SteveWallace
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| posted on 16/2/15 at 09:22 AM |
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Insurance Fraud Question
My ex and my daughter were sat at a red light the other day minding their own business when they were hit from behind by a private hire taxi. The
taxi driver was the only person in the other car. My ex's car received damage to the rear bumper and the taxi ended up with front end damage.
No one was hurt, insurance details were exchanged at the scene and, as both vehicles were still drivable, no one else needed to be involved. My
daughter took pictures of the damage but not the wider context.
A few days later, my ex finds out from her insurers that the taxi driver is claiming that my ex had over shot the red light and that the accident was
caused by her reversing back over the stop line. Furthermore, he is claiming that there were two passengers in his taxi and that all three of them
have whiplash injuries, which they are also claiming for. Presumably he feels the need to add the two extra mates so that his witnesses outnumber my
ex's as well as to make some money from the claim.
My question is, are the insurers likely to believe this complete fabrication either i) entirely and therefore hold my ex fully liable, ii) decide that
there is enough doubt to decide that its a 50:50 claim (my ex still looses her no claims despite being the innocent party), or iii) throw it out and
potentially do the taxi driver for making a fraudulent claim.
Any thoughts would be appreciated, particularly from people who have had a similar experience or from any insurers on here.
By the way if, by a wild coincidence, the taxi driver happens to be a member on here, you should be ashamed of yourself and even if you were stupid
enough to make yourself known, you are no doubt too cowardly to do so.
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joneh
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| posted on 16/2/15 at 09:45 AM |
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My first step would be get a police report and check the area for cameras (inc any home CCTV)
Not only that, surely any insurance investigator would be surprised to see whiplash from reversing, as she'd need to be going at a fair pace!
She'd probably would have needed to over shoot the lights by 20ft to get enough speed up in reverse, by which time she's crossed the
junction!
[Edited on 16/2/15 by joneh]
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r1_pete
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| posted on 16/2/15 at 10:02 AM |
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Lying cheating git is just trying to cover his loss of earnings...
Tell her to use the legal protection and get the lawyers involved, she can choose a specialist she doesn't have to use the insurance appointed
lawyers. They will pull in whatever investigators they need..
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rotax78
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| posted on 16/2/15 at 10:19 AM |
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Similar thing happened to me sat at lights, hit from behind, one driver and passenger in the car that hit us, he claimed there was five in the car.
Insurance asked us to go and see their lawyers/solicitors on John Street Manchester to make a statement. Our claim went through no problem and they
went after the fraudulent driver.
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britishtrident
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| posted on 16/2/15 at 11:32 AM |
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I think your ex-s' insurance company will launch an investigation usually people involved in this kind of scam will show up on claims data
bases.
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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motorcycle_mayhem
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| posted on 16/2/15 at 11:48 AM |
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Is it just me, or is the urge to have video cameras pointing out of the vehicle now more of a good idea?
I've had one reasonable experience of a crash perpetrator in recent years, a youngster not seeing my LWB white van, towing a huge white BJ
Shuttle on a roundabout. He just went straight head on into the side of the trailer. The police were involved, the youngster was honest.
Others have not been so honest:
Turning right off the A14 (if you know it) into the Science Park at Milton. Car waiting in front reversed into me, claimed I'd hit him. No
witnesses. I protested, but lost, judged to be 100% at fault. The other driver sustained 'serious' injuries that (a) must have cost the
insurers one helluva lot and (b) destroyed my insurance credibility for 5 years.
Woking road, 30 mph zone, coming out of Guildford. My right of way, I was SMIDSY'd by a guy in a very posh Mercedes, which I T-boned. Again, no
witnesses wanted to get involved, he put his hands up and apologised, we exchanged details. Later, I'm a reckless driver doing 70 mph (if only,
we're talking about a SIIa 2286 Diesel here), smashed out on drugs and alcohol, failing to stop. Police came to the house dressed to kill, to
find me with the guys details (incorrect ones) on paper, assumed I'd fabricated them, etc. etc. etc., nasty. Turns out later that the guy
didn't have a valid UK permit to drive, he was just trying to generate a smokescreen, looking at the whole thing as a money making opportunity.
Not a pleasant experience.
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SteveWallace
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| posted on 16/2/15 at 12:16 PM |
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I think your right. I've just been given a video camera for my birthday - primarily for use as a helmet cam for skiing (just got back from a
great trip to the Italian Alps) and for the kit car if I ever get around to doing a track day.
However, it also has a setting where it continuously records video in 5 minute chunks and then starts to over write the oldest one when the memory is
full. This is specifically designed for continuous recording from the dashboard so that you have a record of any incidents. Very popular in places
like Russia now and I can see it going that way here.
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steve m
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| posted on 16/2/15 at 01:01 PM |
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I was only thinking last night (while watching a police camera type of programme) that I should really put my camera in my tin top, as that does
about 10k a year, against the 7, that does 1.5k ish per annum
Thats was probably spelt wrong, or had some grammer, that the "grammer police have to have a moan at
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ReMan
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| posted on 16/2/15 at 01:09 PM |
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Yep thinking about one myself too.
So which one do we get ast a reasonable budget?
www.plusnine.co.uk
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Slimy38
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| posted on 16/2/15 at 01:21 PM |
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I got this one for my car;
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/like/221654696205
It's very good quality, number plates become visible at about 50 metres and it works well in dusky conditions. I put mine pointing out the
front, I figured if I get hit from behind then nine times out of ten it goes the way of the guy behind. And a camera looking forward would still show
movement at the time of impact (so no possibility of the guy saying I'd reversed into him!).
A bit of footage (not mine!);
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pytikpEJpgU
[Edited on 16/2/15 by Slimy38]
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craig1410
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| posted on 16/2/15 at 01:25 PM |
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I got one of these a few months ago. http://www.dod-tech.co.uk/ls460w.html
Not cheap but fully featured and has exceptional video quality and reliable GPS etc. I couldn't be happier.
I've already got a folder full of 'incidents' on my computer... My favourite is a "safety" camera van tailgating (less
than a car's length behind) another vehicle at 60MPH.
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trextr7monkey
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| posted on 16/2/15 at 01:38 PM |
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Back to the original post I was going to work one morning stopped at the lights when a car driven by an executive prick from the local building
society came shooting over the hill and tail ended me. With hindsight I think he was on his phone.
l hopped out bloke admitted it was his fault I took pics of my car his car and the whole situation which was just as well as the number plate details
he gave me didn’t tally with the photos which I sent to my insurers.
It all got settled but what cheesed me off is that every time anyone in my family gets car insurance this incident has to be declared they say it
doesn't affect premiums but I am not convinced
http://www.flickr.com/photos/14016102@N00/ (cut and paste this dodgey link)
Our most recent pics are here:
http://s129.photobucket.com/albums/p211/trextr7monkey/
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britishtrident
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| posted on 16/2/15 at 06:56 PM |
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Minor point but whiplash is more usually associated with rear impact, and side impact, whiplash from a low speed frontal impact it would be less
common..
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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joneh
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| posted on 16/2/15 at 07:14 PM |
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Put a sign up at the scene and see if a witness comes forward. Someone on here might have seen it and would be independant ...
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lsdweb
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| posted on 16/2/15 at 07:16 PM |
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I have a £20 camera off ebay that runs non stop. Used it once to complain about a school bus that pulled out in front of me. Bus company didn't
want to know until I mentioned the video..! It has GPS but that's way off!
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mark chandler
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| posted on 16/2/15 at 07:49 PM |
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She needs to get back in touch with her insurers an scream fraud at them, they should send someone around to take a statement.
For myself I was sucked into back ending a car, where they pull away mid junction then slam on the brakes, no damage to my car they got taken to
court.
Typical is to increase from 1 driver by includeing two passengers, especially if the car is worthless which they batter you with. They will have a
track record so just assume it was a planned accident, not that such a thing exists.
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NigeEss
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| posted on 16/2/15 at 11:29 PM |
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I'm currently going through a similar situation, nudged from behind, only damage to car behind are a tiny scuff on the bumper and
a cracked number plate from my tow bar, not a mark on my van. He's claiming I reversed and says the car going the other way that I
stopped to let past has come forward as a witness. As it's now two against one my insurance said I have little chance of success. The
only saving grace is the witness statement contradicts itself and my insurance is citing a particular case that denied injury compensation
as the speed was too low to have caused any. So I'm currently awaiting a court date as I'm refusing to back down.
Time is an illusion. Lunchtime doubly so.................Douglas Adams.
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SteveWallace
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| posted on 17/2/15 at 05:09 PM |
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Thanks for the advice and for the shared experiences. By coincidence, I had to talk to my insurer today and I asked them what their reaction would
be. The response was that unless an independent third party came forward with evidence or unless the taxi driver had a record of fraudulent claims,
the insurers would likely just regard it as one persons word against the other and therefore treat it as a 50:50.
Not very fair and leaves honest people open to being taken advantage of.!!
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yngndrw
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| posted on 19/3/15 at 01:47 PM |
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I think the whiplash claim may be the thing that saves her here as it's rather hard to see how that's even possible from what they are
claiming to have happened.
I once saw on a police crash program that when doing crash scene forensics they can tell if a car's brake lights are on (Assuming they
aren't LED.) by checking the bulb's filament for melted glass / plastic fragments. (The bulb's filament would be white hot if it was
on at the time the collision occurred.) The same would be true for the reverse lights. (But again, this assumes they are regular bulbs and not LEDs.)
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SteveWallace
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| posted on 19/3/15 at 05:01 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by yngndrw
I think the whiplash claim may be the thing that saves her here as it's rather hard to see how that's even possible from what they are
claiming to have happened.
I think that you might be right. Judging by the questions that the insurance company is asking now, I think that they are smelling a rat. As you say
its hard to see how three grown men could all get whiplash from a car allegedly reversing into them at slow speed (as can be seen by the low level of
damage).
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trextr7monkey
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| posted on 19/3/15 at 08:26 PM |
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Just a quick extra to my post above, the " no fault claim " that I have had to declare on every policy I am on (currently 6 family
cars) has suddenly started to cost. I took out a policy in my name with wife's sister as named driver limited mileage so she can be independent
when she visits. Policy is through Sykes but with a firm called Sabre who wanted an extra £25 when they heard about it. I called foul Sykes threw
in £10 which was the fee they received resulting fee was still less than next quote and if I pulled out altogether they wanted about 70% of the
total premium for About a weeks insurance.
So Nigel stick your guns I hope you see true justice
Atb
Mike
http://www.flickr.com/photos/14016102@N00/ (cut and paste this dodgey link)
Our most recent pics are here:
http://s129.photobucket.com/albums/p211/trextr7monkey/
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Scuzzle
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| posted on 19/3/15 at 11:19 PM |
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A video camera is a must these days but everyone has theirs pointing forwards, nobody ever thinks to point one rearwards as we all think the law is
irrefutable in that if someone runs up the back of you then they are at fault. This reversing back after overshooting a red light is something
I've never even considered.
Obviously the taxi driver is a total chancer and you have to stick to your guns and be adamant that his story is all lies.
I use a Mini 0801 which does the job great
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZdPHXv8Hzj8
If you go for the one without the GPS logger it's a lot cheaper.
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