sdh2903
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| posted on 25/9/15 at 05:30 PM |
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Mx5 engine tuning, which would you do?
Hi all.
I'm just about to start my vortx mx5 build when I collect the kit this week. I have a mk1 1.8 engine which I would like to "pep-up"
a little. Now I had this discussion a while ago and had kind of settled on turboing, however I've came across a cylinder head kit from blink
motorsport here http://blinkmotorsport.com/packages.html
Comes with head, cams, megasquirt pnp ecu, wideband, all gaskets and seals and gives 160bhp.
I'm now seriously thinking about taking this option as it will simplify the build a lot and its probably cheaper than a decent spec turbo build
plus the cost of an ecu. However I'm fully aware the N/A tuning options after this kit are limited and pricey and that the turbo option does
give more options for further power.
So my question is, should I go turbo or N/A?
Granted I appreciate turbo owners will say "turbo it" and the NA will say N/A is best, but there must be some out in the collective who
have owned both who can give an objective viewpoint?
Cheers
Steve
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theconrodkid
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| posted on 25/9/15 at 05:37 PM |
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prob the easiest way to more powwwwwwwwa is to slap a turbo on,tis a well troden path and no i dont own a turbo 
who cares who wins
pass the pork pies
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Ugg10
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| posted on 25/9/15 at 06:25 PM |
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There is a guy on here that does a nice eaton supercharger kit. Well worth considering.
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/forum/9/viewthread.php?tid=195792
---------------------------------------------------------------
1968 Ford Anglia 105e, 1.7 Zetec SE, Mk2 Escort Workd Cup front end, 5 link rear
Build Blog - http://Anglia1968.weebly.com
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sdh2903
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| posted on 25/9/15 at 06:30 PM |
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Cheers. Yes I'd seen that. The only problem is the MNR bay looks a bit tighter for room than the SR2 that kit Is fitted to. It's tight
even for a small turbo. For that reason I'd discounted supercharging.
 
vortx2
[Edited on 25/9/15 by sdh2903]
[Edited on 25/9/15 by sdh2903]
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chillis
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| posted on 25/9/15 at 08:18 PM |
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The estimated power quoted here is like a builders estimate - there's no way an MX5 has 33bhp power loss in the transmittion, on those rollers I
could probably get 135hp from my stock 1.6.
There are two problems with all but the vvc mx5 engine, low compression ratio (why the turbo boys like this engine) and low valve lift. The way to
raise the cr is with different pistons but thats £500 - 650. Skimming the head wont raise the cr enough as you can only safely take about 1.1mm off
the head. As for valve lift its not just a case of fitting high lift cams, the head needs machining to clear the bigger lobes of high lift cams -
(there isn't enough material on a stock cam to reprofile it to a high lift) the tappet buckets need to be a bigger diameter and the valve
springs need to be longer as well - getting a head machined would cost around £400 -500 and you d need billet cams as well.
Because of the low lift potential of this head many cams have longer duration with low lift but without higher cr of around 11:1 or more you'll
not realise the benifit.
An normally aspirated mx5 engine making 150+ bhp is usually somewhere between £1800 and 3000, and you can get a jolly good turbo kit for that money
and most people go down that route.
If you have the skills to build a kit car then you've probably got what it takes to put a turbo package together, turbo off ebay, a suitable
manifold may be a bit pricey but there are plenty of second hand turbo bits for these engines (just remember a 1.6 manifold doesnt fit a 1.8). £1250
should get you a good usable turbo set up (friend of a co-worker turbo'd his mk1 mx5 for £300 and has around 250bhp)
Never under estimate the ingenuity of an idiot!
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sdh2903
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| posted on 25/9/15 at 08:52 PM |
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Well blink motorsport are highly regarded and tend to err on the side of caution with their bhp figures. They also use a hub pack dyno showing a
before and after so no guestimates of power at the fly for willy waving purposes. so unless you have inside info at blink to contradict the figures I
don't think your being fair.
I wholly agree if i want more than 160 flywheel bhp then bang for buck you can't beat a turbo and I even have a tdo4 sitting in my unit.
I'm just wavering over packaging, heat management and plumbing issues that an NA option would make simpler.
[Edited on 25/9/15 by sdh2903]
[Edited on 25/9/15 by sdh2903]
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Smokey mow
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| posted on 25/9/15 at 10:28 PM |
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The threads below on the WSCC forum are well worth a read if you're thinking about a Blink engine or turbo/supercharging.
The engine in my own car was assembled by Blink in 2011. The Cams and ECU are stock 1600cc Mazda but the rest of the engine has the following spec.
Blink optimised pro-motor rebuild and cylinder head
0.25mm oversize pistons
Cometic head-gasket
Crank scraper
Flowed cylinder-head
10:1 CR
3-angle valve seats
Optimised air flow meter
The car was run on the Dyno at Atspead in Essex and produced 129.3BHP @6609rpm 109.8 lbft torque
Several owners of Mazda based Westfield's have now chosen to upgrade further by fitting the re profiled Piper cams and megasqurt ECU as well as
turbo and superchargers. Many of the result of these upgrades can be found in the links.
With regard to Blink they have an enviable reputation for their work with the MX5 engines and are well respected as traders on both the WSCC and
MX5Nutz forums. For the past few years they have been building engines for a number of drivers in the BRSCC Mazda championship and indeed the current
championship leader.
http://forum.wscc.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic/106558-mazda-16-power/
http://forum.wscc.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic/99195-improving-the-mx5-16-engine/
http://forum.wscc.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic/111234-more-mazda-engine-upgrades-stage-2-1800-cc-power-package/
http://forum.wscc.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic/114700-mazda-1800cc-blink-stage-2-upgrade-package-na/
http://forum.wscc.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic/100443-mx5-sdv-power-upgrade-project/
http://forum.wscc.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic/114587-breaking-the-magic-barrier-mx5-sdv-power-upgrade-project/
http://forum.wscc.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic/113415-winter-upgrades-complete/
http://forum.wscc.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic/114367-turbocharging-the-mazdafield/
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Nickp
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| posted on 26/9/15 at 06:42 AM |
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What about IVA'ing it on the std lump then going straight to their Stage 2 kit when you're ready? 180bhp should make it more interesting
 The Stage 1 kit may be OK but will probably leave you feeling you want more sooner rather than later.
However, an MX5 Turbo does look fun 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=5&v=QQha4DkxHpI
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sdh2903
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| posted on 26/9/15 at 07:01 AM |
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Hi nick. I had thought about that but I'd rather "do it right, do it once" and get it built to the right spec. I wouldn't be
able to stretch the budget to the stage 2 kit unfortunately but seemingly the biggest gains are to be had with the stage 1 as the stock inlet on the
1.8 is apparantly quite good.
Yes you are right the turbo builds do look quite fun.
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sdh2903
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| posted on 26/9/15 at 07:02 AM |
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Cheers smokey for taking the time to post all those links. I had read a couple of those threads. Some good reading.
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rdodger
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| posted on 26/9/15 at 09:04 AM |
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I went down a similar path with my build
I went with a MP62 supercharger and built the car with it all fitted. For IVA I removed it and had it tested with the standard ecu etc then refitted
the supercharger.
I then blew the supercharger to bits and removed it again 
The reasons for testing it standard were I thought I had enough to worry about without having to get a map done to pass IVA then altered again
after.
If I was to do it again I would turbo it. But I would do it after IVA when I was used to the car and had plenty of experience on track with it.
I really like the way I can use all of the power most of the time with the standard 1.8 on track. I think it has made me a better driver as to keep up
with more powerful cars you really have to concentrate on maintaining speed through corners.
It really is a lot of fun ringing it's neck. Before with the SC I found I was managing the power and relying on it to out drag other cars to
pass them.
There are a few people on MX5 Nutz, facebook and ebay selling turbo manifolds, down pipes etc.
I would imagine a lot of the manifolds available won't be suitable for the MNR but a couple of the guys making them (Sturovo on Nutz) will help
by making one offs.
A visit to Blink would be a good idea as the guys there have a wealth of knowledge not only with MX5's but a lot of kits and run a Westfield
themselves. I have always found them very helpful. They can help with boosted options as well as NA including the supply of ECU, mapping etc.
I would say to do a quality turbo install with the ECU, new modern turbo (Garrett GT2560), intercooler, mapping, inconel studs, wideband, hoses,
upgraded clutch etc will end up costing £2500-£3000.
If you haven't already considered the coolant reroute I would do that too.
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richardm6994
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| posted on 26/9/15 at 02:38 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Ugg10
There is a guy on here that does a nice eaton supercharger kit. Well worth considering.
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/forum/9/viewthread.php?tid=195792
Appreciate the mention
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sdh2903
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| posted on 26/9/15 at 02:47 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by richardm6994
quote:
Originally posted by Ugg10
There is a guy on here that does a nice eaton supercharger kit. Well worth considering.
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/forum/9/viewthread.php?tid=195792
Appreciate the mention
Can you make an ultra compact version?
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