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Bleedin Clutch!

oliwb - 10/9/08 at 12:19 PM

Need some help and inspiration....
I'm trying to bleed my hydraulic clutch and it just isn't playing ball with me! So far I have tried:
- the normal 2 person open + close operation,
- a fancy draper air compressor vacuum pressure bleeder thing,
- a piece of clear pipe and me sucking (not very pleasant!)
- a syringe and brake fluid trying to push it back up through the system from the bleed nipple,
- repeated stamping on the pedal and a lot of swearing!
So far I have managed to achieve pretty much nothing....I originally set the pedal height to the haynes book of lies spec which prevented me from even getting fluid to go down the system. I gave up and released the adjustment on the pedal so that the cylinder was at rest with the bleed nipple and managed to get fluid pouring out on the floor. I then re-attached the pipe and started bleeding and loads of bubbles came out then stopped. Success I thought but the pedal still has no pressure on it at all and clutch doesn't move. I'm totally tearing my hair out as there must be a big air lock in the top of the system but I don't seem to be able to get rid of it! Anyone got any suggestions??? Cheers. Oli.

NS Dev - 10/9/08 at 12:26 PM

what slave cylinder and what gearbox?

Mr Whippy - 10/9/08 at 12:32 PM

if you repeatably stamp on the pedal it should, even with air in it get a bit firmer. As for beading it, possibly air is getting in past the bleed screw thread, a bit of PTE tape will seal that up. Do you get a good jet of fluid coming out the bleed screw when the pedals pressed, if not perhaps the seal in the cylinder has reversed. Try also tapping the pipe and cylinders to encourage the bubbles inside to join up and dislodge. Is there any loops in the pipe that could trap air? You might need someone to pour fluid into the reservoir while you stamp away so that the bubbles are dragged down.

cars are immune to swearing, doesn't bother them one bit

[Edited on 10/9/08 by Mr Whippy]

oliwb - 10/9/08 at 12:38 PM

Sorry forgot to mention is actually on a series 3 landrover. The master and slave cylinders are both brand new so should be sealing OK etc. The pipe does come out of the master cylinder verticaly upwards and bends down into the engine bay (will try to post a pic later). At one point it is higher than the reservoir. I suspect this was the problem so we cut the bottom off a bottle and used PTFE and brute force to wedge it into the inlet without leaking then filled it up effectively raising the level and volume of the reservoir by about 4 inches and half a litre.....still no joy though. I haven't tried to see if a better stream comes out when pressing the pedal with the bleed nipple out yet. Oli.

02GF74 - 10/9/08 at 01:07 PM

quote:
Originally posted by oliwb
Sorry forgot to mention is actually on a series 3 landrover. The master and slave cylinders are both brand new so should be sealing OK etc.

If they are Britparts, don't be so sure. there are many a horror story about faulty hydraulic parts by this brand (brakes/master etc).

I have one too (S2 LWT) and not too long ago replaced the steel line with copper as well as braided hose and the internals of slave. The two person bleeding worked fine - it doesn't matter that the lines go above the master.

Are you sure the push rod has not dropped out of position in the slave/bell housing? (I believe this is a common problem, some plasticky clip to hold it in place falls off)

The only other option is to remove the slave, cable tie it up so that the slave piston cannot move and keeping the bleed nipple upper most, bleed and refit it.

Another trick is to wedge a block of wood against the clutch pedal and leave it overnight - the theory being that the constant pressure somehow encourages the bubbles out of the system.

[Edited on 10/9/08 by 02GF74]

froggy - 10/9/08 at 01:12 PM

take the slave cyl off and push the rod right in so no fluil can get into the cyl bore once thats done get an assistant to do short strokes til the rod is pushed right to the end of the slave cyl .then re fit the slave so thaat the rod is pushed back up the cyl as you fit it.this gives you the best pedal with just a touch of pressure gainst the clutch arm, i do this on landy,s tr,s and tr7,s

Mr Whippy - 10/9/08 at 01:15 PM

Can you remove the slave and clamp it with a G-clamp so the piston won't move. Then hold it up just below the reservoir bottle. Doing that might encourage any bubbles to go up to the bleed screw when you press the pedal. I’ve owned 4 landys, your lucky that’s all that’s broken , isn't a SWB with a capstan winch welded to the front? Had a red one too (didn’t do a good job of spraying it red), my LWB ended up being sprayed metallic red, looked quite cool, had a SI SWB but what a banger it was

[Edited on 10/9/08 by Mr Whippy]

oliwb - 10/9/08 at 01:32 PM

No I've just welded the bulkhead (again), a chassis leg, replaced the brake master and all 4 slave cylinders, drums, pads and adjusters, a new prop shaft, 2 new shock absorbers, 2 wiper arms, rebuilt the rear axle and diff with new bearings and seals, a rear number plate has been replaced, some more bodywork (rusty door frame), new floor, new speedo cable and the clutch stuff. Everything has been going quite well including a rebuild of the steering box....until now! Just can't get it to do what I want it to do!! Will give that a try.....don't remember having put on a plastic clip.....don't remember taking one off either though.....Oli.

Mr Whippy - 10/9/08 at 01:45 PM

quote:
Originally posted by oliwb
No I've just welded the bulkhead (again), a chassis leg, replaced the brake master and all 4 slave cylinders, drums, pads and adjusters, a new prop shaft, 2 new shock absorbers, 2 wiper arms, rebuilt the rear axle and diff with new bearings and seals, a rear number plate has been replaced, some more bodywork (rusty door frame), new floor, new speedo cable and the clutch stuff. Everything has been going quite well including a rebuild of the steering box....until now! Just can't get it to do what I want it to do!! Will give that a try.....don't remember having put on a plastic clip.....don't remember taking one off either though.....Oli.

ah just the standard service then...

02GF74 - 10/9/08 at 02:28 PM

quote:
Originally posted by oliwb
No I've just welded the bulkhead (again), a chassis leg, replaced the brake master and all 4 slave cylinders, drums, pads and adjusters, a new prop shaft, 2 new shock absorbers, 2 wiper arms, rebuilt the rear axle and diff with new bearings and seals, a rear number plate has been replaced, some more bodywork (rusty door frame), new floor, new speedo cable and the clutch stuff. Everything has been going quite well including a rebuild of the steering box....until now!

like Tirgger's broom then!

how did you get the drop arm off?

re: clip - maybe that is defender? but check the rod is pushing against yhjr clutch release thingamy - what you describe kinda points it doesn't.

irvined - 10/9/08 at 03:34 PM

Went through a similar problem with a friends S3 after an engine rebuild - it can be a bar steward to bleed, it took us a full afternoon of faffing, we used the engine hoist (Handy things those) to lift the landrover up so that the slave cyl was as high as we could get it, then we clamped the piston as far in as we could. I can't remember if I went home to get the eezibleed or if we pumped like a pumpy thing, but that did it in the end.

oliwb - 11/9/08 at 06:53 AM

Ahhh, I see which plastic clip you mean now! Thought you meant on the slave cylinder end rather the the clutch release fork. I think its OK in the bellhousing but since I'll have to take the cylinder off to try Froggy's suggestion I can check anyway....fingers crossed that it'll do its stuff eventually!

Such a hateful job...came out from under the car night before last having had a shower in DOT 4! Yuck!
Thanks for the help guys I'll let you know if it works out! Oli.