Alright Guys n Girls...

What do I need to Turbo my MX5???

I think that I am going to build up a kit of parts over the next year and turbo it by next spring.
It is going to be a budget/Locost build, but because I intend to do it as a project over 12 months, I'm hoping to land on parts that might be expensive if you had to collect them all in a weekend on ebay (IYKnWIM?)

It is a 1992 J registered MkI (NA) MX5 1.6 in Red with a Mohair hood and Tan leather seats.

It has the MkII wheels on it which are a massive visual improvement, and is running OK (Needs a service, but other than that it's fine)...

So, come on Guys n Girls... Give me a list of parts that will be an ideal list for me to start hunting for.
I would rather they be budget conscious, but if there are corner cutting parts that would end up biting me on the bum, then I would like to know it and the better (more expensive) alternative...

Thanks in advance,
Steve...

(ps - I have learnt a few things over the years about turboing cars and bikes, but I'd really really like your input so that I don't miss stuff!)

Loads of info on the net for turboing the mx5. Of what I've read in the past if your keeping the boost to a sensable level it can be done quite cheeply keeping the factory ecu.
Got some links on the laptop at home ill post up tonight Steve.
In the mean time if you search turbo Miata you should fine plenty to read up on.

Steve, if you go to mx5nutz there's a specific topic on forced induction.
TBH for my money I'd go for supercharging as I reckon the power delivery is much better - stamp on the accelerator from idle and you're boosting immediately rather than waiting for it to chime in further up the rev range.
Also there are fewer problems with heat generation and potentially it's a cheaper option.
HTH.
Cheers, Pewe10

have a look on mx5 nutz forum. a mate of mine has done his own using a scooby turbo unit. look up greendrifter on there and search his archive and posts for info

Lots of bits needed - have a look at this wiki. Of the top of my head a very basic install will need:

Turbocharger with wastegate and suitable actuator.
Exhaust manifold suitable for turbo.
Exhaust downpipe
Gaskets for above.
Oil and coolant pipes for turbo + pipe clips.
Possibly an oil restrictor for the turbo.
Adapters to tap into oil supply (either from oil pressure switch or filter sandwich plate).
Modified sump for oil return.
Inlet pipes and flexible hose + suitable hose clamps.
Intercooler.
Rising rate Fuel pressure regulator (for the cheap and nasty way of increasing fuelling with boost)
Ignition retarder (or just retard static timing and get poor mileage and off-boost performance).
An "O2 Clamp" to prevent the ECU trying to cut back the fuelling as boost rises.

Wideband AFR sensor and display. Probably the most important part unless you like extra low compression pistons..

Ideally you want either an aftermarket ECU or some kind of piggy back system so you can accurately control fuel and ignition, but this will push the cost up.

On Miataturbo.net there is a sticky with the best basic what you need guide I've seen Linky

You may have to join - I wouldn't bother posting any questions if you do, they are not at all friendly/ a complete bunch of t*ssers unless you're in their 'club'........... some good info in the forum though (after you've waded through all the abuse that is!)

ive got a turbo here, will find out what make it is

GARRETT AR 48 TURBO

Something rarely mentioned, is that the inlet piping can't be too big, otherwise you get a lot of lag. I have had problems with my car (no kidding, he says), but lag has never been an issue.

The turbo is the cheap bit! It's things like the manifold, piggyback ecu, intercooler pipework etc that make it expensive. If you keep boost to 5psi, you can do it Very cheap as you won't need an intercooler or ignition controller.
Personally, if I were doing it again, I'd supercharge it. Come over my way one Saturday morning and I can show you both setups. Might get a spin if we're lucky.

Lee

Don't; chuck an LS1 in instead

ATB

Simon

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Originally posted by Simon
Don't; chuck an LS1 in instead

ATB

Simon

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1UZFE

Bargain engine

Hi guys...

Firstly, thanks for all your replies so far (well, most of them )

Loco Dave - Thanks, and lookin fwd to your extra links/info

Pewe - I've driven S/C and turbo'd cars a few times, and whilst it makes more sense to have S/C, I just like the way a turbo car drives

Big Rich - Will check him out, does he give a write up on what he used? If not, do you know him well enough to ask details? Or maybe I could call him one weekend?

Mike - Thanks for that, that's the kind of thing I was hoping for. (And to build oon for the purpose of thread keeping on the forum...

Dave - We've spoken before and I've seen that link before (briefly), So I will give it a good read now. I am hoping to do it for little money, but I genuinely only want little gains - ie. keeping it at 5 or 6 ish psi... (I've also noticed that they're a bit aggressive on there!)

Joe - You better get on ebay and find me a roller bearing T3 flanged monster then, hadn't you???

Rich - thanks for the tip!

Lee - I will do my best to get over to you... With a permanently poorly (nearly) 2 year old to look after, weekends aren't what you'd call free time!!!

Simon - err, not sure I can take you're advice...

Lee - I think a 4.0 litre V8 is probably going to cost me a little more than a bunch of 2nd hand find's on ebay, and pestering Joe for a bit of Ali welding here or there!

Jeff - Not sure, what you consider a bargain, but I bet you I won't be able to afford it! I can't check as there isn't a single result in engines on enay, when I type "1UZFE engine" in the search box and hit return!!!


As above, thanks for the efforts guys, and whilst some of you know that some of the info is on other websites, my intention was to have a thread which had questions and answers all in one place, and my other intention was to edit my initial post to include a Plan Of Action and a timescale and then to carry it on as a mini build diary when I start the buying and then again when I start the job.

Also as above, I do intend to carry this out as a genuine budget task, but at the same time, if things should be done to ensure safety like the insertion of a FMIC to ensure cooler air and therefore reaching a good BHP figure without pushing the boost, then I'd fork out the extra money etc....

Thanks again, and please, keep it coming!!!
Especially if anyone has direct experience of turbo'ing an engine that wasn't turbo'd to begin with...
(I'm waiting for Froggy to chip in with - Oh, I've got all this gear and turbo's you can 'ave!)

Steve, just to throw another googly into the equation - what about going V6? There are a few about incl IIRC Clairetoo.

As for s/c v t/c I used to enjoy my series 1 Lancia Thema - big turbo so it would pottle along until the turbo span up and then it was just like you'd lit the blue touch paper! Trouble was if it chimed in mid-corner loadsa torque steer but idiot grin stuff if you weren't cacking it.
Have to say I like the linear power delivery the s/c gives - chacqun a son goo Rodney....
Keep us posted.
Cheers, Pewe10

Big turbo's kicking in at the wrong time (eg mid bend) etc is a bit pooey as you say for things like torque steer, but it would be OK in my instance for a couple reasons - 1, I won't be running that much power and 2, an MX5 is RWD, so there won't be any problems with torque steer at all...

I (briefly) got in touch with Claire a few months ago as I've met her more than a few times (and often over a vodka/whiskey infested table at Stoneleigh/Newark!), and asked her about her "kit" of parts and even though what she quoted me was def not millions, it didn't seem to be as easily reached as to turbo it...

As above though, please keep em coming!

I did read in one magazine that Steve Mills over at MEV had found a source for a low capacity turbo kit for £500, unfortunately it's only in that one magazine and not even the MEV website mentions it!!

I'd pop an email to Steve to see if there is any truth in the rumour, but I'm not in the position to make use of it yet.

Thanks very much for sending him the email...
I've U2U'd you my email address so you can CC me in or forward it on to me...

Thanks again...

The Greddy kits tend to use a Mitsubushi TD04, of which there are hundreds of permutations! As you aren't after outright power, go for a nice small one off a Volvo for £80. It'll spool up quicker and generally be nicer to drive. You know enough folk to help make a manifold. Or a cast manifold is only £90. The engine already has an oil port so no sandwich plates needed. I can lend you the drill and tap for the sump and return. The brass fitting is about £1.50. Go for an intercooler off a 1.8T A3. I got mine for £20. That uses 50mm pipe work which is more than adequate (and cheaper!) I have a couple of silicone elbows going spare. Look for a Bipes from the US. A basic device to retard ignition as revs rise. Or look out for a cheap Greddy eManage. I have software for mapping.
It can be done cheap, but the temptation to push it further is always nigling. I recall a Sunday several months ago when I 'accidentaly' turned the turbo up a bit. I now have a new engine under the bonnet.

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/T3-T4-Hybrid-Turbo-Charger-50-A-R-T04E-T3-T4-STAGE-3-RSX-K20-RB25-Miata-HP-450-/220960616298?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessor ies&hash=item3372476f6a

quote:

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Originally posted by RK
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/T3-T4-Hybrid-Turbo-Charger-50-A-R-T04E-T3-T4-STAGE-3-RSX-K20-RB25-Miata-HP-450-/220960616298?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessor ies&hash=item3372476f6a

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don't they deliver to the UK? I just got a radio/gps/dvd bluetooth unit for the audi delivered from hong kong. Course it didn't have any instructions, and I could fry my ECU trying to hook it all up, but what the hell.

[Edited on 29/2/12 by RK]

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Originally posted by Steve Hignett

quote:

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Originally posted by RK
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/T3-T4-Hybrid-Turbo-Charger-50-A-R-T04E-T3-T4-STAGE-3-RSX-K20-RB25-Miata-HP-450-/220960616298?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessor ies&hash=item3372476f6a

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Yeah thanks Rich... Can't exactly just nip down the road and pick that up could I? What do some people think...

Oh, hang on a min... If only I knew a very friendly guy that could pop that into the post for me

Hmmm, you and Big Lee have got me thinking!!!
Think I might have to nip over to yours at some point Lee!

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I've collected most of the bits to do mine, just a wideband O2 thingy and getting Joe to knock together a manifold to go....... with some bargain hunting and patience I've spent about £350 so far (including a megasquirt )......... the only problem is that after getting recent quotes to insure the car as standard I suspect I may not be able to afford to insure it when modified (turbo, aftermarket ecu, 6 point roll bar, coilovers etc) at the moment

I built a 250ish bhp MX-5 BBR turbo.

To do a reasonable job of a DIY turbo you'll need to spend about £2k for a good amount of power.

180bhp can be had for sub £1k.

quote:

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Originally posted by welderman

quote:

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Originally posted by Steve Hignett

quote:

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Originally posted by RK
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/T3-T4-Hybrid-Turbo-Charger-50-A-R-T04E-T3-T4-STAGE-3-RSX-K20-RB25-Miata-HP-450-/220960616298?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessor ies&hash=item3372476f6a

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Yeah thanks Rich... Can't exactly just nip down the road and pick that up could I? What do some people think...

Oh, hang on a min... If only I knew a very friendly guy that could pop that into the post for me

Hmmm, you and Big Lee have got me thinking!!!
Think I might have to nip over to yours at some point Lee!

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We could go for a cup of teaat Lee's, if you pop by here first

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Cheers me ole china

quote:

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Originally posted by Waitey
I built a 250ish bhp MX-5 BBR turbo.

To do a reasonable job of a DIY turbo you'll need to spend about £2k for a good amount of power.

180bhp can be had for sub £1k.

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Mapping and ECU ar ethe biggest cost, personally I wouldn't scrimp on these, but if you want cheap then cheap it will be.

330cc supra injectors - £80
Used T25 from a 200sx - £80
Cast Corksport manifold - £120
Custom down pipe - £100
Intercooler and piping - £170
Sensors and Wideband O2 - £200
Hoses and fittings - £50
Clutch - £200
Used E manage or similar - £200
Mapping - Download standard map 8psi for free....

So £1200 will get you a reliable 190-200bhp.

You could afford to lose the intercooler and things like a wideband O2, if you were really being cheap!

From then on you are only bigger injectors and some more mapping away from 250bhp. (About £500ish)

If it costs £1-1.5k would you not be better off getting a leggy s2000 or a cat D one?

I think you could get a reliable 150-160 for a good 4 to 500 quid less than that (especially if you fabricate things and shop around a bit rather than just buying new) which is equal to about 50bhp (and lots of torques) for under £700..........HUGE value for money in engine tuning terms!

quote:

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Originally posted by franky
If it costs £1-1.5k would you not be better off getting a leggy s2000 or a cat D one?

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quote:

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Originally posted by franky
If it costs £1-1.5k would you not be better off getting a leggy s2000 or a cat D one?

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Not having first hand experience, but watching a few others, I have concluded that getting more power from an MX5 is like trying to make a silk purse from a sow's ear. It costs, and often blows up, and costs more. Just a very casual observer's opinion of course. No cheap S2000's around then??

quote:

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Originally posted by D Beddows
I think you could get a reliable 150-160 for a good 4 to 500 quid less than that (especially if you fabricate things and shop around a bit rather than just buying new) which is equal to about 50bhp (and lots of torques) for under £700..........HUGE value for money in engine tuning terms!

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quote:

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Originally posted by MikeRJ

quote:

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Originally posted by franky
If it costs £1-1.5k would you not be better off getting a leggy s2000 or a cat D one?

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Can you actually get an S2000 for that sort of money? I'd be amazed if this was possible, I thought they held their money quite well?

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quote:

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Hardly anything in my list was actually new! You could scrimp on the clutch (the OE clutch will take about 160bhp), and fab a down pipe yourself, sod the intercooler and use some crap ignition retard thing and give the injectors a miss(I've seen some people using OE injectors up to 160bhp, but we are talking 97% duty cycles while on boost! sod that). Doing 150bhp could probably be done for £500-600. But. Once you've done that, you'll want more, so spending the money first off helps a lot.

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So far there has been no mention as to whether the standard 1.6 diff and drive shafts are man enough for increased power.
There is opinion that you need to swap these for 1.8 items - the ones with push-in driveshafts and preferably a slippy diff.
HTH.
Cheers, Pewe10

quote:

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Originally posted by pewe
So far there has been no mention as to whether the standard 1.6 diff and drive shafts are man enough for increased power.
There is opinion that you need to swap these for 1.8 items - the ones with push-in driveshafts and preferably a slippy diff.
HTH.
Cheers, Pewe10

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quote:

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Originally posted by MikeRJ
Lots of bits needed - have a look at this wiki. Of the top of my head a very basic install will need:

Turbocharger with wastegate and suitable actuator.
Exhaust manifold suitable for turbo.
Exhaust downpipe
Gaskets for above.
Oil and coolant pipes for turbo + pipe clips.
Possibly an oil restrictor for the turbo.
Adapters to tap into oil supply (either from oil pressure switch or filter sandwich plate).
Modified sump for oil return.
Inlet pipes and flexible hose + suitable hose clamps.
Intercooler.
Rising rate Fuel pressure regulator (for the cheap and nasty way of increasing fuelling with boost)
Ignition retarder (or just retard static timing and get poor mileage and off-boost performance).
An "O2 Clamp" to prevent the ECU trying to cut back the fuelling as boost rises.

Wideband AFR sensor and display. Probably the most important part unless you like extra low compression pistons..

Ideally you want either an aftermarket ECU or some kind of piggy back system so you can accurately control fuel and ignition, but this will push the cost up.

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