ned
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 08:13 AM |
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Migrants
Just reading this and wondered what other peoples thoughts are on the matter:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/6226217.stm
Presumably in the news due to Romania and Bulgaria joining the EU and thus making it easier for more eastern block people to come to the uk.
If it benefits each of us 4p a day how much are the migrants getting out of us per day do you think? (not a trick question, try to decide whether it
actually adds up!)
Ned.
hm maybe this guy has already answered my question:
"The main beneficiaries are the immigrants themselves who are able to send home about £10m a day, not the host nation"
Sir Andrew Green, Migrationwatch UK
[Edited on 3/1/07 by ned]
beware, I've got yellow skin
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flak monkey
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 08:23 AM |
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One of my relatives is a manger at an agricultural business and she recently said about some migrant workers they have working for them.
The ones in case were Polish and she couldnt find anything bad to say about them. They were empolyed through an employment agency and were getting
paid minimum wage, which the EA was then taking a cut of, what they actually took home was a very small amount, but much more than they would earn at
home. The one thing she could not believe is how willing they were to work. They all turned up for work on time, worked damn hard all day (we are
talking pretty heavy manual labour in warehouses, fields here) and and many stayed on after hours to help in any way they could, often for no extra
pay. They have both male and female workers doing the sae jobs too. She said they are the best workers she has ever had and thats saying something,
and they are all very friendly. Maybe if some Brits were like that there wouldnt be any jobs for immigrants to work in...
She also said that there were no native British applicants for the jobs that were on offer.
And yes they even paid their taxes and sent money home to their families in their own countries.
David
PS it shold also be pointed out that this country is still 96% white/caucasian/christian. Which is very evident when i am at home, and in most places
other than cities in the UK.
[Edited on 3/1/07 by flak monkey]
Sera
http://www.motosera.com
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theconrodkid
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 08:26 AM |
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quote"ooooh poor england,they are struggling,ill pop over for 6 months and pick fruit,cash money in my pocket,that will help them out"
or "i can earn 4 times what i earn at home its cash money,i will have to share a house with 12 other people but ill be rich in 6
months"
what do you think is the correct answer?
and just incase anyone thinks i,m (using the well worn phrase)a racist or whatever i think i know a little about what goes on over there as my girlie
is polish
who cares who wins
pass the pork pies
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flak monkey
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 08:29 AM |
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I never siad they werent doing it for themselves, but who cares, if they pay their way while they are over here and then bugger off after 6 months,
what does it matter?
I only have a problem with those who come over here for the easy life and to life off benefits (but to be honest i dont think many do!), then again i
have the same problem with native brits who feel no urge to work and to scrounge every last drop out of the benfits system.
Sera
http://www.motosera.com
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David Jenkins
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 08:43 AM |
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There's a plumbing agency in London that prefers to employ Polish plumbers, for all the reasons given above. And they pay them the full UK
whack for that trade - definitely not cheap labour.
And just about every office you go into in London seems to have a pretty Russian girl on reception...
DJ
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DaveFJ
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 08:52 AM |
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The point is that they are willing to do the jobs that british people are not. There are plenty of jobs available as hotel cleaners and toilet
cleaners etc - but us brits would rather sit around and collect the dole than do them... someone has to do it so why not them?
Dave
"In Support of Help the Heroes" - Always
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theconrodkid
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 08:57 AM |
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i work on building sites sometimes,most are polish etc,at one new build,very expensive by the thames a suit was boasting he paid his sparkies
£6/hour,where are the british sparkies?
they have been replaced by cheaper ones,are their qualifications legit?
they can work for less as they dont have a home to buy and a family to raise here.
when all the locals have been priced out of their jobs and are on benefits/reposessed etc,who pays for that?
the first waves that came here were good workers looking to improve their lot,the latest are the dregs looking for a fast buck,as for romania and
bulgaria.......most famous for prostitutes/mafia/drugs/smuggling etc
who cares who wins
pass the pork pies
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Jasper
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 08:59 AM |
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Who gives an f*** about immigrants when you can sit and watch Daves avatar all day
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smart51
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 08:59 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by flak monkey
PS it shold also be pointed out that this country is still 96% white/caucasian/christian.
Actually, the UK 92% white, 4% south asian, 2% afro-caribean and 2% other/mixed.
To be fair, I've never heard a bad word against Polish workers and rarely about other immegrant workers. Long term dole addicts with no
intention of working seem to be mostly home grown.
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flak monkey
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 09:02 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by smart51
Actually, the UK 92% white, 4% south asian, 2% afro-caribean and 2% other/mixed.
Appologies, my info is obviously a little out of date. 
Sera
http://www.motosera.com
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Syd Bridge
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 09:33 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by smart51
quote:
Actually, the UK 92% white, 4% south asian, 2% afro-caribean and 2% other/mixed.
To be fair, I've never heard a bad word against Polish workers and rarely about other immegrant workers. Long term dole addicts with no
intention of working seem to be mostly home grown.
So I must come under the '2% other/mixed'???
Conrod's right about the need for locals to earn more money to pay mortgages and council taxes.
If those migrant workers lived 4 to a house, with two incomes only, and had to pay an above 'average' (as most are) mortgage, and the
council tax on top, they wouldn't be able to survive on what they take home.
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smart51
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 09:46 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Syd Bridge
Conrod's right about the need for locals to earn more money to pay mortgages and council taxes.
If those migrant workers lived 4 to a house, with two incomes only, and had to pay an above 'average' (as most are) mortgage, and the
council tax on top, they wouldn't be able to survive on what they take home.
Immegrant workers don't tend to come here and under cut British born workers in low paid jobs, they come here and fill low paid vaccancies that
we can't seem to fill ourselves.
The economic advantage to us of accepting these workers may be slight but they do provide plumbing / building / farm labouring services that we
don't have (don't want to do) ourselves. I'm sure it would be different if they were taking jobs from British workers but they
aren't. Despite what the Daily Mail might say about foreigners, I think on balance they are doing us a favour as well has helping themselves.
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Syd Bridge
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 09:50 AM |
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Smart51, I think you missed what I was trying to say, and Conrod as well.
The locals who live two to a house and pay mortgages, can't afford to take the low paid jobs, even if they wanted to, as they wouldn't be
earning enough to pay all their bills.
The migrants CAN do it, because they live high occupancy in cheap rented properties, and don't have the local financial commitments.
Cheers,
Syd. 
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DaveFJ
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 09:52 AM |
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Must admit - I took advantage of some cheap labour the other day....
I got an old boy to re-plaster my hallway. He did an excellent job and submitted a bill for £160 for 4 days work including materials!
I couldn't possibly pay that so gave him £200 - still stingy i know!
Now... where can i find a polish plumber....
Dave
"In Support of Help the Heroes" - Always
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MkIndy7
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 09:56 AM |
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And as site workers don't follow H&S rules and just do as their told.
We had a ventilation Grill to fit on the stairway of 5th floor landing when a building was nearly finnished.
I looked at the job and said I couldn't do it without Scaffolding as it was too Dangerous...
Polish fella took it off me, stood on the Bannister and fixed it up!.
It wasn't that I couldnt do it.. just the risks were too great and not worth even attempting because should I have fallen all hell would be to
pay! (while I wouldn't have got paid anything whilst off sick!)
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Macbeast
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 10:02 AM |
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So why don't the "locals" live in high-occupancy cheap housing instead of whinging about the cost of council tax, etc?
Because they're not prepared to give up their privacy, comfort etc.
I have a great deal of admiration for the immigrants who are prepared to work hard and support their families and I just wish that people like
Flak's relative were able to take them on in permanent jobs paid at the going rate instead of letting them be exploited by the gang Masters /
Agencies.
If the immigrant workers were paid a reasonable wage they would pay more in tax and NI, so contributing more to the State.
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Wadders
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 10:02 AM |
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As with most arguments theres good and bad,
If it devalues what i can charge for jobs,then of course i'll moan about them. But i have to say the few iv'e come across (Poles) seem to
turn out top class work, and take a pride in doing so. Maybe we should worry about that aspect of it a bit more, workmanship in this country seems to
be on a downward spiral. If you can get a better job done cheaper, its a no brainer. (bit like building your own 7, as opposed to buying a
cateringvan )
Mmm maybe i should look into it myself, anyone know any polish plumbers looking for work? accomodation provided (they can live in my shed, for a
small fee obviously) 
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macnab
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 10:08 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Jasper
Who gives an f*** about immigrants when you can sit and watch Daves avatar all day
It is a good one but not at work...
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nick205
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 10:41 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Jasper
Who gives an f*** about immigrants when you can sit and watch Daves avatar all day
....I quite agree Jasper, but the question is do we know the nationality of Dave's lovely lady? I wouldn't want to have to support those
on the minimum wage
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macnab
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 10:47 AM |
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I have had some amusing times with the Polish bus drivers
They have their own ‘system’
1)Drive where they want, proper route not important if there’s a short cut as it saves fuel and the environment.
2)If they get late, 5 mins is late, dump sorry ‘transfer’ the passengers on another bus and take short cut to end of route for a 30 min smoke!
3)The timetable is just a rough guide and only applies if your 5 mins late for the smoke break and is to be waved at waiting passenger as proof when
driving past them waiting at the stop.
4)Running 20 mins early is good as there’s less chance of the bus being late and missing fag break.
5)Before starting shift, drink at least 5 cans off red bull (vodka strangely frowned on over here) to help drive in-between those crazy British car
drivers who fail to appreciate how big (therefore important) the bus is.
6)Pushing cars out the way is perfectly acceptable, that’s what insurance is for.
7)Priority is always to the bus unless it’s something heavier and the driver looks tough.
8)Taking time to drive smoothly only takes longer therefore makes the bus more likely to be late, could miss fag break.
9)Running with the correct number only encourages people to use the bus and make it late, could miss fag break.
10)Running with ‘Sorry Out of Service’ helps keep the bus on time and fed’s off pesky passenger, especially those old ones that make the bus late.
11)When stopping for passenger make sure the bus is least 2 meters for the kerb so only the fit ones will board and bus won’t get late.
12)Have competitions with other polish mates as to how many cars you can thump with the back of the bendy...
Doesn’t matter, only helps make the British drivers look good and we need all the help we can get…he he.
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graememk
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 10:55 AM |
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i used to date a polish girl if that helps the argument
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macnab
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 11:09 AM |
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have to say there's very nice one working at the tuck shop, but her english seems rather limited...
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spunky
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 11:43 AM |
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Thats an interesting piece, but many of the quotes seem to be little 'sound bites' and you are left to guess the context in which they
were said.
Newark has a very large Polish and baltic poulation and it's undeniable that these people are good conciencious workers, but as has been posted
already, anyone with family/mortgage can not work for £5.35 an hour and manage to sustain themselves.
After I was made redundant I registered with some agencies, they dont even bother putting 'native' brits forward for the jobs because its
not a sustainable wage for most of us.
Been trying to do the maths but not really enough information, but it would seem obvious that immigrant workers (and workers is the key word here)
will increase productivity, as they should, there are 600,000 more people in the country (official figures, who knows how many are really here) But
how can sending out £10m a day be benificial to the economy.
Some who i've spoken to have a master plan. They can earn five times more over here than in Poland. They are buying property in their homeland,
and when they have enough property to rent and provide an income they are going home.
What happens then to this country and indeed the economies of the E European countries that they return to?!
John
Seems to me to be a good parallel between those of 'us' that have worked out in the Middle East on silly money, tax free and brought it
back when the contract ends.
[Edited on 3/1/07 by spunky]
The reckless man may not live as long......
But the cautious man does not live at all.....
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novacaine
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 11:54 AM |
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i used to live in derby intil the eastern european immigrants over ran the town, they brought lots of crime and went around raping people so when one
of them tried it with my kid sister (she was 14 at the time) we moved out i was living with my parents then
i hope that the majority of the immigrants dont bring trouble like this but even with only a few there they made derby into a place that i would no
longer wish to live in
i would like to think im open minded about people but i cant help but think about what happended in derby
Matt
And you run and you run to catch up with the sun but its sinking, Racing around to come up behind you again, the sun is the same in a relative way but
your older, shorter of breath and one day closer to death
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macnab
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| posted on 3/1/07 at 01:37 PM |
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they did what?
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