Hi lads.

Im still wondering what I should upgrade to for a winter project from my CBR1000F engined indy. I want more power and am currently trying to list all my options.

So far I have these possible options:

1, Fit a more powerfull engine like the zx12, busa, R1.
2, Fit a more modern engine like the CBR1000RR and such.
3, Fit a turbo charged R1
4, try and make my own turbo charged CBR1000F.

They all have there pros and cons and im currently listing them. But in short heres a few of them:

1, not massivly more powerfull (50 bhp or less) then I have now, cost and sump mods to the first 2.
2, cost, injection mods ?, all need sump mods, lots of untested bits.
3, Reliability issues.
4, the unknown, but if no engine mods very cheap.

Any comments welcome, but I need some info on the last option.

As far as I know the turbo R1 has no engine mods is this true?. If it is can I assume that its just bunging a turbo onto a manifold, intercooler and pressurized carbs to make it work? Fueling adjustments and plumbing the turbo into the oil and water systems.

Im trying to find out if its possible or atleast achievable on the CBR1000F engine. Its an old engine so will it take it (design wise not wear wise) without stripping the engine as an r1 would b cheaper to do at that stage.

I wouldn’t say money is no object, but I don’t mind spending lots if the reward are as great as the cost. Lets say u had my car and £3000-3500 and wanted more power, what would u do?

ps, no silly CEC cars either.

ZZR 1400 is in that price range is it not?

maybe for the engine but after modding it and sorting the other bits out its more like 4-4500 so allitle over the top (unless a cheap one comes along.

Still i like the idea of fitting such a new engine.

Contact Jambojeef on here.

He has a CBR1000 that he has turbo'd using a turbo off a Rover and loads of other bits.

Not sure how he is getting on at the minute, but it was developing boost last time I saw him.

Cheers

Mike

A ZX12 would give you good bang for your money, that would be a sensible upgrade.

Speak to Holeshot about a turbo on an R1, could be a very expensive route considering the cost of engine plus conversion.

May have to alter the compression and uprate the head bolts ??

why not just fit a nitrous kit - thats what I'm thinking of do to my MNR Blade

A

He's already got Nitrous.

I honestly don't know what to suggest. The difference between 130bhp and 200bhp = £Several thousand.

I'd speak to Holeshot, tell them how much BHP you want and start saving!

This might seem like a daft question but why do you want more power? Are you competing in some form of motorsport and lacking a bit in the power department?

Phil

Just had a peep at your photo archive, probably don't have a lot of scope as it doesn't look a bloater, but with care it's often possible to shave off 20-30kg off even a light car with some thought and cash.

Freelander diff is much lighter than sierra

Carbon/Kevlar seat shells (e.g. Tillett) are lighter than Cobras (bin bag+foam racing seats are even lighter and cheap if you don't care about looks)

Thinner ally floor, a lot of work, but could save a couple of kg for not much money.

the list of possibilities is endless. Saving weight not only improves BHP/tonne, but also handling and braking.

quote:

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Originally posted by Hellfire
This might seem like a daft question but why do you want more power? Are you competing in some form of motorsport and lacking a bit in the power department?

Phil

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if I already had a early cbr1000 motor and wanted an upgrade
I wouldnt go r1(which i had) I can imagine the difference being ok but not breathtaking

Id go bigger zx12r deffinetley

of cours you could try loosing weight !!!!!!!! - a lot cheaper (every stone is 14lbs)

A

its a route I should follow

why is replacing the floor hard? is it not just jacking the car up, drilling the rivets out and refitting??? i dont know as i didnt build the car in the first place. I can buy sheet from work so its cheap to do.

do they make siera alloy hubs?

can i replace the rear alloy panel with a carbon one is isnt it as strong?

R1 isnt much of a power hike, but is cheap and easy to do. im so confused which route to take lol

MNR sell raceleda sierra alloy uprights hubs and brakes... save a rediculous amount of weight over the stock sierra items...

That floor is PROPERLY BONDED and RIVETED! I wouldn't touch that - I think it's pretty thin ally anyway - you've also only got the driver/passenger compartments covered rather than the whole underside. i.e. the prop is exposed along it's length. You'd be wasting time and money on that I reckon.

The problem you have is that you want it all - Extreme pace with comfort and the looks. It's hard and costly to do it all.

The thing about that car is that it's a compromise. It does most things very well imho.

quote:

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Originally posted by Moorron
why is replacing the floor hard? is it not just jacking the car up, drilling the rivets out and refitting??? i dont know as i didnt build the car in the first place. I can buy sheet from work so its cheap to do.

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quote:

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Originally posted by iank

One tip would be to squirt waxoyl into the old rivet holes to prevent the drilled out rivets rattling in the tubes and sending you insane

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It might weigh a bit, but rattly rivets are DAMN annoying! As said, if you wan to go fast in a se7en, you can't have big comfy seats or windows or anything else that isn't absolutely necessary to going forwards quickly. The other option is to buy something non 7 shaped which is capable of loads of power and streamlined for high speeds. Something like the Ultima or similar.

Fit a second cbr1000 engine for a twinny?

David

lol i think i will leave the floor then. Its a very capable car, i wouldnt buy anything else and i feel bad modding someone elses old car when they spend a small fortune on it.

I STILL havent used the nitrous yet, but i use it in my range rover and think little of it.

agreed, u cant have it all unless u want a lamborghini or so, but im going to try my hardest, damn my soul if i dont lol. might go to the show this w/e and have look at some other grp seats. the last lot i sat in were huge so that put me off, but if i do find some DONT TELL HER! lol

If you don't use the nitrous it's just extra weight slowing you down

For really good, extremely light but rather pricey seats you'll find the Cateringvan boys favour these http://www.tillett.co.uk/html/car_seat.html I wouldn't even fit most of them due to my pie retention issues so hopefully they would be better for you.

if you havent used the nitrous it might be worth do so! I appreciate its expensive to leave on, but its easy power!

You want straight line thrills? Go busa - and leave the engine in the bike! I cant imagine many things being that quick.

Do you take it on track? This is a lot more fun than blasting down straight lines, which as you say you will get used to very fast!

You don't need anything that big, it's a barge. Get a GSXR750, ZXR900 or anything similar, it's like arcade game speeds. Nobody needs to go that fast in real life, it's all for bragging rights.

you could go and buy the twin bike engined Tiger that's up for sale on Pistonheads - only £15K

A

Anybody can go fast in a straight line and with the engine you already have in it, your car should beat 99% of all other road cars from the traffic lights.

For the other 1% you've always got the nitrous.

I personally don't think you'll get the performance you're looking for by changing or upgrading the engine. You've got to be able to transfer all that extra power through the traction and with such a lightweight car, this is where you will struggle.

IMO you'd be better off optimising what you already have. Shed some weight, get some sticky tyres. Forget about straight line speed and take it on track for that adrenaline rush you're after.

Phil

Thats a very nice reply there hellfire. Nice to see someone with a larger engine not egging me on to upgrade. Im going to the show this w/e, last year i saw avo selling alloy coilovers which were extremly light compaired to the steel versions. That must shave about 12 kg off the car. Then the seats also (need to weight the ones i got to see the diff), super light 15" wheels (any links???), alloy calipers and maybe a freelander diff (can u get a 3.68 limited slip one?) and maybe replace the s/steel tank with an alloy one (5kg saving).

A good idea???

Any weight you can shed will improve the performance and I'd start with the rotational/unsprung stuff first such as calipers and discs and possibly wheels (depending how heavy they are). Even when you've lost all the weight you're planning to though, I think you'd be hard pushed to notice a huge difference.

I'm surprised you haven't tried the NOS yet though. Go on, give it a shot

Phil

[Edited on 15-9-06 by Hellfire]

Got to agree with Hellfire's ever sensible response. Going fast in a straight line is easy, although the nos will help. Also, remember these types of car are only any good up to 130 odd mph. There's plenty of cars that can go faster than this with ease. It's going fast in the twistys that are hard. I've started to get used to the straight line speed of mine, which is bloody fast, but I'm only just starting to get quick, no where near fast yet, in the corners. That's where all the fun lies. Oh, and going sideways.

Protech do nice ali-bodied dampers for a similar price to everyone elses steel dampers. Bear in mind that half of each damper is technically unsprung weight....

Those are exactly the type of changes I think I would have made if I had kept the car.

Those seats weigh (relatively) a bloody tonne! You'll need to swap diff and tyres at the same time - remembering the CBRs gearing. Not sure if I'd go to a Freelander diff - more likely push-in style Sierra with Quaife ATB. To go to Freelander, you'd need new brackets etc. The push-in unit saves weight over lobro diff anyway. If you do this, can I buy the diff??

As for the wheels (and since you're a money-bags ) - Image Split-rims with black centres would look awesome!

The tank is nice & shiny, but I'd have an ali replacement made.

I'd go for Caterham race-style seats.

I'd possibly think about getting someone to give the motor a once-over or just replace it with a fresher one.

Oh, and for god's-sake, fill the bottle, flick the doomsday cover, play with the micro computer and try the nitrous!!!

By the way, I'm not precious over the car - I think it all makes sense.

Two more points.....
1. Get a quick rack.
2. Change the dash for the new MK one.

Ok, I'll stop now....



P.s. Go for Protech over Avo - I've heard some less than good things.

[Edited on 15/9/06 by TimC]

quote:

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Originally posted by TimC
Oh, and for god's-sake, fill the bottle, flick the doomsday cover, play with the micro computer and try the nitrous!!!

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WHHOOOOOOOSSSSSSHHHHHHH!!!!!
Do it, you know it makes sense!

lol, ok ok ok. i will get the nitrous filled (i looked at trying to plug my range rover bottle in to have a go, but its totally different fittings).

Great minds must think alike, 'another' thing i wanted to do was paint the 17" wheels black in the centre. i need new rear tyres already so i might take the plungs and get some new wheels.

quick rack was another one i wanted, but i need to look into the diff tho, need to read up on them to see what i think as i know nothing about them.

mk new dash?? maybe i will see it at the donny show, but i got some carbon fibre and was going to slighly redisign it with that.

Tank. good job i work for an alloy fabricators



need an ecpert to see whats causing the oil to burn, if its valves then i will fix, if its pistons i will indeed look for a fresher engine (if thats possible).

Thanks for the advice Tim, why didnt u do it all before selling me the car

So it looks like im going to b busy at the show then....(sunday)

Getting rid of the 17" wheels for some 13-14" will aid acceleration if that's what you're after. It will lower the top end though.