Honda (Civic) v Clio at Oulton. ...OK I know you're after a Clio, but just for a bit of entertaiment.
I'm looking for a cheap sub 2k capable little track car and weekend toy, what are peoples thoughts and findings on the little clio's?
I've owned just about everything else in the past, including 205gti's (several), Mx5's , pulsar gtir (just sold). I'm not
expecting to be the fastest out there and the tracks I will be going to such as Elvington, Blyton and Teeside are not that big.
Honda? Civic or CRX? I think the 1600 vtec is around 150bhp standard My son has a crx, well tweaked. He was testing at Teesside not long back.
Fabulous cars. Make sure had cam belt and aux belt done or budget around £500 for a specialist to do the job.
Im on my fourth.
2 172s, 2 182s.
Couldnt begin to say how much of a bargain fun car they are. Buy one now.
[Edited on 16-3-15 by loggyboy]
good positive response to them then..
Andy- I considered the newer type r civic but they don't seem to get quite as positive response on handling like the renault ,not really
considering the older version civic as they look a little dated now..
Ps, Is the trophy 182 clio really worth the extra money just for the sachs front suspension ? out of my budget I think in any case..
If you can find a good one I'd look for a 172cup. Lighter as standard with none of the heavy toys of the 182. They are basic though with no Abs
Air con etc. I've found that parts for the 172 are slightly cheaper too, Exhaust especially.
As said above make sure the belts and dephaser have been done. It's an expensive job at a specialist but I did one over a weekend myself by
whipping the engine out which was 100 x easier than trying to do in Situ.
Trophy is a good investment car (IMO), will be the one that holds its value best, but the premium they command (for a track car), you would be better buying a standard 1*2 and adding your own choice of suspension. Rebuilding the sachs trophy shocks is circa £800 (inc getting them 'unpined' so you can adjust the shocks). So an allround set of coilovers at about £500 (gaz), or the ever popular (never tried by me) fixed height cook sport springs and either some adjustable bilsteins, koni etc are a better option.
quote:
Originally posted by sdh2903
If you can find a good one I'd look for a 172cup. Lighter as standard with none of the heavy toys of the 182. They are basic though with no Abs Air con etc. I've found that parts for the 172 are slightly cheaper too, Exhaust especially.
As said above make sure the belts and dephaser have been done. It's an expensive job at a specialist but I did one over a weekend myself by whipping the engine out which was 100 x easier than trying to do in Situ.
They are a specialist job because the genuine tools for timing them are expensive and the none genuine are apparently shite. Certainly seen many cars making poor power and it being down to poor cam timing
Cup to normal weight difference is about 54KG IIRC.
As above, 182 exhaust not something you can get from euros, so a branded aftermarket is cheapest option. Most other parts are shared though.
Later cups and 182s have more caster which known to be a worth while change, however, a new set of lower trackarms/wishbones can add this to any
earlier model. 182 cups have a larger Front wheel bearing and different bolt spacing on the shocks, so make sure you check before replacing front
shocks.
I personally prefer the non cup versions as AC on a hot trackday is a god send, as are the xenon lights for winter driving.
172 engine can be brought up to 182 spec with a change of inlet manifold, and exhaust manifold/front pipe. Fairly cheap way to add 10 ish brake.
Cambelt/dephaser change isn't as hard as some specialist like to make out, however I can see that it would be easy to get wrong even for a pro
diy'er without really triple checking the procedure. I've done 3 with engine in place, its not fun and a weekender but much cheaper than
getting it done by specialist. However the parts and tool costs aren't pleasant. Cam/tdc lock kit is circa £70, genuine cambelt, aux belt and
dephaser will set you back £300, so its defo worth looking for one thats been done, but dont assume its been done by someone who is a specialist or
has triple checked the way to do it. Its common for them to be down on power due to bad timing job.
That helps a lot thanks, if viewing a car other than the obvious A/C how do you know if it is a cup or not? is it stated on the log book as an
example.
I have seen some FF ones for sale, now i know what that means.
quote:
Originally posted by theduck
They are a specialist job because the genuine tools for timing them are expensive and the none genuine are apparently shite. Certainly seen many cars making poor power and it being down to poor cam timing
quote:
Originally posted by Andy D
Honda? Civic or CRX? I think the 1600 vtec is around 150bhp standard My son has a crx, well tweaked. He was testing at Teesside not long back.
quote:
Originally posted by marco
There are plenty of non cup 172 and 182's around is the cup the better handling car or would you not notice any difference?
..meanwhile back in the Honda corner..
Honda (Civic) v Clio at Oulton. ...OK I know you're after a Clio, but just for a bit of entertaiment.
The trophies front shock absorbers needed servicing every 12 months, so 99% of the ones on the road have either knackered front shocks or are running standard 182 gear or aftermarket shocks.
That helps a lot thanks,when I'm viewing a car other than the obvious A/C how do you know if it is a cup or not? is it stated on the log book as
an example.
I have seen some FF ones for sale, now i know what that means.
quote:
Originally posted by loggyboy
quote:
Originally posted by marco
There are plenty of non cup 172 and 182's around is the cup the better handling car or would you not notice any difference?
My 172s were non cup, my first 182 was also, but my latest 182 is what they nickname a 'fullfat', which means its a standard car (so leather, xenons, ac, abs etc) but has both cup options fitted, the styling pack (larger spoiler and splitter) and the suspension (and grey wheels).
I can say this car car feels better, but as the cars were all 10+yr old its hard to tell if that could be down to less worn/more recently replaced parts.
Previous owner did tell me he replaced wishbones and track arms with genuine parts the previous year, which is known to make the world of difference.
Unless you could have back to back tests I suspect it would only be slightly noticeable.
Less weight of the proper Cup version (no AC, ABS, leather, zenons) would no doubt add to that noticablity.
Its worth noting that some proper cups had AC fitted as an option (way to tell is if it has digital climate (non cup) or just an AC button, (cup with AC option). Trophies were cup spec, but had non climate AC as standard IIRC.
Clios are superb cars, mine was alot of fun, but the lack of a LSD limits its ability as a track car, you can fit one, I enquired, but your looking at
over £1000.
Many of the hot Civics come with them standard, so I would go Civic for the track.
Doesn't look like a lot in it between the Clio and the Civic 
If that's a 6r4 in front I bet he was disappointed given the investment in his car...
quote:
Originally posted by Andy D
..meanwhile back in the Honda corner..
Honda (Civic) v Clio at Oulton. ...OK I know you're after a Clio, but just for a bit of entertaiment.
quote:
Originally posted by marco
That helps a lot thanks,when I'm viewing a car other than the obvious A/C how do you know if it is a cup or not? is it stated on the log book as an example.
I have seen some FF ones for sale, now i know what that means.
As were showcasing track videos:
quote:
Originally posted by marco
Doesn't look like a lot in it between the Clio and the Civic
quote:
Originally posted by Andy D
..meanwhile back in the Honda corner..
Honda (Civic) v Clio at Oulton. ...OK I know you're after a Clio, but just for a bit of entertaiment.