I found this quote on Pistonheads on the subject of Robin Hood 2b --- much better than i could ever express it.
Quote
Mr2Mike said:
ArtVandelay said:
Recently, a Robin Hood 2B has caught my eye, however, being a complete novice to kit cars, I don't know what to look for. This is the car in
question:
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2018672.htm
Now, hideous wheels aside
I can't put such abortions aside, I need to go and bleach my eyes now!
The 2B is a loose collection of bent exhaust pipe and bits of stainless steel sheet and GRP. It should win an award as the car with the smallest
amount of actual engineering applied to a design. The quality of the finished item varies from utterly terrible to superficially good depending on the
amount of time and skill the builder had, but ultimately they are (IMO) the worst designed 7 styled car you can still buy.
If it was extremely cheap and you only wanted to trundle around country roads at the weekend it may be sufficient. If you are buying a 7 for it's
original attributes (i.e. lightness and handling) then look elsewhere.
;-)
Full thread is at http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=1&t=899651&mid=0&nmt=Robin%20Hood%202B%20-%20How%20good%20are%20they?
The 2b was just a cheap sevenesque tourer. Never intended to be a trackday car. For 3000 quid they will out perform most production cars, give
considerable fun to the driver, allow him/her to dream and often go on to build something better.
No doubting most current sevenesque cars outperform the 2b but at greater cost and not without some valid criticisms of their design or on occasion
the manufacturers business practices.
The 2b is not a current GBS model.
I fail to understand the purpose of your post. 2b owners who are members of this forum will be feeling various things on reading your post, none of
them nice. I can't believe that was what you intended. Perhaps you could enlighten me.
I doubt it was intended to offend.made me chuckle,and i'd of still chuckled if it was written about a striker!
Made me chuckle too but im not a RH owner
made me laugh cause its definitely true with the RH S7s... theyre unbelievable
quote:
Originally posted by A1
made me laugh cause its definitely true with the RH S7s... theyre unbelievable
poor rh owners. i'm sure they're more fun than my ford focus
I am amazed at times by the occasional ill informed prejudice of some on this site. which by its own admission is for Locost cars. Ok its a jokey
description but perhaps if some of those respondents had a ride in Dustys I think they will have a rather different impression.
Sorry for the rant, no not really.
quote:
Originally posted by Dingz
I am amazed at times by the occasional ill informed prejudice of some on this site. which by its own admission is for Locost cars. Ok its a jokey description but perhaps if some of those respondents had a ride in Dustys I think they will have a rather different impression.
Sorry for the rant, no not really.
I'm sorry for miss-understanding you, britishtrident. You did mean all 2b's are rubbish.
I don't have a 2b. Mines a 'New 111' mono robinhood. No it doesn't have the sophistication of a Caterham, MNR or Birkin but
it's much modified and is still faster than I am so I will stick with it for the time being.
I do understand many of the limitations of earlier robinhood cars having driven or been driven in several. I would consider myself fairly well
informed about them. I have also been in some locosts with aparently less ability than my RH as well as some which were much better. I didn't get
out and tell him his car was great or rubbish. Seems kinder to offer thanks and compliment car and driver which perhaps makes me a two faced lying
git.
Whatever, I still don't want to accept without challenge the impersonal acts of meanness on the internet that one would not accept when face to
face.
My first build was a 2B. I found it a challenge to build, and loved it, anyone buying a 2B should look very carefully at the build quality,
irrespective of the advice given in the build videos, it was down to the skill of the individual how the finished product turned out, just like a
Locost.
There are good ones and bad ones, so saying that they should all be crushed is a *rant deleted*
There are good and bad Locosts, should they all be crushed too?
[Edited on 20-2-11 by 40inches]
quote:
Originally posted by Dusty
Mines a 'New 111' mono robinhood
(among other things) quote:
Originally posted by britishtrident
I found this quote on Pistonheads on the subject of Robin Hood 2b --- much better than i could ever express it.
I helped a very good friend of mine to build a 2B and it was
a challenge. as already said some holes had been burnt out instead of drilled,suspension brackets have
to be drilled and bolted to the chassis,stainless panels have to be neatly folded
And the biggest problem is the lack of a steering column mount,i had to make
and weld on a substantial mounting to pass sva.
All this aside as well as the extra care and attention needed while building,it has turned out
to be a decent budget kit but it's not to my taste though.
With a 1600 pinto it's not what you would call fast either but will show a modern saloon
a clean rear end but is most definately a cruiser not a racer.
I think what i am trying to say is,that with a lot of extra work it can be made
into a reasonable but quite heavy seven.
Non of this is meant to upset or offend any 2B owners,you must understand.
Just my two penarth worth.
Andy
Felt the need to add my 2 peneth.
Ive built 6 Seven type cars from scratch - Tiger, Westfield and Striker. I have owned another dozen. I have been involved in the purchase and sale of
50 more, and worked on maybe another 100 - from Caterham to Locost. I've had my cars on 2 of the above manufactureres stands, and represented
them at shows. I race a Locost and Hillclimb a 300hp Striker. What I'm saying is - I think I have some experience of what I think we legally
should call "Lotus Seven inspired roadsters". (Ok - enough - a few people know who I am now 
The first post made me chuckle - which I think was the intention. It also happens to be pretty much on the money.
Robin Hood have in my opinion NEVER engineered a nice car. Add to this the fact that much is left up to the (usually inexperienced, as if he
wasn't he WOULD be building something else) builder, and you have a recipe for a horrible LSIR.
Tiger aren't a lot better in my experience. My Cat was only 50% Tiger, many parts being thrown in the scrap pile and something better bought or
fabricated. Very little good design here too. Just look at the pedal box "design" thats gone into the pendulum pedal version. And the 4 (yes
FOUR) little bumps on a bonnet to clear badly placed components. This is the bonnet that is too short to actually reach the sides... JUST MAKE ANOTHER
MOULD THAT FITS!
Ok. That's the Tiger owners offended now.
Lets face it, a clever guy can build a nice seven out of scrap and workshop sweepings...
Just don't tell me the fact that the kits sold to kits registered ratio of Robin Hoods being something like 4:1 is any shock.
CM
[Edited on 21/2/11 by charliemouse]
ok guys so i have read the replies
the rhsc way was never the best , i think we accept that , however there are many
hundreds of seven owners who would not have been
seven owners unless rhsc had made sevens .
they were cheap , they needed a lot of input from the builder and thus created a bond with other owners .
rhocar is the only answer to build an rhsc car .
what about the zero ?
i have built and svad 2 lightweights 2 2bs and re built several others .
latest is a new zero with st 170 engine .
i have been in the demo car and it is awsome.
rhsc is was the only way many of us could get into the seven build .
so dont diss rhsc too much the cars wernt great i know , but the oppertunity
to build your own car for under 2 grand was very appealing .
graham
quote:
Originally posted by gdc
ok guys so i have read the replies
the rhsc way was never the best , i think we accept that , however there are many
hundreds of seven owners who would not have been
seven owners unless rhsc had made sevens .
they were cheap , they needed a lot of input from the builder and thus created a bond with other owners .
rhocar is the only answer to build an rhsc car .
what about the zero ?
i have built and svad 2 lightweights 2 2bs and re built several others .
latest is a new zero with st 170 engine .
i have been in the demo car and it is awsome.
rhsc is was the only way many of us could get into the seven build .
so dont diss rhsc too much the cars wernt great i know , but the oppertunity
to build your own car for under 2 grand was very appealing .
graham
I bet Robin Hoods have won countless one make series.
I dont see the need for this post. If you like RH's - buy one. If you dont - then dont buy one. Simple.
so i am prob one of thoes .
having been the guy to get the lightweight to the road and through sva .
my point is and will be , if richard stewart hadnt created rhsc then hundreds of us could not have afforderd
sevens .no way i could have .
granted hundreds or poss many more rhsc cars are still under construction.
they are a difficult build . but many hundred are on the road , good or bad .
more are still in garages , i accept that , because the build is hard and involved .
the car is a cheap seven you cant deny that .
but its hard to build , the rhocar web site assists the build .
apart from tvr we have the greatest partisitance at shows we lost it one year to tvr. at newark
a challenge , field 200 mk s or tigers or any thing you can think of at a major show .
it ant going to happen , but there will be a huge contingent of rhsc cars .
good or bad they will be there .
its a great comunity and we all help each other if there is a prob we will find an answer .
dont forget a lot of you visit our site for info so you can build your cars.
graham
quote:
Originally posted by britishtrident
....., that is my considered opinion as long experienced and high qualified mechanical engine.
quote:
Originally posted by britishtrident
If I had my way I would crush all RH for being unfit for purpose, that is my considered opinion as long experienced and high qualified mechanical engine.
Well scratch my eyes out ;-)
I spent a great deal of my life in engineering of many kinds both at the dirty end and theoretical end. When I started out the various engineer
institutions had a
seriously bad reputation because for full chartered membership all that was required was to be proposed and seconded by anybody who was already a full
member as result I never felt the need to join and have never regretted it. Now retired from engineering I have no intention of listing my
qualifications, training and experience, but lets just say I learned more in my apprenticeship as a seagoing engineer than in gathering my fairly
thick pile of university and college qualifications in different engineering disciplines.
[Edited on 26/2/11 by britishtrident]
quote:
Originally posted by Alfa145
quote:
Originally posted by britishtrident
If I had my way I would crush all RH for being unfit for purpose, that is my considered opinion as long experienced and high qualified mechanical engine.
Well obviously you are far more experienced and higher qualified than the multitude of people at VOSA who do the IVA/SVA then, as they obviously think RHs are fit for purpose or they wouldn't pass any RH's for use on the road. I'll take VOSA's opinion over someone who's a high qualified mechanical engine!
I wouldn't say that the Robin Hoods are any less, or more, suitable for their purpose than a lot of the 7 style kits on the market.
I've seen some diabolical misfits on Cateringvans, because I've been asked to provide a solution!
Then there's the couple of cars from differing makers starting with M&&&&&....
One of the M cars was so warped and twisted, from the factory, that the front balljoints were near to fully wound in on one side, and fully out on the
other, just to get the cambers close, and they were still a way off being equal. At mid range, the cambers were so different as to look like a Nascar
setup!
Then there was the brand new M car, where the (unadjustable) Sierra based rear end was so out of skew, that the back wheels pointed to the right by
4" each. How do you fix that? Tear the back apart, reweld the wishbone mounts and supporting tubes, then put in a set of custom adjustable
wishbones. Cost? More than a new chassis with correct and proper mounts would have cost.
Then there was the M car........
So, based on that EXPERIENCE, the robin Hood is no better of worse than most, including the so-called, 'better' kits.
The ali and stainless chassis RH's failed on seat belt mount integrity, and suspension point integrity. And when presented for IVA today, still
will fail unless backing plates and added reinforcing is in evidence. They are not failed 'as a matter of course', as I've seen an RH
that has been suitably reengineered pass IVA, with positive comments from the testing officer.
As with all kits, it's what YOU, the builder, do with them. None are good, none are bad, some are just easier to get right first time, than
others. Price and reputation is not necessarily a contending factor.
Cheers,
Nev
[Edited on 26/2/11 by Neville Jones]
thanks nev its nice to see a ballanced approach,
its the build that determins the result at iva / sva .
rhsc cars are hard to complete to a standard that will satisy the vosa man .
i have seen badly built kits that should never be hard to build ,and not hoods.
an rhsc will never look like another ,unlike a lot of the other kits thats part of the appeal
the cars design ant great but we know that , a row of the same colour westies will look the same
hoods wont .
we like being different , i have just completed a zero with st 170 and the body vinyl wrapped .
why !cos its different , with a hood you learn how to think out of the box .why cos you have to.
they are cheap and they are a challenge , thats to me what its about .
westie in a box built in 2 weeks , no chalenge .
graham
ps please come and visit us at rhocar . org
quote:
Lets face it, a clever guy can build a nice seven out of scrap and workshop sweepings...
Some of the best true 'professional engineers' I've encountered have been through the old school, where they started as apprentices,
then did the proper relevant studies at night for many years and got their 'bits of paper'. They had the knowledge of how to make things,
and with the proper studies, knew why the things were designed that way. These men had hands on experience, AND knowledge to design using proper
numbers.
Same men I owe a debt of gratitude to, for passing on their knowledge, before, during, and after I got my multiple 'bits of paper', and
ongoing still today while they still live.
Greasy hands and hard work don't make an engineer, without the 'bits of paper' to show you have a full understanding of the design
process.
I've met far too many so called 'engineers' who didn't have the faintest idea of how to do a very basic tensile or shear stress
calculation.
Now, all you self professed 'engineers' better go google how to do a simple stress calculation, to tell me just how good you are and equal
to a proper professional engineer.
Or tell me that you don't need to do numbers to know if something is right or not. That's why you see people on here using 12mm bolts for
suspension pivots, when a 12mm 8.8 bolt will hold up more than 10 average locosts on its own!
On my last build I used 6mm 16.9 shoulder bolts, which will hold up at least one locost. So, I overengineered it by a bit!
Check what's on an F1 car, or LM car. Designed by engineers, that's why the bolts are so small, as are the parts they support, and lifed,
because the engineers understand stress life cycling and safety factors.
Cheers,
Nev.
I am not a engineer or professional engineer, nor do I have any experience with building kit cars. In fact the word mechanic/engineer or even
'fitter' could never be applied to me, ever. But I am building a kit car.
I can use my common sense when building stuff but I have no real experience to base this on. When it comes to things like chassis design, suspension
design etc I am totally reliant on my manufacturer getting it right. I probably wouldn't know whats 'right' or 'wrong'
anyway.
It worries me that I could be building a car with a chassis that is essentially a bit 'pants'. It seems to me that one of our kit car mags
should put together a small team of qualified engineers, sports car professionals etc to review and judge basic kitcar chassis old and new.
I think the word professional means nothing anyway.
quote:
Originally posted by Neville Jones
I've met far too many so called 'engineers' who didn't have the faintest idea of how to do a very basic tensile or shear stress calculation.
Now, all you self professed 'engineers' better go google how to do a simple stress calculation, to tell me just how good you are and equal to a proper professional engineer.
quote:
A professional is a person that is paid for what they do. Qualifications have little to do with being a professional as the world's "oldest profession" is strictly a monetary gain career. An amateur maybe more qualified than a professional but they are not paid, thus they are an amateur.
Sorry Nev you are just not getting it are you?? Many of us have pieces of paper ( how do you know we don't???) When i did my apprenticeship we
did shear and tensile stress calculations we did pressure and flow we did metalurgy we did NDT
facrors of safety etc etc etc. Many of them long forgotten but nonethe less were learned AND UNDERSTOOD.
So I coulld look out all my old books and notes and I could do the calculations and given the machines amd enough time I could make the parts and
assemble them.
Do you have a chip on your shoulder about non Uni qualified blokes or is it just that you are the best in the world? I don't get why you feel the
need to shout down people you may have never met.
In a tricky situation I rather be stuck with 10 hands on guys with experience and knowledge and hand skills at my side than 10 people trying to tell
me the " ideal and perfect" way to get it done.
A tree falls in a forest on a desert island and the hands on guys are making a canoe, and we are out of here to beer and women.
A tree falls in a forest on a desert island and the paper qualified guys are working out why it fell and did it make a noise if no one saw it. THEN
your wishing the hands on guys had not left so quick.
Sorry but your coming across all wrong ( don't know if you mean to but you are ). We all have a place in the grand scheme of things simple as
that. No one is much better than the other.
I've been an employer and have had guys with papers and guys without them. To be honest, the last guy we took on out of Uni hadn't a clue
and had to be taught how to use a mill! I can do differential calculus and J numbers etc. (or at least I could 25 yrs ago) and have never used any of
it in the real world doing the things I have.
I'm not saying that it is not necessary for some people to have relevant qualifications, I'd like to know that the guy who designed the
wings of the plane I'm on did his sums correctly, but it is horses for courses and one of the very best workshop engineers I ever met is dyslexic
and hasn't a piece of paper to his name! In an office or design room papers can be useful but in the workshop or field it is the practical
ability of the worker that counts!
Just my thoughts of course!
What a complete pointless thread this has turned into. Original post, pointless and all it was intended to do was provoke an argument, all the bickering is pointless and we all have views on all makes of kit, so going on and on and on and on is again, pointless.
quote:
Originally posted by AndyW
What a complete pointless thread this has turned into. Original post, pointless and all it was intended to do was provoke an argument, all the bickering is pointless and we all have views on all makes of kit, so going on and on and on and on is again, pointless.
I've got a bit of paper to say I'm a mechanical engineer, but I wouldn't say that makes me a good mechanic (all the hands on stuff I
know I got from my dad not uni)
I've had to train up several other folk that have alo got bits of paper (for strutural design)
In my experience its down to the individual, going to uni should give you the background knoledge and a way of approching problems - but more than
half the guys we've had are totaly usless and just don't get it
I'd much rather find someone whos started out with some real hands on experience
the likes of BAE have gone back to apprenticeships, and if you show a bit of ability they'll send you on to uni from there - they say its the
only way to get the skills they need
[Edited on 27/2/2011 by mcerd1]
Not a pointless post at all.
The robin hood 2B while it is not generally thought of by many to be the best setup/design nevertheless brought a lot of pleasure to many people.
The Zero IMHO is good value for money BUT as with any kitcar it is the builder who turns out the finished product. Some are good some not so good and
some a disaster BUT the potential for a tidy and IVA passable car is defineatly there ( well there are some on the road so it must be).
ETA
quote:
the likes of BAE have gone back to apprenticeships, and if you show a bit of ability they'll send you on to uni from there - they say its the only way to get the skills they need
as always, each to his own.
I have a 2B, and I cruise around the French roads, and I love it!!
This thread is making chuckle, I.don't know much about robin hoods but didn't like the look of the early ones, but as long as they are safe and the owners like them who cares. As for professional engineers, I love the hands on school of hard knocks versus uni. Engineering is a very broad discipline, we should have respect for all the levels, graduates need a good few years under there belt just like any other profession. The argument seems to be you need to understand hands on to be any good, wrong, there are plenty of engineering disciplines that don't, speak to a requirements engineer, a process engineer, simulation specialist, there all professional engineers. It's not just about basic stress calcs and basic manufacturing. You'd be hard pushed to find many chief engineers without a degree. We all have our place
I also think the thread has descended somewhat, however I think the first person that started the downward spiral has as fair a point as the people
that started the Uni Vs Old school discussions...
I work in the composites industry. The company is very small, 4.5 people. We make Carbon bodywork for the BSB and WSB and nowadays Caterhams etc.
My job role there is an odd one, I'm not a skilled composites person, quite the opposite in fact, the young lad part time from school is more
skilled than me IMO.
Yet, even though, I have no clear role, I seem to work harder than anyone there. Often putting 12 hr, and even 16 hr days. I don't get a second
where I'm not constructing, solving, designing, fixing, "sorting" something...
I am now 35 years old and have had no education past school leaving age really, so I coudn't even call myself a technician if I wanted too!
I have built more kitcars (and a variety of marques) than most people, yet I would not consider myself an expert on the subject matter at all!
I used to give advice on here, but don't tend to anymore unless it's a bit unusual or takes my fancy, because I feel (and I'm not
alone) that there are a few people on here that are relatively immature in their dealing, esp whilst online! And I have noticed over the years that
even good advice can get lost amidst bickering and bad advice given by people that just want to up their post count or desperate for attention and
want to tell others how to build/live!
However, I digress, My boss ordered some cheap business cards for me as I often nip to Oulton for TD's etc due to works proximity to the track.
When he was doing the design, he inserted the usual phone number, web site etc and underneath my name he put the title Chief Engineer. I was
horrified. It was so embarrasing. The first business contact (building the Arash AF10) was a qualified engineer...
I guess that's the difference...
Then we had our second visit to the Arash site and it became apparrant that the stories he told were the only ones he had and was a complete numpty!
And just a final note;
I used to walk past the masses of RH's at shows etc thinking, I'd need a much better engineered car... But at no point did I think I was
better than the owners or looked down on them - they were/are happy with a lifestyle and a certain standard and that's their choice - life is too
short to be so petty as slag them off. And what's more, if I were going to slag them off, I'd do it directly rather than being petty and
trying to use someone else's descriptions to do it for me............................
[Edited on 28/2/11 by Steve Hignett]
look guys i havent come on here to have a go , rhsc cars have given a proportion of the public a chance to own a seven style car , good or bad , there
are many hundreds of sevens on the road that whithought rhsc there would not have been .
dont hide up your own arse , we are here .we can build good cars , and to a better standard than some manufacturers .
a lot of vists to our site are not logged and the info we have learned is being used elsewhere we know that
we dont care , carry on building .use the info .
we build hard to put together cars , we know that and appretiate the end result.you need to re think your ides re rhsc
we , think out of the box . we work together . we make it work whatever the prob .
find another comunity that works this well . in the kit car comunity ..
we are individual, never the same .it does work it dont work these arnt rhsc words .make it work .
graham
quote:
Originally posted by gdc
look guys i havent come on here to have a go , rhsc cars have given a proportion of the public a chance to own a seven style car , good or bad , there are many hundreds of sevens on the road that whithought rhsc there would not have been .
dont hide up your own arse , we are here .we can build good cars , and to a better standard than some manufacturers .
a lot of vists to our site are not logged and the info we have learned is being used elsewhere we know that
we dont care , carry on building .use the info .
we build hard to put together cars , we know that and appretiate the end result.you need to re think your ides re rhsc
we , think out of the box . we work together . we make it work whatever the prob .
find another comunity that works this well . in the kit car comunity ..
we are individual, never the same .it does work it dont work these arnt rhsc words .make it work .
graham
quote:
The argument seems to be you need to understand hands on to be any good
all those lost to kit building because of a horrible experience. They say a happy customer tells his best friend, and an unhappy one everybody he
meets.
I know a modern manufacturer that fits the above, but thats another thread alread done to death.
ETA: incidentally, i owned a Dutton Phaeton S2, which was my first car. Got it running, thrashed it, and sold it on to break even and buy the car i
have now. Similarly, a pretty fundamental car, but without it i wouldnt be into kit cars now.
[Edited on 27-2-11 by MakeEverything]
quote:
Originally posted by omega 24 v6
quote:
The argument seems to be you need to understand hands on to be any good
No the arguments are 2 fold.
1 You DO NOT need a uni qualification to call yourself and engineer that's a fact. I have an industry based engineering apprenticeship and an HNC in mechanical and production engineering and papers that call me an engineer. And I suspect do others on here are in the same boat. Why should someone else decide to say we are not??
2 The robin hood AND laterly the gbs zero Have and will give many people a path into owning a sevenesque vehicle the quality of which ( as it is with even MK or MNR etc etc etc) is dependant on the individual builder.
As the thread is going of topic, and I feel I have made my point, it seems likely that we will end up going round in circles.
can we agree on one thing though, gas fitters should never have been able to call themselves heating engineers?
the title 'engineer' should have the same status it does on the continent. a statement of professional and technical competency.
that's not to say anyone who isn't one is less of a person, but the term is far too broad in common use. for instance, a nurse isn't a
GP isn't a surgeon. they all have differing specialisations but all are important.
back on topic, if it wasn't for that ropey green 2B at the harrogate kitcar show in 2002, i wouldn't have ever thought i could afford to
build a kit car. the 2b made me save (and then i saved some more and stretched my budget to buy a better value kit)
the rhocar forum was a great learning experience back in the day (around about 2002-3) and even when i was 17, some of them (admittedly not all of
them) looked past the fact that i was young and talked to me like a human being at shows. a far better atmosphere than the cliquey bullshit at most
other stands. the people are far and away the best bit about robin hoods
quote:
Originally posted by MakeEverything
ETA: incidentally, i owned a Dutton Phaeton S2, which was my first car. Got it running, thrashed it, and sold it on to break even and buy the car i have now. Similarly, a pretty fundamental car, but without it i wouldnt be into kit cars now.
I have a bit of paper that says I can swim 100 metres in my pyjamas whilst towing someone by their chin and can save a rubber brick from drowning at
the bottom of the deep end... am I an engineer?
God I hope so... I've always wanted to be exotic!
I love being mis quoted,
I thought my response was very balanced. I don't remember saying you needed a degree to be an engineer, but do understand you'd be annoyed
if people suggested you can't be called one because you haven't got a degree.
Engineering is a very broad discipline, you need the relevant experience and qualifications for the job you do.
Apprentichips are a good foundation and then as other have said with a good employer the career paths are there to do a HNC or a degree if needed.
What I'm not so keen on is the Graduate bashing (i.e you can't be an engineer if you don't know how to use a milling machine), a
Mechanical Enigineering degree is very broad in the subjects taught, this gives graduates a very good base to them specialise in one area or another
(by further qualification or work experience), my point was not all mechanical engineering graduates go on to become a mechanical design engineers (in
fact I bet the percentage is very small). And I'd agree those that do won't be that great to start with, put them in a good design office
enivironment (not that they exist much anymore)with access to the hands on manufacturing and after a couple of years they will have improved
massively.
So nope you don't need a uni degree to be called an engineer, I think we all agree on that pretty much anyone can be called an engineer.
To be a professional engineer, all you need to do is be employed in the engineering trade.
To be a highly qualified engineer, depending on your discipline you need the relevant bits of paper (thats what qualification means).
Which one of those would I want designing bits of my car, probably a team of all them using their strengths to come up with the best solution.
My reference to a Chief engineer say in JLR or BAE Systems. they have to oversea a large design team covering a whole host of disciplines and need a
flexible background and education to have discussions and agree designs. One meeting they could be discussing composite drive shafts and relying on
their subcontractor with the specialist knowledge, the next minute they could be discussing the ballistic properties of steel or an electrical control
system, hence they need a very broad technical background to be successful.
Still can't comment on Robin Hoods though, I bet the starts to actual finished build isn't much worse than the locost or haynes roadster
(I'll be impressed if I ever get mine finished).
Closing remark, let promote engineering at alls its levels, its one of the best and exciting careers you can get into!
I was trying to resist joining in on this one. There does seem to be a bit of a fixation here about professional engineers and the automotive/mechanical arena. Don't forget that engineering is much wider than that and does still include professional engineers, even chartered engineers. I know several chartered chemical engineers and quite a few chartered civil engineers who wouldn't know a decent chassis if you drove it over them. However, if you want a chemical plant or a bridge building, they are pretty good.
Before our modern times, engineers 'engineered' things, 'designers' designed things, clerks 'clerked', sales
'assistants' assisted, and supervisers 'supervised'.
Did you know that the Labour government decided years ago that the term 'engineer' has become so diluted and missused, that it is,
officially, no longer classed as a 'trade'?
Truely an insult to all the 'engineers' that made the UK, until all the accountants took 'account' and ruined it!!!
[Edited on 28-2-11 by designer]
is this a spelling test or grammer and punctuation test . we are talking about a piece of kit that can kill you and others
dont pull me up for poxy grammer . i have to say that some of you are toooo far up your own arses to recognise a good car, i feel you feel superior
,please proove me wrong .
sorry guys its the truth .
we all love our ride , it might be a locost a mnr a tiger or any other mark . why diss another mark ?
cos thats not what you have , or dont understand .
go with it we are all diferent , we as hoodies like to be different , you wont see 2 hoods the same .
we know the short commings of the hoods , the s7 s ect 2bs early 3as even .i have 2 lightweights .
we know the probs and we work with them .
i would put my zero up against any compariable car .
i ant winging about the quality of my kit . its great £2400 for the kit £700 for the st 170 engine type nine
and a bit of playing and a fully running car .go on then talk your way out of that .
graham
yawn, these arguement threads, where it starts on one subject, and ends up on a completely different slagging match are getting too common...
Can this thread be closed because it is pointless and boring
lets just yawn then
it will soon be over so no probs.
do you not recognise how anal you are.
all of you.
i gone i not come back .
think of how you view the other marks ,.is your car the best of all ????????????
mmmmmm prob not !
graham
www. rhocar .org
sorry didnt notice you drc 7
well glad i found this thread
been having trouble getting off to sleep lately
i will save it and reread next time i cant get off
cheers les g
on reflection dont think its very nice to slag off other peoples builds or choices
good reply
dont slag off other builds
see them first .
we can build good cars also rhsc that is .dont right us off as twats cos we ant ,
we know what we got , we know how to build them , thanks for the thoughts .
still a challenge
field more than 200 1 mark kits at a show .
you ant going to do it
graham
Ah well...
kneck wound in
me gone
might come back
you guys wind me up so i have to go so many thoughts of this and that
and will i comment or wont i .
do i or dont i .
my car is the best !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
is it ?mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
bit shallow i feel
graham
Bye
erm, ok then?
What a bizarre dude!
Has he gone now?
So! Another thread that has degenerated into a pointless slanging match that has nothing to do with the original point of the thread and in the
process completely losing the fact that the OP is wrong and that I am right 