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VX220 or Elise S1 or S2?
richardm6994 - 12/10/17 at 10:48 AM

I've inherited a nice bit of money and was made to promise I'd spend some of it on something I'd enjoy. So what better than another fun car - one that is a bit more suited to British weather as my kit has no weather gear, no screen, no doors and is a bit hardcore for wet roads.

So to the point, the budget I have in mind is between 9k-11.5k (stretch to 12k if the car was really worth it).

My shortlist is an Elise or VX220 c/w a hardtop.

The VX220 would probably be the 2.2na version given my budget. On the whole, they are cheaper than the lotus and and I do like the look of them, just not the badge (I'm sorry I know that sounds really petty!!)
A great number that are for sale also come with the hard-tops so I wouldn't have to buy one.


The lotus. Do I go for an S1 or S2? I prefer the looks of the S2 but I think my budget only will stretch to the older K series versions.
But everyone goes on about the S1's being the better car (I just prefer the S2 front end).
Barely any come with a hard top so would have to spend another 600 or 800 afterwards to get the hard top.


The cheapest lotus's for sale are right at the top-end of my budget, whereas the VX there are plenty within my budget.

I'm sure there are people on here who have own the above and would love to hear the positives and (more importantly) the negatives between the vx220 (2.2), and the Lotus's.


Are the lotus's worth the extra £2k over the VX?

As a side note, I really love the Exige rear engine cover and spoiler and I've seen that these can be fitted to the VX220's which would be really cool later down the line.

nick205 - 12/10/17 at 11:15 AM

Nice situation to have!

For me it'd be a Lotus over the Vauxhall. Like you the VX badge doesn't do it for me - silly perhaps, but that's me.

I've driven and been a passenger in an Elise and both were great experiences. Driving was on a track experience. Needless to say I thought I was Senna. Then the instructor advised me it was his own car and took me for a lap with him driving. Let's just say I realised how poor my driving was fairly quickly

loggyboy - 12/10/17 at 11:28 AM

I'm a series 1 man - but bias my dad has the first ever 111s. Very nice in car in Norfolk mustard and has a great history being owned by Lotus as a demo car and driven by a BTCC driver (Rydell IIRC) and Richard Hammond on road test. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U6GwBFEylqY

scootz - 12/10/17 at 11:31 AM

Your budget will not get you a particularly nice S1 Elise... it's prices, along with the S1 Exige and particularly the 340r, are starting to rise at an incredible rate. Clean original 340r's are now in the £75+k market (I nearly bought one in 2008 for £16k - the roll-bar had a tiny bit of corrosion on it, so I walked away... yes - I know.. I know!).

Now't wrong with the VX. They're every bit as good as their 'Lotus' half-siblings. Bin the badge if it offends you... switch it to a Opel badge if that appeals more... or just man-up and leave it with the Griffin on the front and stick 2 fingers up to any morons who comment on it.

Prices on good VX's are rising too just now. Be quick - come late spring, they will have jumped again... and I suspect it will be the unmolested Griffin badged cars that will command the best bucks).

[Edited on 13/10/17 by scootz]

loggyboy - 12/10/17 at 11:34 AM

quote:
Originally posted by scootz
. and I suspect it will be the unmolested Griffith badged cars that will command the best bucks).


Badged as a TVR?!

Sam_68 - 12/10/17 at 11:49 AM

quote:
Originally posted by scootz
Your budget will not get you a particularly nice S1 Elise... it's prices, along with the S1 Exige and particularly the 340r, are starting to rise at an incredible rate.


...But for that reason it might be the most 'sensible' option? A slightly scruffy S1 can be tidied. A K-series S2 will always play second fiddle to the Toyota engined cars.

I've owned two S1's - a near standard car and a Sport 160. I've driven several S2's and didn't enjoy them quite as much (although the gearchange on the Toyota engined cars is much better).

bi22le - 12/10/17 at 11:52 AM

Back in my auto-electrician days I worked on both the VX and S1, when they first come out.

They are essentially the same car underneath, but IIRC the VX actually comes with more. It has to really as Lotus keep it true to their name and Vauxhall soften the edges for the nannys.

If it was me, I would go for an 'under powered' S1. More prestige and chance to increase value, and nothing is going to come close to the kit for speed so no point trying to get the fastest most powerful thing. The S1 will bring its own driving experience.

richardm6994 - 12/10/17 at 12:12 PM

Some good points.
I will be acting fast (hoping to buy in the next few weeks). I would probably lightly track this car from time to time, however I'm not after 'all-out' performance, just a 2 seater that I can drive to work etc...every so often and not have to worry if the weather turns bad half way through the day. I love the kit but whenever I drive it to work I have one eye on my job and the other eye on the weather!!!!

I suppose what I'm trying to get my head around is whether or not the Lotus's are worth the extra money (£2k+) over the VX220 - or if you're just paying for the badge.

I prefer (slightly) the curvy look to the elise, and I prefer the prestige of the 'Lotus' badge, but I don't think either of these points would make me want to pay the extra £££ for the lotus's unless they had other advantages over the VX.

I also like my cars to 'stand out', and I keep finding myself looking at the VX200 with heart-shaped eyes......
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201708288742672?model=VX220&postcode=de53eq&make=VAUXHALL&advertising-location=at_cars& sort=sponsored&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New&radius=1501&page=1

nick205 - 12/10/17 at 12:57 PM

If the Lotus is £2k more than the VX, look after it and it'll be worth more when you come to sell it.

wylliezx9r - 12/10/17 at 12:59 PM

I have recently sold a supercharged VX220. It was N/A when I bought it and I did the conversion myself taken it to 230 BHP.
In N/A form with 147 BHP the car felt very under powered compared to the chassis capability, the 120 bhp Elise must be even more frustrating and I would personally avoid.
Whichever you choose to buy make sure the rear toe links have been up rated as they can let go with devastating consequences.

richardm6994 - 12/10/17 at 01:17 PM

Now there's something I've not thought of......supercharging the 2.2 VX.

I've done 5 supercharger project's to date so it would be nice to do one for myself for a change!
Which charger did you use? Did you have to uprate the engine internals?

Yazza54 - 12/10/17 at 02:12 PM

I'm selling a nice little british sportscar at the moment for considerably under your budget ...

richardm6994 - 12/10/17 at 02:23 PM

Tempting and definitely a lot of car for the money.....but I have a lotus / vx itch that needs scratching

wylliezx9r - 12/10/17 at 02:28 PM

quote:
Originally posted by richardm6994
Now there's something I've not thought of......supercharging the 2.2 VX.

I've done 5 supercharger project's to date so it would be nice to do one for myself for a change!
Which charger did you use? Did you have to uprate the engine internals?


Its a tried and tested route that has been done by many. It's an M62 charger using all off the shelf GM parts from the Chevrolet Cobalt SS - do some googling and there's loads of information on it. You don't have to uprate the internals until 260 bhp. It cost me about £2k all in to carry out the conversion.


http://www.courtenaysport.co.uk/supercharger-conversions/info_102.html

[Edited on 12/10/17 by wylliezx9r]

Yazza54 - 12/10/17 at 02:28 PM

quote:
Originally posted by richardm6994
Tempting and definitely a lot of car for the money.....but I have a lotus / vx itch that needs scratching


Fair enough fella, I just noticed that at your budget you would be looking at lower powered variants and then you were talking about supercharging etc etc. That's the same conclusion I came to when I was toying with buying one a while ago. I'm sure a 120hp S1 Elise could still be peddled pretty quick but it really is pretty asthmatic in this day and age!

Yazza54 - 12/10/17 at 02:30 PM

I know where there's a nice 2003 Courtenay Stage 2 245hp supercharged VX220, he wants 12K for it last time I asked, not sure how that stacks up in the market it's a while since I've looked

[Edited on 12/10/17 by Yazza54]

ste - 12/10/17 at 05:44 PM

You will get very bored of how slow a k series elise is very quickly.


Why not one of these?

Very fast and handle great too

2004 54 HONDA S 2000 2.0 GT 16V 2D 240 BHP


Plus, they will stat appreciating in value soon too, so a great investment

scudderfish - 12/10/17 at 06:59 PM

When I had an S2 Elise, I used to enjoy winding up Lotus badge snobs by saying the VX was more Lotus than the S1. My line of reasoning was they were built side by side at Hethel, but the engine in the Elise was straight off the truck from Rover, but the engine in the VX had been engineered by Lotus. Badge snobs are just snobs

perksy - 12/10/17 at 07:57 PM

Did a track day at Mallory in an S1 and thought it handled brilliantly but needed more power

It also leaked like a bloody sieve when it rained and the car was 12 months old at the time

The VX looks good value but check for osmosis and damage to the floor pan underneath
Mate had one up on the ramps recently and it looked like somebody had shot it underneath with a machine gun

scootz - 13/10/17 at 04:06 AM

quote:
Originally posted by loggyboy
quote:
Originally posted by scootz
. and I suspect it will be the unmolested Griffith badged cars that will command the best bucks).


Badged as a TVR?!



Give me credit for getting one of them right.

scootz - 13/10/17 at 09:59 AM

quote:
Originally posted by ste
You will get very bored of how slow a k series elise is very quickly.

Why not one of these?

Very fast and handle great too

2004 54 HONDA S 2000 2.0 GT 16V 2D 240 BHP

Plus, they will stat appreciating in value soon too, so a great investment



Ah, the Honda Widowmaker! It'll only appreciate in value because there's only about 3 of them left now cos the rest have been written off!

Seriously though - great car. But if Sir genuinely likes a spirited drive every now and then, then the Honda WILL lull you into a false sense of security at speed at some point and you WILL need to have your wits about you to sort out the expanding laws of physics as they unfold in front of you as quickly as they did during the Big Bang (before the final big 'bang'.

I don't know what it is about them - as plenty of folk have gone from high powered, rear-wheel drive cars to S2000's and had moments... and then had MOMENTS! Good drivers too - not just folk who bought one thinking it's a pretty 2.0 Honda with a soft-top.

johnH20 - 13/10/17 at 12:42 PM

Something to bear in mind that has not been mentioned. How old and or tall are you? None of your three options is easy to get in and out of if you are compromised on either count, especially with hardtop in place. Would definitely compromise everyday usability. I am a fully qualified old git and eventually gave up my Elise S2 basically because I was not using it enough and that was partly due to the above. Of your choices the S2 and VX have lower sills than an S1 so a better choice in that regard.

richardm6994 - 13/10/17 at 12:56 PM

according to wikipedia, middle-age is between 45-60 and young adulthood is 18-40........so I'm very happy to say I'm a still a young adult and very much a short ar5e!!!

The S2000 is a nice car, but just not what I'm fancying. I'm not after 'the fastest' as not a lot will compare the to Kit for that.

I started off (when I found out about getting the money) at the VX220, then changed my mind onto the lotus S2, now I'm back to the VX.

Some good input, thanks.

richardm6994 - 20/11/17 at 04:59 PM

got one!!!
2.2 soon to be supercharged......
I've done about 500 miles so far. Great car (albeit under powered at the moment) and love it!!

perksy - 20/11/17 at 09:07 PM

Very Nice

I like the combo of the car and wheel colour