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How much of a production car would you have to change for it to be a kit?
smart51 - 6/8/10 at 11:15 AM

There are several kit cars based on unmodified chassis of production cars. I'm thinking of the MR2 that you can make look like a Ferrari. Now Lotus Elise insurance is very expensive and kit car insurance is very cheap. How little could you change the car before you could re-register is as a Joe Bloggs Special and get £000s knocked off your insurance?

I'm not planning an Elise build but if you got one with mild crash damage or perhaps a blown engine and you want to do a BEC conversion, it might legitimately save you a few bob.

carpmart - 6/8/10 at 11:19 AM

An Elise has got to be too heavy for a BEC conversion!

snapper - 6/8/10 at 11:23 AM

As soon as it has been modified enough to be not registered as an Elise it will need an IVA

smart51 - 6/8/10 at 11:24 AM

quote:
Originally posted by carpmart
An Elise has got to be too heavy for a BEC conversion!


Elise BEC conversion was just an example of a possible project. Series 1 elise weighed 725kg with a K series engine fitted which would reduce to 650kg with an R1 or similar engine. A bit of effort could reduce that further. Remove the screen and replace the doors with GRP blanks for starters. You get the idea.

smart51 - 6/8/10 at 11:26 AM

quote:
Originally posted by snapper
As soon as it has been modified enough to be not registered as an Elise it will need an IVA


No big deal. It adds legitimacy to it not being an Elise any more. The £500 cost of IVA would be a fraction of the saving on the first year's insurance and you'd hope an Elise would pass IVA without any work!

Bluemoon - 6/8/10 at 11:28 AM

I think this comes back to the point system.. VOSA site has something on it, i.e. as above you would need to change enough to qualify for the IVA.. The Elise would become the doner car.. Ring VOSA to find out the true story (i.e. when does a modified car require the IVA)...

smart51 - 6/8/10 at 11:30 AM

Are the rebodied MR2s still registered as MR2s then, even though they look like Ferraris?

Bluemoon - 6/8/10 at 11:32 AM

quote:
Originally posted by smart51
Are the rebodied MR2s still registered as MR2s then, even though they look like Ferraris?


Probably so long as the chassis is intact, again comes back to the point system I think..

Liam - 6/8/10 at 11:33 AM

quote:
Originally posted by smart51
There are several kit cars based on unmodified chassis of production cars. I'm thinking of the MR2 that you can make look like a Ferrari.


But isn't the idea of most of these types of kit precisely that you dont change them enough to require re-registration? And therefore you dont pay cheaper insurance either presumably?

speedyxjs - 6/8/10 at 11:34 AM

quote:
Originally posted by smart51
quote:
Originally posted by snapper
As soon as it has been modified enough to be not registered as an Elise it will need an IVA


No big deal. It adds legitimacy to it not being an Elise any more. The £500 cost of IVA would be a fraction of the saving on the first year's insurance and you'd hope an Elise would pass IVA without any work!


So all you have to do then is cut the chassis and add some strength by welding in some triangulation or something, thus modifying the chassis and requiring an IVA.

speedyxjs - 6/8/10 at 11:35 AM

quote:
Originally posted by Liam
quote:
Originally posted by smart51
There are several kit cars based on unmodified chassis of production cars. I'm thinking of the MR2 that you can make look like a Ferrari.


But isn't the idea of most of these types of kit precisely that you dont change them enough to require re-registration? And therefore you dont pay cheaper insurance either presumably?


Surely that would increase the insurance as the kit would be described as a body kit so would put up the premium?

smart51 - 6/8/10 at 11:43 AM

So a modified chassis would do it. You could take a V10 BMW M5 and do some welding on it then IVA and re-register as a kit car. Suddenly your insurance is cheaper. Let's neglect warranty and resale value for now.

I remember someone telling me they were quoted more to insurance a second hand Elise than the car would cost new. They has a clean licence but were young and had only built up a few years of no claims. A "kit car" with a "rover K series engine" would presumably be fairly cheap on specialist insurance.

SPYDER - 6/8/10 at 11:57 AM

Say then that you rebody your Elise chassis and do enough mods for it to require IVA.
What do you call it on the new V5?
Can you just put "Kit car" or maybe register it as a "Super Special" or some other made up monicker.
Then approach your insurance company.
If its a one-off special they might be reluctant to give cover without a report of some sort.
It won't already be on their books so they can't quantify the risk.
Insurance companies aren't averse to risk, they just need to be able to put a figure on it to calculate a premium.
The low premiums (or is it premia??) offered on kit cars might only apply to known types of kit for which they have previous data.
It's an interesting concept though.
Written off Elise or similar, rebodied, possibly using available bodywork, Midas say.....
Or a shortened Impreza floorpan.....?

Geoff.

MakeEverything - 6/8/10 at 02:04 PM

www.retroforza.com

You could do this and re-register it?

Liam - 6/8/10 at 03:00 PM

quote:
Originally posted by speedyxjs
quote:
Originally posted by Liam
quote:
Originally posted by smart51
There are several kit cars based on unmodified chassis of production cars. I'm thinking of the MR2 that you can make look like a Ferrari.


But isn't the idea of most of these types of kit precisely that you dont change them enough to require re-registration? And therefore you dont pay cheaper insurance either presumably?


Surely that would increase the insurance as the kit would be described as a body kit so would put up the premium?


I would have thought so too. But the sort of person who drives one of those pretend 360 MR2s (with 10x as many ferrari badges on it as a real one), whilst wearing a full outfit of ferrari clothes, probably enjoys paying a high insurance premium as it makes the whole experience more authentic and he can subtly drop it into conversations.

locogeoff - 6/8/10 at 08:10 PM

quote:
Originally posted by speedyxjs
quote:
Originally posted by Liam
quote:
Originally posted by smart51
There are several kit cars based on unmodified chassis of production cars. I'm thinking of the MR2 that you can make look like a Ferrari.


But isn't the idea of most of these types of kit precisely that you dont change them enough to require re-registration? And therefore you dont pay cheaper insurance either presumably?


Surely that would increase the insurance as the kit would be described as a body kit so would put up the premium?


No, because the demographic of the owners of that particular body kit shows lower risk.