MkIndy7
|
| posted on 1/1/11 at 10:55 AM |
|
|
Another knackerd battery type puzzle
I'm abit puzzled and I'm quite sure it's probably the battery it here goes
My rarely used Tin top with a big Halfords Calcium battery will sit for a couple of weeks, start first turn of the key no hesitation what so ever..
And can be re-started many times.
Move it a short distance or even a long one last nights was a 2hr motorway drive lock it up again and within a couple of hours the battery is so flat
it won't even light the alarm LED's (or fire the de-locked central locking.. Just to give you all a laugh) 
It's done this a few times now so ATM I'm stuck out of the car but unsure of weather to buy jump leads and jump it off again and test the
alternator or just go get a new Lead battery as these calcium ones seem to really suffer from neglect.
[Edited on 1/1/11 by MkIndy7]
|
|
|
|
|
CRAIGR
|
| posted on 1/1/11 at 10:56 AM |
|
|
Very mysterious
|
|
|
MakeEverything
|
| posted on 1/1/11 at 11:01 AM |
|
|
buggered if i know...
Kindest Regards,
Richard.
...You can make it foolProof, but youll never make it Idiot Proof!...
|
|
|
lewis
|
| posted on 1/1/11 at 11:10 AM |
|
|
Loose earth lead not allowing it to charge properly? Or intermittent fault with alt?
|
|
|
jacko
|
| posted on 1/1/11 at 11:10 AM |
|
|
Boot light on all night ?
|
|
|
r1_pete
|
| posted on 1/1/11 at 11:12 AM |
|
|
Thats pretty much what happened with the Halfords Calcium battery on my Jaguar, has been ok through the summer, used perhaps once a week, then a
couple of months lay up and it was knackered. Took it back to Halfords and they confirmed it had failed, and replaced it under the 4 year warranty.
I am however, thinking the alternator may be over charging now, which will quickly kill the battery, but I havent checked it yet, considering taking
it off nad getting it tested professionally.
|
|
|
MkIndy7
|
| posted on 1/1/11 at 11:17 AM |
|
|
There never seems any indication of a fault when the car is running..
The lights stay bright had headlights on for 2hrs last night and although the stereo sucks some juice the alternator should be well upto it... The
Voltmeter on the Dash will have been in a normal enough position aswell I doubt the battery would have lasted that long on it's own if the
alternator wasn't working in some capacity.
It just seems like it's power soaks away a few hours after use unless it's fully charged when you start using it...
|
|
|
BigLee
|
| posted on 1/1/11 at 11:18 AM |
|
|
Could it be as simple as a dodgy connection? I've heard similar symptoms on a brand new golf. Cleaned the terminals, fresh grease, tightened
everything up and never had a problem since.
Occam's Razor - the simplest explanation is most likely to be the correct one.
|
|
|
iceman26
|
| posted on 1/1/11 at 11:33 AM |
|
|
what car is it?
|
|
|
MkIndy7
|
| posted on 1/1/11 at 11:34 AM |
|
|
The car get quite reasonable attention.. So hopefully simple things like the connections are tight.. The ones on the back of the alternator is a
multipliug held with a spring clip.. And I've run an extra earth from the alternator body directly to the battey.
I think what puzzles me most if that it starts on the button and will re-start many times, yet you leave it a few hours after a single start and
differing driving miles/times and 2hrs later its as dead as a dodo
|
|
|
Bluemoon
|
| posted on 1/1/11 at 11:47 AM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by MkIndy7
The car get quite reasonable attention.. So hopefully simple things like the connections are tight.. The ones on the back of the alternator is a
multipliug held with a spring clip.. And I've run an extra earth from the alternator body directly to the battey.
I think what puzzles me most if that it starts on the button and will re-start many times, yet you leave it a few hours after a single start and
differing driving miles/times and 2hrs later its as dead as a dodo
Check residual current draw on battery, boot light stuck on ect seems most likely explanation..
[Edited on 1/1/11 by Bluemoon]
|
|
|
ReMan
|
| posted on 1/1/11 at 12:45 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by MkIndy7
I'm abit puzzled and I'm quite sure it's probably the battery it here goes
My rarely used Tin top with a big Halfords Calcium battery will sit for a couple of weeks, start first turn of the key no hesitation what so ever..
And can be re-started many times.
Move it a short distance or even a long one last nights was a 2hr motorway drive lock it up again and within a couple of hours the battery is so flat
it won't even light the alarm LED's (or fire the de-locked central locking.. Just to give you all a laugh)
It's done this a few times now so ATM I'm stuck out of the car but unsure of weather to buy jump leads and jump it off again and test the
alternator or just go get a new Lead battery as these calcium ones seem to really suffer from neglect.
[Edited on 1/1/11 by MkIndy7]
On what you're sayng, with this fault, how do you get it to the good state where you can leave it for 2 weeks and it be alright?
Before the 2 hours is up after the drive does it start ok?
It does sound like there is a drain going on in this time, but also the possibility that the battey recovers some charge in the 2 weeks when you try
it again?
|
|
|
onenastyviper
|
| posted on 1/1/11 at 12:51 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by ReMan
quote:
Originally posted by MkIndy7
I'm abit puzzled and I'm quite sure it's probably the battery it here goes
My rarely used Tin top with a big Halfords Calcium battery will sit for a couple of weeks, start first turn of the key no hesitation what so ever..
And can be re-started many times.
Move it a short distance or even a long one last nights was a 2hr motorway drive lock it up again and within a couple of hours the battery is so flat
it won't even light the alarm LED's (or fire the de-locked central locking.. Just to give you all a laugh)
It's done this a few times now so ATM I'm stuck out of the car but unsure of weather to buy jump leads and jump it off again and test the
alternator or just go get a new Lead battery as these calcium ones seem to really suffer from neglect.
[Edited on 1/1/11 by MkIndy7]
On what you're sayng, with this fault, how do you get it to the good state where you can leave it for 2 weeks and it be alright?
Before the 2 hours is up after the drive does it start ok?
It does sound like there is a drain going on in this time, but also the possibility that the battey recovers some charge in the 2 weeks when you try
it again?
Perhaps there is something staying on when you drive the car which does not activate when you just start it up. Is it a modern car with an advanced
ECU which controls/monitors almost everything or does the ECU only control the engine?
|
|
|
MkIndy7
|
| posted on 1/1/11 at 01:00 PM |
|
|
It's a Vauxhall Redtop running all the standard ECU and alternator etc.
Sometimes it's been on a run etc then parked up for a few weeks.. Others it's been on a AutoXS maintance type charger and then been
unplugged for a while.. But it'll start on the button. It's like it can handle a big drain and a few starts but once it has a little
remedial drain kills it.
Got the car open and found I'd left the interior light on Doh! A 5 led festoon type bulb.. From 6pm and the clock stopped at 5am on a 63A
battery!
|
|
|
cliftyhanger
|
| posted on 1/1/11 at 01:18 PM |
|
|
And the led uses vitually no current, the battery should run it for a few weeks (maybe)
Anyway, I would suggest a digital or accurate analogue voltmeter, read the voltage before starting, at idle and at higher RPM. And when off, with all
lights etdc etc etc on to give a bit of current drain.
I had a car where the battery kept going flat. That was the alternator putting out 17-19volts, overcharging flattened the battery after a run. Sounds
similar.
|
|
|
RazMan
|
| posted on 1/1/11 at 01:37 PM |
|
|
I had a very similar problem on SWMBO's Hyundai. After running faultlessly for months it suddenly shows no life at all and even the in-dash volt
meter shows zero. After a jump start it carried on as if nothing has happened, even if it was stopped immediately after the jump start. It turned out
to be a battery connection which, although appearing to be tight, just needed a clean - no problems since. It is surprising how much resistance a
slightly dirty connection can produce - certainly enough to completely disconnect the battery in my case.
Cheers,
Raz
When thinking outside the box doesn't work any more, it's time to build a new box
|
|
|
MkIndy7
|
| posted on 1/1/11 at 03:03 PM |
|
|
Yeh Gunna have to have a real methodical look and a good test of everything, there's been some good pointers to try.
Drove it the 100miles or so home, with minimal drain on the volt gauge got from 12v when it had just been jumped off upto 15v in about 15mins then
when I started putting the lights on full and cranking the stereo and subs up it would drop to about 13.5 but no lower (even with the heated rear
screen on) and would recover to 15v a couple of mins after the load was reduced so all was pretty much as expected.
Obv need to try with a proper multimer etc but on face value that would seem ok?
|
|
|
onenastyviper
|
| posted on 2/1/11 at 01:22 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by MkIndy7
Yeh Gunna have to have a real methodical look and a good test of everything, there's been some good pointers to try.
Drove it the 100miles or so home, with minimal drain on the volt gauge got from 12v when it had just been jumped off upto 15v in about 15mins then
when I started putting the lights on full and cranking the stereo and subs up it would drop to about 13.5 but no lower (even with the heated rear
screen on) and would recover to 15v a couple of mins after the load was reduced so all was pretty much as expected.
Obv need to try with a proper multimer etc but on face value that would seem ok?
Shouldn't it read near 15V across the battery as soon as the engine is running and the alternator has started charging the battery?
I would not expect a 15minute delay. Perhaps this is a clue?
Can you get the battery/alternator load tested locally?
|
|
|
MkIndy7
|
| posted on 6/1/11 at 11:15 AM |
|
|
Not been very well over the last few days so finally got chance to go out and give it a quick test last night.
On the previous point about expecting it to come upto 15V as soon as the engine was started, it probably came upto 13.5 instantly but untill it was
jumped off, the battery was totally flat (the jumpleads had to be on for over 5 mins before it would even think of turning over) and the clock had
even stopped so maybe thats why it took a while to come upto 15V?..
Right last nights testing after being stood since NYD:
12.5v at the battery at rest
12.0v It Dropped to when the Ignition came on
10.0v It Dropped to when the engine was cranking
15.0v As soon as the engine was running
14.0v when a big load was switched on i.e Headlights and came back to 15v after 15-20 sec maybe less
All these voltages were measured directly at the battery and appear to show the internal Voltmeter bar graph type indicator as correct, even when the
voltage dropped to 10v at cranking so it reacts pretty quickly.
All the battery connections appeared to be tight but haven't yet checked for corrosion or them getting hot when the engines been running for a
while.
So all that seems reasonably correct and expected?... I suppose the acid test will be what its like when I try again today!.
|
|
|
vinny1275
|
| posted on 6/1/11 at 01:16 PM |
|
|
wonder if it'll be fine now the weather has warmed up. The battery in swmbo's 5 series gave up the ghost as soon as the minus 5's
came....
|
|
|
MkIndy7
|
| posted on 6/1/11 at 03:31 PM |
|
|
Hmm and today's findings..
Battery voltage was down to 12.4v so only lost 0.1v standing overnight and having started the engine last night and only briefly recharged itself.
It started the car with all the same results as before, took it for a 15min drive and towards the end of the journey it dropped below 15v on the volt
gauge with minimal load on and didn't recover, sat outside the shop for 20mins with the engine running (long enough for the fan to come on) and
it never came back up to 15v... Checked at the battery and it was now only charging at 14v even if you raised the rev's.
Turned the engine off and listened to the radio only for about 5 mins and when restarting the engine the battery dropped to 9v or below when cranking
the car and it sounded slow to turnover.
Drove the car for a further 10mins so am expecting the bloody thing to be flat when I go back to it, it does maybe seem heat related as running it
seems to finish it off.
|
|
|
