nickharding
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 06:16 PM |
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Which chassis? New Build!
Hello!
I have just joined the forum and after having a good read through some of the topics and threads on here this is just the site I needed to find.
I am just about to start building a Locost. This will be for track and also be made road legal.
After stumbling across a thread, I managed to find this link to some build plans...
http://mcsorley.squarespace.com/plans/
which I thought was fantastic! .. Apart from I am now faced with the problem of which one do I choose?
The engine I think I have come to a decision on will be a hayabusa turbo. Just unsure on the chassis?
I need some kind of plans to follow and also some help on decisions as I am new to this game.
My brother in law owns an R1 Westfield and it is brilliant. Want it to have the same handling as that. Stiff, strong and planted.
If someone could possibly offer there advice, or maybe share some ideas/plans with me. That would be great.
Many Thanks,
Nick Harding.
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theprisioner
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 06:50 PM |
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Sylva
The chassis of the Sylva is very strong and light. I am building one as I got dissulusioned with the chassis on my westfield.
http://sylvabuild.blogspot.co.uk/
It is one of the cheaper kits around!
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nickharding
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 07:03 PM |
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Thanks for getting back to me.
Just looked through the blog you posted and i want to keep it around the westfield/caterham/locost kind of shape and layout.
Been doing some reading between the 4 chassis builds in the link I posted.
Cant decide which of these ?
Could i have peoples input on these 4 options please? ...
1. Book Chassis - Plans , BOM/Cut list , IGES model
A more detailed and more accurate version of the design presented in Ron Champion's book, "Build Your Own Sports Car For As Little As £250
- And Race It!" There is also an Excel spreadsheet containing a bill of materials for the book chassis. Thanks to Vince Hotho and John
Nonnemacher,CPA for compiling the data and contributing the initial spreadsheets. Also available as a zipped IGES file for 3D CAD users.
2. McSorley 400 - Plans
An increase of 4" through the entire width of the chassis with subsequent changes to the diagonal members as needed. There are a few vendors
manufacturing a +4" nosecone by adding 4 inches clear down the center. This can also be accomplished at home with little effort. Standard front
wishbones should bolt right up assuming the track width of the donor axle is exactly 4" greater than the UK based Ford Escort Mk1 (the book
donor).
3. McSorley 442 - Plans
An increased width, length and height using the nosecone and suspension mounting points suggested by the book. The increased width exists through the
rear and the cockpit, while the front end is based on the book chassis and it uses a standard nosecone. The suspension brackets can be mounted
according to the layout provided by the book, but the length of the front wishbones should be customized to be sure the track width agrees with the
donor axle following assembly.
The increased length provides an additional two inches for the pedal box and another two inches in the engine bay. The increased height goes through
the horizontal portion of the chassis (forward of the dashboard) to balance the over all design and accommodate taller engines. A standard nosecone
that is 26 inches wide at a distance of 12 inches from the front should fit with little-to-no modification, although a tall "cowcatcher"
is called for to bridge the bottom of the taller chassis with the bottom of the relatively stout nosecone.
There are some vendors manufacturing nosecones that are taller than the book design to provide even more height for the engine. For example, Champion
Motor Cars used to produce an oversized nosecone that sits 13" below the top rails and an additional 1" above the top rails... placing a
full 23.5" under the bonnet while leaving a relatively small 2" gap along the bottom of the 442 chassis. This oversized nosecone is still
available from certain vendors. A standard book nosecone leaves a 5" gap along the bottom of this super-sized chassis, but the width is
spot-on.
McSorley 442E - Plans
An increased width/length/height of 4/4/2 inches (respectively) over the original book design throughout the entire chassis, requiring a wider
nosecone. Oversized nosecones are available from certain vendors, but I have not tested any of these options to see how they fit. The suspension
brackets can be mounted according to the layout provided by the book, but the length of the front wishbones should be customized to be sure the track
width agrees with the donor axle following assembly.
The increased length provides an additional four inches in the engine bay with a relatively "book" sized cockpit. The increased height
goes through the horizontal portion of the chassis (forward of the dashboard) to balance the over all design and accommodate taller engines.
I was thinking it would have to be between option 1 and 2?
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RAYLEE29
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 07:07 PM |
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Hi, if your serious about the racing side then you will need to decide what racing series your going for then that will pretty much decide what
chassis you will need.
Im sure someone with more knowledge will be along soon but dont choose a chassis and then look for a race series as you may not find one.
you dont want to build a car you cant race
Ray
build diary1
http://picasaweb.google.com/raylee290/RoadsterPics#
build diary2
http://picasaweb.google.com/raylee290/KITCARPICS?authkey=Gv1sRgCI2AouyYgpuQmAE#
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RAYLEE29
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 07:11 PM |
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btw just seen you want to build a hyabusua turbo best look to see if theres a race series for that.
you would prob be better of building something that fits in with a particular race series
Ray
build diary1
http://picasaweb.google.com/raylee290/RoadsterPics#
build diary2
http://picasaweb.google.com/raylee290/KITCARPICS?authkey=Gv1sRgCI2AouyYgpuQmAE#
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nickharding
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 07:12 PM |
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Hi Ray, thanks for your reply.
I wont be "racing" as such, will just be doing track days in it. not competitive racing.
Just something for a bit of fun for track and road that's all.
Do you have any experience with the "book chassis"?
Nick.
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wylliezx9r
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 07:19 PM |
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Busa turbo engine must be about 6k fully installed in a car, if I were spending out that sort of money on an engine alone I would want to put it in a
more up to date chassis. Mk indy r, mnr in board, mac 1 or similar is where I'd be looking.
That's my 2 pennys worth.
I spent a lot of money on booze, birds and fast cars. The rest I just squandered.
George Best
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nickharding
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 07:29 PM |
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Thanks for your input. Much apppriciated.
From what i can work out the chassis base model is around 2000? ... The westfield i have driven is 1994 and the thing is silly strong/stable.
I guess the chassis will be as up to date as i make it?
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fesycresy
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 07:41 PM |
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Totally agree, why put an expensive motor into a locost?
Westfield (with wide track) or Dax Rush would be my choice, search for Duncan Cowper.
Indy R's have good resale and seem to turn quick laps, search for Danny Keenan.
Have you looked at a Procomp chassis?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The sooner you fall behind, the more time you'll have to catch up.
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phelpsa
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 08:20 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by wylliezx9r
Busa turbo engine must be about 6k fully installed in a car, if I were spending out that sort of money on an engine alone I would want to put it in a
more up to date chassis. Mk indy r, mnr in board, mac 1 or similar is where I'd be looking.
That's my 2 pennys worth.
I wouldn't be looking at any of those. From what I've seen and experienced, if you want a good track car then you're better off
buying the most basic but well engineered chassis and then spending some money making it how you want it.
Those mentioned above are nice kits and reasonably easy to screw together, but you can do much better for the same money if you look in the right
places. Don't be fooled by shiny rod ends and inboard suspension
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Daddylonglegs
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 08:57 PM |
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All interestig stuff here, and seeing as no-one else has said it yet.....welcome to the forum 
It looks like the Midget is winning at the moment......
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nickharding
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 10:16 PM |
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Thanks for all the responses.
If truth be known, I wanted to build a westfield, but couldn't find ANY kind of build plans? I want to build the entire chassis my self and not
buy it in a kit form. So am not sure what to do?
Chose locost as i could find plans for them and i liked their design?
If someone could help me out with some plans or designs for one of the above said cars, that would be fantastic. Otherwise will have to be a locost.
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nickharding
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 10:43 PM |
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Just done some more reading.
Decided a locost is just what i need.
Will strengthen the chassis, make it super strong, and will also run a limited slip dif at the back instead of a live axle. Is that doable?
Be nice if someone could post a few pictures up of theirs.
Still learning the layout to the forum.
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wylliezx9r
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 11:11 PM |
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In that case why not a haynes roadster chassis? Little bit bigger than the original locost but independant rear suspension as standard and the choice
of sierra or mx5 donor which is a lot easier to come by than escort/cortina parts.
Sorry I misread, you can have a LSD live axle no need for any chassis alterations. The LSD is contained within the diff.
[Edited on 5/4/12 by wylliezx9r]
I spent a lot of money on booze, birds and fast cars. The rest I just squandered.
George Best
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trextr7monkey
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 11:14 PM |
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Hi and welcome, while you are busy researching and saving up your cash it might be worth hanging fire until Stoneleigh show so you can look at what
manufacturers have and look at cars people have built, all in one weekend.
You will hopefully find this forum a mighty resource to help you on your way and despite the name lots of people on here aren't bulding locosts-
they just have the locost mentality. Despite that it is worth supporting and chipping in your contribution to keep it all running.
One car not mentioned so far is the Haynes Roadster and while there is a seperate forum there is "consideable knowledge" of the car on
this site - not me  but take a look at Saturn sportscars who make the chassis and other bits; from my limited knowledge of it it is an
improved version of the locost style car without using the bed ends and oven shelves it willalso take bigger engines which may be of no interest to
you at the moment but your plans might change.....
atb
Mike
http://www.flickr.com/photos/14016102@N00/ (cut and paste this dodgey link)
Our most recent pics are here:
http://s129.photobucket.com/albums/p211/trextr7monkey/
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nickharding
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 11:22 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by wylliezx9r
In that case why not a haynes roadster chassis? Little bit bigger than the original locost but independant rear suspension as standard and the choice
of sierra or mx5 donor which is a lot easier to come by than escort/cortina parts.
Sorry I misread, you can have a LSD live axle no need for any chassis alterations. The LSD is contained within the diff.
[Edited on 5/4/12 by wylliezx9r]
Didn't want a live axle as they are very heavy. If I had just a LSD with independent suspension without the live axle, it would be much lighter,
therefore faster, giving the same result.
Is this how the haynes roadster is built? I looked at one of those before, think i may have forgot about them.
quote:
Originally posted by trextr7monkey
Hi and welcome, while you are busy researching and saving up your cash it might be worth hanging fire until Stoneleigh show so you can look at what
manufacturers have and look at cars people have built, all in one weekend.
You will hopefully find this forum a mighty resource to help you on your way and despite the name lots of people on here aren't bulding locosts-
they just have the locost mentality. Despite that it is worth supporting and chipping in your contribution to keep it all running.
One car not mentioned so far is the Haynes Roadster and while there is a seperate forum there is "consideable knowledge" of the car on
this site - not me but take a look at Saturn sportscars who make the chassis and other bits; from my limited knowledge of it it is an improved
version of the locost style car without using the bed ends and oven shelves it willalso take bigger engines which may be of no interest to you at the
moment but your plans might change.....
atb
Mike
Thank's very much for the welcome Mike. Am proud to be a signed up member. Seems to be lots of information and knowledgeable people on here.
Just up my street.
If the haynes roadster could be built without the live axle, and is a better build than the locost, maybe that is the way to go?
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wylliezx9r
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 11:47 PM |
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Haynes roadster has independent rear as standard. Depending on what diff you can get hold of determines whether it will be LSD or not. I have a sierra
xr4x4 diff on my car, this is a viscous LSD with a ratio of 3.64, with a zx9r engine installed this gives a top speed of around 110 mph which may not
be suited to track use.
I spent a lot of money on booze, birds and fast cars. The rest I just squandered.
George Best
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dave-69isit
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 11:50 PM |
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my vote
how about procomp race provern well designed orsome track record and real friendly staff he is on ear as procomp if not mnr most others are around
about the same but you get what you pay for
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nickharding
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| posted on 5/4/12 at 11:55 PM |
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That sounds interesting.
I would love to use a sierra diff, but cannot seem to find build plans to suit? I built a BMW r45 into a trike using a sierra diff. Brilliant.
The track racing I will be doing will be close circuit, such as castle coombe, llandow, cadwell. Etc. As far as im aware, the diff's from
sierra's are the same shape its just the different ratio's? If so I could change the diff depending on the track I am going to.
Thanks for your input Dave.
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Daddylonglegs
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| posted on 6/4/12 at 07:24 AM |
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As Mike said, might be well worth waiting until Stoneleigh as you'll get a huge range of options on show there., both manufactured and
self-builds (6th and 7th May)
JB
It looks like the Midget is winning at the moment......
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907
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| posted on 6/4/12 at 08:17 AM |
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Hi Nick,
My thoughts.
I started off with "the book" chassis drawing, but my philosophy is, "the drawing is only a guide".
Sat the engine on the bench and mocked up the engine bay chassis rails. Bu**er, needs to clear the cam drive wheel.
Two inches should do it, but to keep the engine on the centre line that's two inches either side. That's a plus.
Gearbox was a bit big, but hey, if I carry that extra four inches back to the scuttle it will go in. Another plus.
Nose now needs to be wider. Mmmm, that's not a plus. 
So if I keep the seat wells standard the seats fit and I fit in them. (just)
If I add the extra 4 inches to the width of the tranny tunnel then no clashing of elbows with the passenger
when I change gear. Yet another plus.
This wide tunnel just happens to be the width of a Sierra dif. One more plus.
If I brace the tunnel the same as the chassis sides I have a sort of backbone. A BIG plus.
The Sierra dif & drive shafts just happen to be four inches wider than an Escort axle. A lucky plus.
The rear panel and scuttle has to be made to suit from ally.
So four inches wider down the centre it is then.
Now adding up and subtracting all the 's I come up with the reason my chassis is a "+4".
As it's stainless and I don't need to paint it. Does that make it a plus five? Probably not.
(Pics in my archive)
Cheers,
Paul G
[Edited on 6/4/12 by 907]
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thesecondprize
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| posted on 6/4/12 at 08:18 AM |
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Build plans for the Haynes Roadster (using Sierra diff and gives independent rear suspension) can be found in this book:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Build-Your-Own-Sports-Car/dp/1844253910/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1333700208&sr=8-1
HTH,
Pete
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nickharding
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| posted on 6/4/12 at 10:37 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by wylliezx9r
Haynes roadster has independent rear as standard. Depending on what diff you can get hold of determines whether it will be LSD or not. I have a sierra
xr4x4 diff on my car, this is a viscous LSD with a ratio of 3.64, with a zx9r engine installed this gives a top speed of around 110 mph which may not
be suited to track use.
Just reread your post this morning about you using a sierra diff. From the chassis you have built which I saw in your photo archive, are you using a
full sierra width back end?
If so, you you follow the standard roadster plans? or did you make adaptations to get it all in?
quote:
Originally posted by thesecondprize
Build plans for the Haynes Roadster (using Sierra diff and gives independent rear suspension) can be found in this book:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Build-Your-Own-Sports-Car/dp/1844253910/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1333700208&sr=8-1
HTH,
Pete
Hi Pete.
You say this uses the Sierra LSD and independent suspension, is this to the full Sierra back end width in the plans? .. i know they have a wide back
end which would be fantastic for grip.
quote:
Originally posted by Daddylonglegs
As Mike said, might be well worth waiting until Stoneleigh as you'll get a huge range of options on show there., both manufactured and
self-builds (6th and 7th May)
JB
Will have to try and come along! .. be great to see other peoples builds.
Thanks for your input Paul. That gives me some good ideas or what problems i may run into along the way.
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nickharding
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| posted on 7/4/12 at 03:12 PM |
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Right, after doing lots of reasearch this morning i have managed to find a PDF version of "Build your own sports car on a budget" book.
Downloaded and is currently printing out. All 192 pages :O
Looks like I have a start.
Better start looking for a donor car
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AdrianH
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| posted on 7/4/12 at 03:53 PM |
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Depending on which book version the pdf is based on, there could be errors if it was the first release.
Go on to the roadster forum and at least download the book amendments.
If all seems to be OK then buy the latest version to give you something simple to work from.
The book is based on Sierra engine etc, if going down the BEC route then the tunnel could be modified to make narrower and the foot wells to give you
more space.
There are a few companies making bodywork for the roadster so that would also help.
Another vote to wait until Stoneleigh.
Welcome to the mad house.
Adrian
[Edited on 7-4-12 by AdrianH]
Why do I have to make the tools to finish the job? More time then money.
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