Board logo

Lotus elite based kit car
Plunky - 28/4/13 at 07:07 PM

Hi,

I am currently in the market for a bike engined kit car.

A friend of mine recently bought a BEC but now needs to sell up.

I am trying to work out what the car actually is, as things like bushes and the suspension need sorting out.

The registration is from a 1979 lotus elite. Will this mean that the running gear has been used from an elite? The car now has an r1 engine in it, everything works but it does need some tlc and it has lotus 7 badges all over it.

Does anyone have any ideas on how to identify what kit car this is based on? Another friend has an mk Indy and this seems a bit taller than the mk.

Any help would be appreciated.

Cheers,

Plunky

mookaloid - 28/4/13 at 07:25 PM

Welcome to the forum

the car sounds interesting - you will probably need to post some pictures up if they are available.

Suspension and chassis pics would help

jacko - 28/4/13 at 07:42 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Plunky
Hi,



The registration is from a 1979 lotus elite. Will this mean that the running gear has been used from an elite? The car now has an r1 engine in it, everything works but it does need some tlc and it has lotus 7 badges all over it.

Does anyone have any ideas on how to identify what kit car this is based on? Another friend has an mk Indy and this seems a bit taller than the mk.

Any help would be appreciated.

Cheers,

Plunky



I think we need photos it must be tall as the mk indy is made 25mm taller then a locost to take a ford pinto engine
is it on the road if so what dose it say on the log book dose it not give a make ?

Plunky - 28/4/13 at 07:50 PM

It says it is a lotus elite on the log book, I have no idea what kit car based chassis it is? It could be a lotus 7 due to the 7 on the grill and the badges.
I'll try and post some pictures.

zilspeed - 28/4/13 at 07:58 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Plunky
It says it is a lotus elite on the log book, I have no idea what kit car based chassis it is? It could be a lotus 7 due to the 7 on the grill and the badges.
I'll try and post some pictures.


1) Welcome to the forum.

2) Expect many difficult and awkward question concerning the V5. Not commenting myself, just advising that it will happpen.

CRAIGR - 28/4/13 at 08:01 PM

Can i smell popcorn again ??

Plunky - 28/4/13 at 08:06 PM

Popcorn?

Can somebody enlighten me as to why I will get awkward questions regarding the v5?

CRAIGR - 28/4/13 at 08:14 PM

Its possible that someone has acquired the v5 from another car (lotus elite) and used it on said lotus seven replica which would be illegal.

zilspeed - 28/4/13 at 08:14 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Plunky
Popcorn?

Can somebody enlighten me as to why I will get awkward questions regarding the v5?


As you asked.

Your V5 says Lotus Elite.
Your car has a bike engine.
Your car has 7 badges all over it, suggesting it looks like a Lotus Seven or similar, not an Elite.

In the very dim and distant past, there were instances of incorrectly registered kit cars where the V5 still had the name of the donor car but the DVLA had been aware of the kit car being built. This was generally all sorted out some years ago and this practice only really went on in the 70s and early to mid 80s.

For a very long time now, it's been the norm that a kit car will have the make and model of that car on the V5, not the make and model of a donor vehicle.

Not having the original engine makes the link with the donor vehicle rather more tenuous.

As I said above, not my business and I will not comment on the specifics of your case as I don't know the background. In general though, everything above is pretty much on the money. The grace period for correcting incorrect V5s which still said the donor car's make and model passed many many years ago.

Plunky - 28/4/13 at 08:17 PM

Is it possible to get the v5 adjusted so that all the info is correct to the car?

zilspeed - 28/4/13 at 08:27 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Plunky
Is it possible to get the v5 adjusted so that all the info is correct to the car?


It certainly used to be.

For it to happen, the DVLA would already have to have known that the V5 now pertains to a vehicle which they have knowledge of being built and they would need to be able to confirm that they know it's no longer a Lotus Elite but hadn't updated the V5. This used to be fairly common, a loooooong time ago.

IF this can be verified, an updated V5 can, or used to be able to, be updated to show the correct vehicle.

This involves an inspection by your local dvla office.

If they have no prior knowledge of all of the above and it comes as news to them that the V5 is being used on something other than a Lotus Elite, they'll take the V5 away.


Hope this isn't terrible news.
I can confirm that it is accurate though.

Plunky - 28/4/13 at 08:34 PM

Ok thanks for the info

zilspeed - 28/4/13 at 08:35 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Plunky
Ok thanks for the info


Hope it works out ok for you.

mookaloid - 28/4/13 at 09:15 PM

bearing in mind that as long as the chassis isn't altered it wouldn't necessarily be an issue - the Elite did after all have a separate chassis.

So if it is just a rebody with a bit of supporting structure added on for the seven bodywork it could be fine.

Hence photos of the chassis might give us a clue?

zilspeed - 28/4/13 at 09:24 PM

quote:
Originally posted by mookaloid
bearing in mind that as long as the chassis isn't altered it wouldn't necessarily be an issue - the Elite did after all have a separate chassis.

So if it is just a rebody with a bit of supporting structure added on for the seven bodywork it could be fine.

Hence photos of the chassis might give us a clue?


True

The top gear Eagle Hammerhead Thrust thing was actually an unmodified TVR chassis. You never know.

The TG thing was pushing the limit of the law right enough.

SCAR - 29/4/13 at 06:56 AM

quote:
Originally posted by Plunky
Is it possible to get the v5 adjusted so that all the info is correct to the car?

As I understand it
If it has the Elite chassis the V5 is correct already (its a re bodied and re engined Elite)
If it has a different chassis (plus re body and re engine) the V5 does not belong to this car

Sam_68 - 29/4/13 at 11:52 AM

quote:
Originally posted by mookaloid
bearing in mind that as long as the chassis isn't altered it wouldn't necessarily be an issue - the Elite did after all have a separate chassis.

So if it is just a rebody with a bit of supporting structure added on for the seven bodywork it could be fine.

Hence photos of the chassis might give us a clue?


I think it very unlikely indeed that the Elite chassis has been used for a BEC 'Seven'.

Apart from the extra structure that would be required to support the bodywork, the Elise chassis is actually quite large (it's a 4-seater coupe with a wheelbase 10" longer than a Caterham) and the engine bay fork probably wouldn't accommodate a bike engine very well, anyway - the engine would need to be sited well forward, between the suspension turrets, to get enough width.

I'm betting that the only bit of Lotus Elite in the whole car is the chassis plate...

As others have said, we need photos - if it is an Elite chassis, it'll be very obvious from photos of the engine bay.

Not Anumber - 29/4/13 at 12:58 PM

And now for a more optimistic tone.

The history of Lotus is peppered with cars that were built for one purpose and then modified. It is entirely feasible they would have taken a car off the line and modified it extensively on the fly for a racer or other customer's requirements whilst still applying the registration that had been originally earmarked for it.

Why not give Lotus a call. I have a mate who works there if you IM me with the details.

Plunky - 29/4/13 at 01:46 PM

I'm quite confident that the elite chassis has not been used. I'm just trying to get my head around the laws involved in registering kit cars.
From what I can gather the car in question should have lotus 7 or similar on the v5, not lotus elite. Thus causing me an issue, would it have to go through any test to get this corrected, bare in mind it is 1979 donor vehicle?

britishtrident - 29/4/13 at 02:09 PM

There have been Seven style cars built on the 1960's Elan chassis (or at least the Spyder Elan replacement chassis) but the Elite chassis is 14" longer

Sam_68 - 29/4/13 at 04:21 PM

quote:
Originally posted by PlunkyFrom what I can gather the car in question should have lotus 7 or similar on the v5, not lotus elite. Thus causing me an issue, would it have to go through any test to get this corrected, bare in mind it is 1979 donor vehicle?

My understanding is that the 'amnesty period' for incorrectly registered kit cars is now long gone and any such cars that come to light now will need to go through an IVA test... the 1979 'identity' will be deemed to be fraudulent and worthless. It will be treated as though it is a freshly built kit car.

Your best bet is to check with the DVLA, however.

Dopdog - 29/4/13 at 04:37 PM

do you and your friend not have a camera? for all we know it could be a mini? pictures tell a thousand words?

Plunky - 30/4/13 at 03:39 PM

Think I am going to steer clear, would rather buy a BEC that was built like it originally and avoid any future complications with authorities.... thanks for all you help though guys.

If anyone knows of any bike engined kit cars.... do let me know!