has got the balance between individual and community freedoms wrong.
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mr henderson
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| posted on 23/5/08 at 08:32 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Macbeast
Wikipedia -
The term police state is a term for a state in which the government exercises rigid and repressive controls over the social, economic and political
life of the population, especially by means of a secret police force which operates outside the boundaries normally imposed by a constitutional
republic. A police state typically exhibits elements of totalitarianism and social control, and there is usually little or no distinction between the
law and the exercise of political power by the executive.
Sounds about right, apart from "secret" don't you think ?
No I don't. And the 'secret' is a big part of it. The police force in this country is not secret.
There is no part of your quote from the Wikipedia article that fits this country.
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trogdor
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| posted on 23/5/08 at 09:39 AM |
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quote:
When I was a firtefighter we would receive endless complaints for driving through residential areas under blues and twos, so we were informed to
switch off - even when we didn't feel it was safe to.
I can't believe that people would actually complain about sirens and lights! is totally mad! i used to live in southampton along one of the main
streets out of the city. Not kidding we would hear sirens going pass about 5 times a day. We were also close to the A&E hospital. People used to
find it amusing when they stayed over but not once would i consider complaining about it. They are there for such an obvious reason.
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MikeRJ
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| posted on 23/5/08 at 11:27 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by trogdor
I can't believe that people would actually complain about sirens and lights!
That's not the worst of it. Somewhere not too far from me (certainly not far enough), scum have been setting fire to cars, and then throwing
stones and bricks at the firemen when they turn up. It really makes me sick that people like this not only exist at all, but are rapidly growing in
numbers.
Liberal fools would say that they are a product of society, anyone with an ounce of sense knows they are mainly product of parents who don't
care and a pathetic law system that is powerless to touch them.
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mr henderson
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| posted on 23/5/08 at 11:39 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by MikeRJ
mainly product of parents who don't care and a pathetic law system that is powerless to touch them.
This is absolutely true, and funnily enough, if we did live in a police state then the police certainly would have the powers to
'touch' them (or much worse), but we don't.
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Paul TigerB6
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| posted on 23/5/08 at 03:10 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Macbeast
Wikipedia -
The term police state is a term for a state in which the government exercises rigid and repressive controls over the social, economic and political
life of the population, especially by means of a secret police force which operates outside the boundaries normally imposed by a constitutional
republic. A police state typically exhibits elements of totalitarianism and social control, and there is usually little or no distinction between the
law and the exercise of political power by the executive.
Sounds about right, apart from "secret" don't you think ?
Nahhhh - they just tax us all into submission in this country dont they!!
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