mandbsheldon
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| posted on 4/9/06 at 03:59 PM |
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Child seats
Whats the general opinion on the new laws regarding children in cars. The law now says, any child under the height of 135cm, must be in a
child/booster seat. How do you fit a booster seat, in a locost fiberglass shell? Or is a harness enough?
Leigh
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mookaloid
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| posted on 4/9/06 at 04:12 PM |
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No Idea about how you fit a booster seat, but the law seems clear......
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jollygreengiant
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| posted on 4/9/06 at 04:15 PM |
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As I understand the interpretation of the new law it applies mainly to inertia type seat belts because the governing factor is in the position of the
belt across the torso for police identification of ofenders. The belt should fit so that it it runs across the shoulder to the buckle or put it
another way it must NOT run near the neck area. hence the need for appropriate and correct fitting child seats and or booster seats.
I hope this makes sense.
Ergo with a locost with a proper 4, 5 or 6 point harness, the shoulder straps will( or should allways run almost vertically down the torso and
therefore should not be affected by the new law.
Beware of the Goldfish in the tulip mines. The ONLY defence against them is smoking peanut butter sandwiches.
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Jon Ison
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| posted on 4/9/06 at 04:24 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by jollygreengiant
As I understand the interpretation of the new law it applies mainly to inertia type seat belts because the governing factor is in the position of the
belt across the torso for police identification of ofenders. The belt should fit so that it it runs across the shoulder to the buckle or put it
another way it must NOT run near the neck area. hence the need for appropriate and correct fitting child seats and or booster seats.
I hope this makes sense.
Ergo with a locost with a proper 4, 5 or 6 point harness, the shoulder straps will( or should allways run almost vertically down the torso and
therefore should not be affected by the new law.
Just as demonstrated in the avatar above.............
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iank
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| posted on 4/9/06 at 04:27 PM |
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It might be possible to make an "expanding foam and bin-bag seat" in the fibreglass shell depression. That way the kid gets a perfectly
fitting 'racing' seat which also fits the car perfectly.
Only slight crimp is the expanding foam gets quite warm (though not enough to be painful) so you'd need to be sure it wouldn't damage the
fibreglass.
This site goes into the details:
http://www.sjmmarsh.f2s.com/Caterham/Foam%20Seat.html
You wouldn't need the seat base
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mandbsheldon
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| posted on 4/9/06 at 04:30 PM |
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Thats a good idear
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Guinness
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| posted on 4/9/06 at 04:30 PM |
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I have a set of Triton's fibreglass seats, which come with a seperate shell which you can pad / cover etc.
For "normal" use I have a set which have about 1" of foam padding on them wrapped in vinyl. When my five year old is getting a
lift, I have a special seat base for him. (Triton had a spare blue shell which he let me have for a reasonable discount!). Ben's seat is the
fibreglass shell, with about 4" of polystyrene stuck to it, then about 1" of foam padding, covered in vinyl. Very locost, but it gets him
into about the right position. Seat belts tight across the lap and shoulder harnesses OK at the top / front. Works for me!
HTH
Mike
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iank
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| posted on 4/9/06 at 04:33 PM |
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Trying to apply common sense can be futile when a law is clearly worded but inappropriate for some reason.
In this case since the idea is to make sure the seatbelt fits should it not be based on torso length not height, and why is there an arbitary age
cut-off?
(I believe I know the answers to both of those questions, but they're certainly not based on safety).
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jollygreengiant
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| posted on 4/9/06 at 04:46 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by iank
Trying to apply common sense can be futile when a law is clearly worded but inappropriate for some reason.
In this case since the idea is to make sure the seatbelt fits should it not be based on torso length not height, and why is there an arbitary age
cut-off?
(I believe I know the answers to both of those questions, but they're certainly not based on safety).
IIRC
If you read the new law correctly, I believe that you will find the the age cut off is also related to height.
[Edited on 4/9/06 by jollygreengiant]
Beware of the Goldfish in the tulip mines. The ONLY defence against them is smoking peanut butter sandwiches.
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iank
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| posted on 4/9/06 at 05:16 PM |
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My point is a 40 year old who's shorter than 135cm (there are a few) don't have to use a booster. If the law is about safety they
obviously should. The only reason for the age cut-off is political, they don't want the Sun headlines 'My 80 year old granny's been
forced to use a kiddie seat'
height should also be irrelevent as it's the seatbelts position across the torso that matters, legs are irrelevent to that. But it's much
harder to measure correctly and far more difficult for plod to argue at the roadside.
Reading from the BBC (not got the legislation to hand  )
Its age 12 or 135cm
So shortarse 40 year olds and tall 10 year olds don't need the booster.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/parenting/q_and_a/boosterseat8.shtml
So I think I'm reading it correctly.#
My 5.5 year old is 123cm already - guessing he'll be out of his soon enough at the current rate 
[Edited on 4/9/06 by iank]
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JoelP
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| posted on 4/9/06 at 06:40 PM |
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well i followed someone through town just now who had two young kids (3 or 4 years old?) stood up on the back seat, holding onto the front headrests!
And he was diving between lanes like a boyracer.... what a muppet.
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Chippy
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| posted on 4/9/06 at 10:49 PM |
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Silly thing is the new law doesn't apply to children, of any age or height, traveling in a taxi, as has been said before, (and often), the law
is a complete arse. Well no that's not really correct, the law makers are.  Regards Ray
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jollygreengiant
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 02:35 AM |
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Yep I agree the law is an arrse. I totally agree with the height /age thing, one of my regular fares is 30ish year old lad who is severely vertically
challenged at a height of about 2' 4". do any of our seat belts fit him properly. Not really. Under the new laws, although he definately
falls outside the age brackets, I believe that it could make things interesting for him if he comes across a Jobsworth copper whilst he is driving his
own car or a passenger in someones private car.
As for the Taxi's exempt bit, well yes they are but only in as far as therer is no seat/booster available. The reasoning is that this law is
totally unworkable for a Taxi because you MUST have a suitable seat/booster for each passenger. Ergo 8 seater mini bus, picks up a childrens party,
two adults and six children. Now to cater for all posibilities That bus must carry suitable seats AND boosters for each seat and age/weight/height of
child. Can you in all reallity imaging how much room would be needed inside a vehicle to carry all those seats and boosters. This argument works the
same for the 4 seater cars as well. Basically you would not be able to get into a taxi because the passenger compartment would need to be filled with
seats and booster cusions.
The best way to stop people getting hurt is to educate drivers to STOP having accidents. It is not speed alone it is drivers ability and drivers
attention as well. That is why the police call it Driving without due care and attention.
Beware of the Goldfish in the tulip mines. The ONLY defence against them is smoking peanut butter sandwiches.
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JamJah
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 02:49 AM |
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Speaking to a police man the other day, there hasbeen no offical guidlines from thehome office on how to police them. This means that they arent
lickely too unless your under 21 male and they cant get youon anything else!!
I also pointed out how would the police prove age and the answer was "it would only really be enforcable monday to friday, on the school run as
there is no legal way to confirm age/identity of a minor at the roadside."
discuss.
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TangoMan
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 07:34 AM |
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Has anyone found a suitable childseat for a seven with harnesses. I would love to take my little girl (2) out in the seven but haven't found a
seat to go with the harnesses.
Summer's here!!!!
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JamJah
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 10:06 AM |
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Could one of the GRP see money making idea here? Produce a range of seats that have the same quick release fixing but for different sizes, giving each
a good view. Dontworry, I havent patented it, but will have a smug grin if someone does!
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Peteff
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 10:37 AM |
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The problem is the position of the inertia belts in ordinary cars. Booster cushions and seats are only placed on the normal seat and all the holding
is done by the weight of the child unlike child seats which are held in by the belt and secure the child. Just put a pad under them to satisfy the
letter of the law as you can adjust the belt to fit properly, there are too many get out clauses in the new law for them to prosecute a lot of cases
as stated on the thinksafety site. . 3 years and over the
rule seems to be :-
Correct child restraint must be used if available. If not an adult seat belt must be worn if available.
yours, Pete
I went into the RSPCA office the other day. It was so small you could hardly swing a cat in there.
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DarrenW
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| posted on 8/9/06 at 02:25 PM |
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Is it just me or do the new guidlines only relate to cars with 3 point inertia belts? I havent seen a Q&A section anywhere where i can post a
question on this.
My ZR has fibreglass seats. I normally put an old pillow in for my 4 year old to sit on but this is only for comfort. The harnesses seem to fit quite
well albeit the shoulder straps come down on the seat before they secure her in. Iam a tad concerned about this but seeing as she is a lot lighter
than an adult in crash the kinetic energy will be lower.
Mike Guinness' idea of an extended seat pad sounds a good idea - i have a spare fibreglass seat base waiting to be covered.
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Guinness
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| posted on 8/9/06 at 03:15 PM |
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Darren
You can have a look at mine next time we meet up!
Cheers
Mike
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JamJah
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| posted on 9/9/06 at 05:44 AM |
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Isnt there only one childseat manufacturer in the uk? Isnt that in Andover where they are struggling to keep major employers after the furniture
companies all went bust.... hmmm
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