Hopefully none of you see this as a dum question but how often do you guys use your clutch

A couple of biker friends say forget the clutch when changing up - only use it when going down the box

I've been practising but it doesn't like it - only into 5th and 6th and at high revs

What experience and advice have you got - clutch or no clutch

A

no clutch changing up, just accelerate, lift slightly and hit the next gear...

tentativity is most peoples problem with a clutchless shift...

If it still doesnt want to do it smothly, then make sure you have a positive gearshift with no slop... 1st to 2nd may be the only problem one if you are doing it right

Cack handed clutchles up shifts can nadger your gear box, often rounding the dogs off so that it falls out of gear.

I personally always use clutch upshifts on my bike, but then its a big twin. On my old 600 it was more easier as it wasn't so lumpy.

What I would do is apply a bit of pressure on the selector then off the power a bit whilst doing the up shift. On a Suzuki gear box this is really sweet & smooth.

You could try one of the bike based electronic ignition interruptors (can't remember the proper name). With those they have a microswitch or the like that cuts the ignition on up shift. The result is you can keep the throttle open (well actually its recomended to do that with the ignition cut).

I use my clutch for slow up-shifts. Big throttle inputs - lift - change is good for clutchless shifts but once at a steady speed I use the clutch.

I also use the clutch for down shifts, pulling away and sitting at lights. If I select neutral when stationary, the gearbox clangs back into 1st.

I found this helpful:

http://www.hewland.com/svga/help.htm

well thanks guys -- I tend to agree with Smart51 as that is what I've experienced so far but I'll have a look at the gearshift and maybe do a bit of adjusting and make sure I've not got any slop

Reading the link from Paul is very interesting and with that knowledge will continue practising

A

That method from hewland is the best way to bend selector forks and wear the drum on a bike gearbox...

You should not apply any pressure to the gear mechanism before you come off the throttle...

If you have trouble, buy a quick-shifter to cut the ignition and that will unload the dogs.. it also allows flat shifting... saving some 10 feet per gearchange!

As said, just lift off as you bash at the lever on the way up. When going slower, ie not flat out, i tend to use the clutch but still change quickly. I always use the clutch on the way down, and try to use neutral when sat in traffic.

I'd use the clutch. Remember that the car that you have the engine and trans in weighs at least twice what the trans was designed to move around. What might be okay on a motorcycle is NOT okay in a car with the same box. Read the recent threads - how many have transmission problems? Treat that transmission with TLC if you don't want to be changing it frequently! Remember, it's doing twice the work it was built for. It's much like doing drag-race (mash the throttle to redline and slide your foot sideways off the clutch) shifts in your tin top on EVERY shift. How long would it last, do you think?? BTW, I've been riding motorcycles professionally for over 20 years...and I use the clutch on every shift. Of course, I maintain my own bike...and I've NEVER had to repair a trans, or replace a clutch!

You only need to use it on up-changes when going slowly. The loads on the transmission are not twice that in the bike, but maybe 1 1/4 times that due to the reduction in gearing. Most transmission problems tend to be down to the life that the motor has had in the bike, i.e. wheelies and poor up-changes from first to second when pointing skyward!

I've had to change gearboxes in bikes after such use (just had to replace gears in my 1972 Yamaha XS650 due to worn dogs) and the bits aren't expensive at the end of the day - £40-£70 per gear and you may need to only change a couple if it ever comes to that.

The best thing you can do is make sure you have some sort of shock damping in your prop-shaft, i.e. a TRT or drive donut etc....

You bought a sequential box for a reason, so go and enjoy it!

i basicaly agree with smart. In my case im only ever on track, so it equates to a few laps using the clutch to warm it all up , then its just hard and fast all the way. I dont preload the lever at all. I jump completely off the throttle for literally a fraction of a second (as in, off full throttle for less than half a second including travel time) and crack it into the next gear. The engine wont feel any more pain than it would in a bike because its the unchanged rotary mass of the engine that the gearbox is moving.

[Edited on 11/10/06 by JoelP]

useful info how many of you select neutral when at traffic lights and similar as i've heard its bad to sit in 1st gear with clutch in - sorry did not mean to nick the thread but thought it a similar related type question???? cheers

depends whats in front and how quick you want to get away!

I normally select neutral rather than dropping in to 1st.

I could sit in 1st, but I have a hydraulic clutch so no cables to stretch. Also gives you a moment or two to move your feet about a bit without doing any damage.

clutch-less up shifts in all but the steadiest of driving modes here, always go for neutral when stood,

quote:

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Originally posted by zetec7
I'd use the clutch. Remember that the car that you have the engine and trans in weighs at least twice what the trans was designed to move around. What might be okay on a motorcycle is NOT okay in a car with the same box. Read the recent threads - how many have transmission problems? Treat that transmission with TLC if you don't want to be changing it frequently! Remember, it's doing twice the work it was built for. It's much like doing drag-race (mash the throttle to redline and slide your foot sideways off the clutch) shifts in your tin top on EVERY shift. How long would it last, do you think?? BTW, I've been riding motorcycles professionally for over 20 years...and I use the clutch on every shift. Of course, I maintain my own bike...and I've NEVER had to repair a trans, or replace a clutch!

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quote:

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Originally posted by JoelP
i basicaly agree with smart. In my case im only ever on track, so it equates to a few laps using the clutch to warm it all up , then its just hard and fast all the way. I dont preload the lever at all. I jump completely off the throttle for literally a fraction of a second (as in, off full throttle for less than half a second including travel time) and crack it into the next gear. The engine wont feel any more pain than it would in a bike because its the unchanged rotary mass of the engine that the gearbox is moving.

[Edited on 11/10/06 by JoelP]

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quote:

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Originally posted by G.Man

There is no need to use a clutch on an upshift, it does nothing that lifting off the throttle doesnt do, ie unload the dogs...

Once the dogs are unloaded it matters not a jot...

And thats in 20 years of racing, 250 karts, motocross, BSB, Sidecars and powerbikes...

And I also have never had to replace a gearbox...

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I agree with what some of the other guys say! A few thousand miles on bikes and I I never use the clutch for fast up-changes. The only exceptions I can think of would be when hammering about in the rain. And stamping up the gears on a wet corner!!!

Coose

I was a Chief Tech for Grafters Suzuki...

GSXR 1000 about 3-4 years ago...

I raced 125 & 250 Long Circuit Karts, and Motoross and was technician in other disciplines..

slight grip on the gear lever ready then of the accel knock into gear then back on accel

traffic lights leave in first gear clutch in never caused me any problems

also I couldnt get neutral anyway very well as my paddle shift was so closely geared

thanks for the many comments, really good - going back to an earlier comment - mine clangs when going into 1st as was described but mine also clangs when going fron 1st to 2nd - anybody else have the same??

A

[Edited on 12/10/06 by alanr]

they all clang mate theres nothing to absorb the impact unless you buy a trt prop which has a rubber sleeve in it


dont DO clutchless upshifts from first to second

dont worry to much just thrash the bleep of it

neat answer --- thanks

A

Always an interesting topic this one as people always have different views.

My two pence worth. Do what you feel is right for you and youre box. By that I mean, if you dont feel confident on shifting without the clutch, try a bit at a time (noting its not easy/advised between 1st and 2nd).

Id definately avoid putting any pressure on the lever prior to shifting and just relying on the weight shift of lifting off to change.

Also, like any dog box, I wouldnt recommend leaving it sitting in gear with the clutch depressed. The vibration through the car is felt in the gears and it can only lead to premature wear. If you cant easily find N then do the best you can, but Ive seen rally car boxes damaged by nothing more than sitting in gear at the lights - I was always given a clip round the lug for doing it!

I had a GSXR 750 which suffered from jumping out of gear which when rebuilt was put down to non mechanical sympathy by a previous owner. I wouldnt risk shifting quickly until youre totally happy with how your motor reacts - its not funny hitting a false neutral and planting the pedal.

[Edited on 12/10/06 by RichieC]

or the other approach having learnt from the world

IS I used to spend hours servicing my own cars.

my mates didnt give two hoots about theres and thrashed them solid

THEY WERE NO less reliable for it

so now it gets a simple oil and filter change and thats it get in and Whale it one Ive never looked back

Ignition cut is the only way 2 go...........used it on bike engined race cars since 1994.
Dont matter how u change.....air/hydrolic/solenoid or manual the cut time is the same......the gain comes from not disturbing the air flow (pedal 2 the metal) and the change can b in the middle of a corner..............slides in so smooth..........

quote:

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Originally posted by G.Man
Coose

I was a Chief Tech for Grafters Suzuki...

GSXR 1000 about 3-4 years ago...

I raced 125 & 250 Long Circuit Karts, and Motoross and was technician in other disciplines..

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