nick205
|
| posted on 22/8/16 at 10:54 AM |
|
|
VW 1.9 TDI "BXE" engine oil extraction
Hi All,
Went to change SWMBO's engine oil and filter yesterday (57 plate Touran 1.9 TDI "BXE" engine code) and tried to use my Pela 6000 oil
extraction pump via the dipstick tube. Done this successfully many times on my 2.0 TDI passat (57 plate) and 1.9 TDI Alhamra (Y plate).
However the thin pipe from the extractor went down the dipstick pipe, but hit something and wouldn't go into the sump - no oil on the end of the
thin extractor pipe when I removed it.
So my question is - is there something in the dipstick tube (or sump) preventing you using this method?
Seems odd that VW would do it to some engines and not others!
Also seems a real PITA having to get underneath the car and drain the oil when an extractor pump is much quicker and cleaner.
Any ideas...?
ETA...Tried Googling for an answer, but can't find anything specific on the BXE engine.
[Edited on 22/8/16 by nick205]
[Edited on 22/8/16 by nick205]
|
|
|
|
|
r1_pete
|
| posted on 22/8/16 at 11:57 AM |
|
|
probably a windage tray with a hole for the dipstick, but the flexible pipe on the extractor is bending and hitting the tray as it exits the dipstick
tube...
|
|
|
nick205
|
| posted on 22/8/16 at 12:08 PM |
|
|
Fair point - I'd guessed at some sort of plate to stop an extractor pipe going in. The extractor pipe itself is fairly stiff so shouldn't
bend much, but I guess a dipstick hole could be quite small.
What I really want to avoid is having to piddle about removing the plastic under engine tray to get access to the sump nut. I have a suitable pan to
catch the draining oil as I've had to do this before, but the mess potential is higher than with the extractor pump 
|
|
|
nick205
|
| posted on 22/8/16 at 12:41 PM |
|
|
A little more lunchtime Googling on BXE engines doesn't appear to suggest anything obvious in the way of the extractor pipe entering the sump.
Could well be wrong though!
|
|
|
MikeRJ
|
| posted on 22/8/16 at 01:37 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by nick205
A little more lunchtime Googling on BXE engines doesn't appear to suggest anything obvious in the way of the extractor pipe entering the sump.
Could well be wrong though!
Did you find the other issue relating to BXE engines i.e. con rods deciding to leave the engine through the side?
You could try introducing a small bend right at the end of the flexible tube and then rotate the tube when it hits the obstruction. This has worked
for me on engines that have been awkward to use with a Pella.
[Edited on 22/8/16 by MikeRJ]
|
|
|
gremlin1234
|
| posted on 22/8/16 at 01:53 PM |
|
|
I don't know the exact layout of these engines,
but could it be the tube hitting a conrod/bigend/crankshaft, and turning the engine over a few degrees would make its path easier?
edit, scrap that idea, else the dipstick wouldn't work!
[Edited on 22/8/16 by gremlin1234]
|
|
|
nick205
|
| posted on 22/8/16 at 02:08 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by MikeRJ
quote:
Originally posted by nick205
A little more lunchtime Googling on BXE engines doesn't appear to suggest anything obvious in the way of the extractor pipe entering the sump.
Could well be wrong though!
Did you find the other issue relating to BXE engines i.e. con rods deciding to leave the engine through the side?
You could try introducing a small bend right at the end of the flexible tube and then rotate the tube when it hits the obstruction. This has worked
for me on engines that have been awkward to use with a Pella.
[Edited on 22/8/16 by MikeRJ]
Indeed I have read of this issue. However I have the engine and have had many other TDIs in the past too. I've kept them well serviced and not
encountered any issues with them. Yes, it may be an issue with BXE engines, but no more so (I suspect) than many other engines.
The one we have is not worked hard and has a full service history with it too. I shan't keep myself awake worrying about what might happen -
I'd rather find a way to change the oil clean and fast.
|
|
|
nick205
|
| posted on 22/8/16 at 02:10 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by gremlin1234
I don't know the exact layout of these engines,
but could it be the tube hitting a conrod/bigend/crankshaft, and turning the engine over a few degrees would make its path easier?
edit, scrap that idea, else the dipstick wouldn't work!
[Edited on 22/8/16 by gremlin1234]
Not a wild idea although I admit I hadn't got as far as trying it and yes, the dipstick must have a clear path into the sump 
|
|
|
nick205
|
| posted on 24/8/16 at 10:23 AM |
|
|
Well a bit more searching indicates the VAG BXE 1.9 TDI engine is fitted with a sump baffle...
http://uk.en
ginepartsexpress.com/schwallblech-vw-skoda-seat-audi-a3-leon-golf-1-9-tdi-bxe-06b103623?___store=uk&___from_store=uk
[img] [/img]
Being honest I can't see why the stiff extractor pipe wouldn't pass through the hole that must be in the baffle for the dipstick - suffice
to say it doesn't.
I'm frustrated and want to find an answer, but am a little stumped right now!
[Edited on 24/8/16 by nick205]
|
|
|
r1_pete
|
| posted on 24/8/16 at 10:30 AM |
|
|
Could you put a 2.4mm welding rod through the extraction pipe to make it a bit stiffer, when its in, pull the welding rod out and connect up to your
extractor?
I can't see the hole in the baffle being any smaller than the dipstick tube ID.
|
|
|
nick205
|
| posted on 24/8/16 at 10:33 AM |
|
|
Not tried that, but I can see your thinking and it may work - will try it tonight 
Thanks
ETA...I don't have a welding rod to hand, but a wire coat hanger is available and will do the job.
[Edited on 24/8/16 by nick205]
|
|
|
r1_pete
|
| posted on 24/8/16 at 12:31 PM |
|
|
Yep, just to keep it as straight as a dipstick when it pops out of the tube.....
|
|
|
nick205
|
| posted on 24/8/16 at 01:12 PM |
|
|
I will certainly make sure the coat hanger is straight before inserting it. Fingers crossed it'll work and I'll find a way of getting the
extractor into the sump as well.
|
|
|
dai1983
|
| posted on 24/8/16 at 02:12 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by nick205
quote:
Originally posted by MikeRJ
quote:
Originally posted by nick205
A little more lunchtime Googling on BXE engines doesn't appear to suggest anything obvious in the way of the extractor pipe entering the sump.
Could well be wrong though!
Did you find the other issue relating to BXE engines i.e. con rods deciding to leave the engine through the side?
You could try introducing a small bend right at the end of the flexible tube and then rotate the tube when it hits the obstruction. This has worked
for me on engines that have been awkward to use with a Pella.
[Edited on 22/8/16 by MikeRJ]
Indeed I have read of this issue. However I have the engine and have had many other TDIs in the past too. I've kept them well serviced and not
encountered any issues with them. Yes, it may be an issue with BXE engines, but no more so (I suspect) than many other engines.
The one we have is not worked hard and has a full service history with it too. I shan't keep myself awake worrying about what might happen -
I'd rather find a way to change the oil clean and fast.
I'd like to know what percentage of the failures were on 24k/24 month servicing. We have the same engine in our family car and ive changed its
oil every year since it was 3 years old. They also like to use a bit (1ltr per 8-10k miles) or push it through the breather system into the
intercooler etc.
|
|
|
nick205
|
| posted on 24/8/16 at 04:01 PM |
|
|
Valid point - where failed engines serviced frequently or not?
Some years ago I had a 2.0 TDI Passat company car. It was on long service and asked for a service around the 20k miles mark. Not my own car and had
it from new so TBH I wasn't really that fussed, but has I spent my own money on it then it would have been serviced more frequently than that.
|
|
|
nick205
|
| posted on 25/8/16 at 08:25 AM |
|
|
 SWMBO's flat battery/bonnet release to deal with last night so no chance to try poking a wire down the dip stick tube - one to try tonight
I think.
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/viewthread.php?tid=205566
|
|
|
nick205
|
| posted on 10/9/16 at 06:08 PM |
|
|
Quick update...
Having had the bonnet fixed I can now get to the engine and I tried a thin welding rod down the dipstick tube. It went straight in to the sump and
hit the bottom. The oil on the end of it confirmed success for me. I haven't retried the Pela extraction pipe yet, but if the welding rod went
in then I see no reason why the extraction pipe shouldn't. Next weekend will be my target for getting the oil change done.
|
|
|
Attilauk
|
| posted on 13/9/16 at 06:39 AM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by MikeRJ
quote:
Originally posted by nick205
A little more lunchtime Googling on BXE engines doesn't appear to suggest anything obvious in the way of the extractor pipe entering the sump.
Could well be wrong though!
Did you find the other issue relating to BXE engines i.e. con rods deciding to leave the engine through the side?
You could try introducing a small bend right at the end of the flexible tube and then rotate the tube when it hits the obstruction. This has worked
for me on engines that have been awkward to use with a Pella.
[Edited on 22/8/16 by MikeRJ]
I was warned of this issue when I had my bxe engined Passat, I kept it regularly serviced, had it remapped to 145bhp and thrashed the nuts off it for
6 years. I sold it on with 180,000 on the clock still running smoothly and pulling strongly...
|
|
|
907
|
| posted on 13/9/16 at 07:55 AM |
|
|
Pardon me for saying this, not wishing to disagree, but in the time it has taken to write all these posts
couldn't you have taken off the sump cover and removed the sump plug, and done the job properly ?
Just stating what to me is the obvious.
Paul G
|
|
|
nick205
|
| posted on 13/9/16 at 08:02 AM |
|
|
Possibly I could have, but I bought the extractor to do the job and save the effort. My understanding is that garages use extractors so why
shouldn't I. I also find it hard to believe that VW would try and stop you doing it that way on the BXE engine, but not on others.
|
|
|
907
|
| posted on 13/9/16 at 09:39 AM |
|
|
The last time I paid for a oil change was in an Audi dealership on my A3 2l TDI. (Just to get the book stamped)
They charged me £199 in total of which £72 was for the oil.
If I thought that they hadn't drained the oil, as opposed to sucking some out, and had been so idle that they hadn't
removed the drain plug then I would never go back there again. In fact I didn't. All further work was done at my
local garage. I think that £199 should leave a sufficient margin of time to unscrew a drain plug.
Just my opinion.
Paul G
|
|
|
nick205
|
| posted on 13/9/16 at 10:39 AM |
|
|
Valid points.
it's the garage cost for the work I can do myself that drives me. Plus if I do it myself I know it's done properly.
That said, I have grade 1 shaved head and have done it myself for 22 years now. Simply can't live with paying someone else to do it :-)
Nick
|
|
|
Attilauk
|
| posted on 13/9/16 at 11:50 AM |
|
|
I have a friend who used to be a VW tech, they are trained to change the oil using a sucker rather than remove the drain plug.
Its quicker, less likely to damage the undertray and sump and removes more of the material deposits from the sump than draining.
VW sumps are made of cheese grade steel, they are soft as hell. I had to replace 3 on a mk4 golf as the slightest touch would hole them. A heavy
handed mechanic would easily strip the threads on one...
|
|
|
nick205
|
| posted on 13/9/16 at 01:16 PM |
|
|
The same understanding I have too.
I'll be trying again with the extractor this weeken.
|
|
|
ian locostzx9rc2
|
| posted on 13/9/16 at 02:22 PM |
|
|
Just remove the under tray and drain it that way that's what sump plugs are designed for 
|
|
|
