qwerty_100
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| posted on 28/7/14 at 03:07 PM |
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Hi Phil
The article that I referred to was in CCC October 1998. Mark Hales tested 4 cars not 3 cars as I originally said they were The Eldon V8
A Westfield SE 1600
My Phoenix/MK4
Sylva Striker
I found a copy of the issue on ebay after tracking down year and month and it makes for good reading, No need to answer the other questions as
Jeff has posted some pictures. I have a full set of suspension bushes but would like to change the upper and lower ball joints but I am not a 100%
sure what they are off. If when you are back let me know and I can post the article to you or drop it in I am often up that neck of the woods with
work cheers Kev
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Sam_68
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| posted on 28/7/14 at 05:28 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by jeffw
OK....but was it ever called Phoenix? My understand from conversation with Jeremy that it wasn't.
Far be it from me to disagree with Jeremy, but I'm pretty sure it was, yes.
My recollection (and it's obviously a number of years ago now) was that the Phoenix name arose when Chris Appleby briefly took on the project
from Jeremy. I think I've got rid of it in recent clear-out, but unless I'm going senile, I'm sure I had a brochure from
during this era that I got directly from Chris at Stoneleigh in the name of 'Phoenix Sports Cars'.
A brief Google suggests I'm not alone in this understanding:
link
link
Marketing of the car subsequently passed back to Jeremy (who told me that Chris had wrecked the moulds for the 'downforce' front end by
trimming off the returns), but the Phoenix name stuck.
Edited to add:
I'm now absolutely sure that the Phoenix name pre-dates the 'current' bodyshell. Among the handful of old kit car mags that I
haven't thrown out is a copy of Kitcars International from March 1993, which has a couple of pages listing back-issue articles, amongst
which: 'SYLVA PHOENIX. Track test of a championship winner. MAR 92'.
[Edited on 28/7/14 by Sam_68]
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philfingers
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| posted on 28/7/14 at 06:55 PM |
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That later article confirms my thoughts and earlier comments that the MkIV was originally called the Sylva Clubmans or MkIV Striker with chassis using
the modified MkIII chassis (I owned a MkIII from 94-96, Q421 PFW). It was later it became known as the Phoenix.
I remember back around 92 going to Martley, Worcs. to Teme Valley Race Engines (in a BDA Escort for tuning). Graham's partner had the agency, I
think for Sylva. There was a fast Fury there. At the time I think the Fury was still under Sylva ownership. I still have a magazine somewhere at home
with a feature on it
Kev, I will also have the CCC issue too, I have them all from about 1990 until the last issue. What a great mag that died off. Will have a search for
it
The true home of cars born under the Sylva name - http://jpsc.org.uk/forum
STM Phoenix R1
Sold-Sylva Striker 1300xf, 40s etc
Sold-Sylva Phoenix, 1300xf, BVH, 234cam, 2xDCOE 40s, live axle - 'old school', rally car and a few bikes
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Sam_68
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| posted on 28/7/14 at 07:23 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by philfingers...the MkIV was originally called the Sylva Clubmans or MkIV Striker with chassis using the modified
MkIII chassis (I owned a MkIII from 94-96, Q421 PFW).
Yes, I've got a copy of the original build manual for the Striker (with proper photographs, individually pasted-in, presumably because small
print runs of colour printing were too expensive back then!), which refers to it as the 'Striker Mk.4 Clubman' [sic].
As you say, the early Clubman cars (including my own) used Chevette uprights and outboard springs, but later cars were fitted with the Escort
strut-derived uprights and rocker arms.
Jeremy told me at the time that the Chevette uprights and outboard suspension actually offered slightly better geometry, in his opinion, but
that later Strikers (and Furys) standardised on the Escort components for the convenience of 'single donor' sourcing (at least if you
turned a blind eye to the need for an Allegro steering column and a few other 'foreign' bits!).
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philfingers
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| posted on 28/7/14 at 08:25 PM |
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I have to say that I've always felt that my MkIII striker handled better than my 1st Phoenix with striker MkII chassis, my MkII striker I just
sold and the IRS Phoenix I have now. But then it could be 20 years of rose tinted memories!
Sam- that clubmans of yours looks lovely too, nice traditional old school look. I bought an old Raleigh Whisper the other week for the 1968 plate to
use on my (2005 registered Phoenix) but didn't have the heart to ruin the Raleighs identity. Best give Kev his thread back, my apologies Kev :-)
The true home of cars born under the Sylva name - http://jpsc.org.uk/forum
STM Phoenix R1
Sold-Sylva Striker 1300xf, 40s etc
Sold-Sylva Phoenix, 1300xf, BVH, 234cam, 2xDCOE 40s, live axle - 'old school', rally car and a few bikes
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qwerty_100
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| posted on 29/7/14 at 06:30 AM |
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No need to apologise Phil it has been very interesting learning about all the different marks of striker/phoenix/MK4 there are, hopefully I will have
it back on the road or the Donnington show and we can all have a good old chin wag once again thanks for all the advise and as per previous post does
anyone know what lower and upper ball joints are required cheers Kev.
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philfingers
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| posted on 29/7/14 at 07:04 AM |
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Sorry I don't know. But I'm sure if you google it you'll find the answer. You'd be better maybe looking on JPSC forum. Sherpa
ball joint rings a bell. Do they need to be changed?
When's the Donnington show?
I'm going to try and make the Blyton track day, 18th Sept
The true home of cars born under the Sylva name - http://jpsc.org.uk/forum
STM Phoenix R1
Sold-Sylva Striker 1300xf, 40s etc
Sold-Sylva Phoenix, 1300xf, BVH, 234cam, 2xDCOE 40s, live axle - 'old school', rally car and a few bikes
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Sam_68
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| posted on 29/7/14 at 10:50 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by qwerty_100...does anyone know what lower and upper ball joints are required cheers Kev.
Assuming it's the Escort strut based front suspension, the early build manual I have specifies Vauxhall Chevette top wishbone knuckle joints for
the rocker arms.
The lower track control arm is listed in the manual as standard Escort Mk. II (fitted with a Sylva-supplied compression strut), so would have been
standard Escort Mk.II lower ball joint. Yours is the later tubular alternative, though, hence will be different - can't help you there,
I'm afraid!
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qwerty_100
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| posted on 30/7/14 at 06:59 PM |
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Thanks any way Sam I think it is time to take them off and get the parts book out Chevette sounds familiar and I am sure the guy in the local parts
shop will be able to help many thanks Kev
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philfingers
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| posted on 30/7/14 at 07:45 PM |
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Pretty sure the lower is the Sherpa QR1774RH
I have the PDFs of both the sylva MkII and MkIV construction manual and the Fisher Fury build manual 94-04
The former states the upper is late metro top wishbone joints for the rocker arms
Fisher manual states chevette
When I get home I'm more than happy to email them but not a chance from here at the moment
The former covers the MkIV striker too
Interestingly it is dated 1987 and reprinted 1999. There's no mention of Phoenix. Only 'striker MkIV clubman' !
The true home of cars born under the Sylva name - http://jpsc.org.uk/forum
STM Phoenix R1
Sold-Sylva Striker 1300xf, 40s etc
Sold-Sylva Phoenix, 1300xf, BVH, 234cam, 2xDCOE 40s, live axle - 'old school', rally car and a few bikes
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Sam_68
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| posted on 31/7/14 at 06:10 AM |
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That is interesting: my copy of the manual is the original (1987) version, not the later re-print. So clearly the spec of the upper wishbone
joints were changed from Chevette to Metro at some stage?
Does your version still show the Mk.IV 'Clubman' as having outboard suspension with Chevette uprights, or had it standardised on the
Escort-based rocker suspension by then?
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bigfoot4616
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| posted on 31/7/14 at 07:43 AM |
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my striker (originally a mk3 but at some point someone converted it to inboard as mk2) with escort uprights uses the metro upper balljoint.
my rocker arms are different to the pics above, the ball joint screws into the top of the upright.
the lower joint is from a sherpa, not sure on part numbers, raw have just supplied me with new ones along with my new wishbones.
link shows my uprights with metro balljoint.
the bolt on steering arm means mine are from a RS escort (or capri i think)
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/viewthread.php?tid=101166
[Edited on 31/7/14 by bigfoot4616]
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philfingers
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| posted on 31/7/14 at 08:14 AM |
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Bigfoot-
So is it just a single stud from the ball joint through the outboard end of the rocker (like my 2005 STM Phoenix below) or is it a two bolt
arrangement?
[Edited on 31/7/14 by philfingers]
The true home of cars born under the Sylva name - http://jpsc.org.uk/forum
STM Phoenix R1
Sold-Sylva Striker 1300xf, 40s etc
Sold-Sylva Phoenix, 1300xf, BVH, 234cam, 2xDCOE 40s, live axle - 'old school', rally car and a few bikes
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bigfoot4616
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| posted on 31/7/14 at 08:46 AM |
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same as your pic, although my rocker is a different shape, much more box like.
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philfingers
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| posted on 31/7/14 at 09:03 AM |
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I guess yours are the chevette ones then Kev
The true home of cars born under the Sylva name - http://jpsc.org.uk/forum
STM Phoenix R1
Sold-Sylva Striker 1300xf, 40s etc
Sold-Sylva Phoenix, 1300xf, BVH, 234cam, 2xDCOE 40s, live axle - 'old school', rally car and a few bikes
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qwerty_100
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| posted on 31/7/14 at 09:47 AM |
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Thanks Phil I am going to take them off and take them with me so I can get the chap to match but chevette seems to be the favourite thanks to all for
the help specially Phil as I now know what model my gar is and I will try to post some pics of engine bay and seats soon cheers Kev
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