scutter
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| posted on 14/3/04 at 07:28 PM |
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Giving kitcars a bad name
After an enjoyable day at Stafford, I'd thought I'd show you a little picture,
Image deleted by owner
P.S. you're looking at what should be holding on the upper wishbone bracket.
Makes you wonder why some people think that kit cars and still bodged together, imagine finding this standard of work on a manufactures display
stand.
(Can't say the name as there's enough lawsuits in the air at the mo anyway)
All the best Dan.
[Edited on 14/3/04 by scutter]
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theconrodkid
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| posted on 14/3/04 at 07:31 PM |
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hm nice job
who cares who wins
pass the pork pies
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flak monkey
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| posted on 14/3/04 at 07:34 PM |
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Can i ask whose stand? Or is it being kept quiet? 
David
Sera
http://www.motosera.com
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scutter
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| posted on 14/3/04 at 07:49 PM |
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RS jigtec,
but there at the end of a long line of people who can't amke an MK chassis as good as the orginal.
Dan.
Ducking for cover.
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alister667
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| posted on 14/3/04 at 07:51 PM |
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I hope they at least glued the wheels on right!
Anyone prepared to ID the manufacturer, for those of us who couldn't make it?
http://members.lycos.co.uk/alister667/
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stephen_gusterson
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| posted on 14/3/04 at 07:51 PM |
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the little dibby bit of weld just past the left side was a nice touch. obviously structutal
I once read that Colin Chapman was a genius cos amongst other things, he managed to hold about 5 suspension parts together with a single bolt, thus
saving weight.
The original seven also only had two trailing arms to the rear axle - not four - and the axle regualrly broke.
I recon if this site had been around then, hed been slagged for poor design.
atb
steve
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Ben_Copeland
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| posted on 14/3/04 at 07:55 PM |
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oh shit, thats awful !
Ben
Locost Map on Google Maps
Z20LET Astra Turbo, into a Haynes
Roadster
Enter Your Details Here
http://www.facebook.com/EquinoxProducts for all your bodywork needs!
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Staple balls
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| posted on 14/3/04 at 07:58 PM |
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looks like
someone's going for SPD's crown.
speaking of which, didn't RS jigtec adopt one of SPD's designs?
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scutter
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| posted on 14/3/04 at 08:46 PM |
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chrisg
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| posted on 14/3/04 at 09:20 PM |
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I went and had a look (after you suggested I should) and the rest of the (visible)chassis was just as bad!
Maybe we could do with a bigger picture tho Scutter.............
Cheers
Chris
Note to all: I really don't know when to leave well alone. I tried to get clever with the mods, then when they gave me a lifeline to see the
error of my ways, I tried to incite more trouble via u2u. So now I'm banned, never to return again. They should have done it years ago!
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madforfishing
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| posted on 14/3/04 at 09:37 PM |
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1. To be fair there is a huge bit of plate attached to the RHS of the bracket.
2. But then again, this is probably to counteract their cockup of ending up with the wishbones brackets in THAT position.
3. AND ANOTHER THING...if the rest of their welding is that bad then the plate at para.1 isnt going to do much.
I went to stafford but didn't notice their stand - my eyes were too far out on storks looking at all the shiny things for sale.
Guy at Lolocost was particularly nice and knocked off loads of cash on a load of bits.
How did everybody enjoy the show...my first time so I can't compare to previous ones.
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M@Triton
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| posted on 14/3/04 at 10:01 PM |
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Chubby Brown has a saying for things like this i think!!!!!!
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SeaBass
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| posted on 14/3/04 at 10:04 PM |
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You just can't believe that people would put something like this on display at a show, the supposed pinnacle of what they can produce. Surely
this would be an SVA fail under design and construction. Sad truth is I'm not really surprised any more... Just feel sorry for the poor mugs who
get roped into buying these things from dodgy manufacturers who must be in it just for the money.
Cheers
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Peteff
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| posted on 14/3/04 at 11:36 PM |
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I'll bet they used to be used car salesmen or even worse, estate agents.
yours, Pete
I went into the RSPCA office the other day. It was so small you could hardly swing a cat in there.
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Mark Allanson
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| posted on 15/3/04 at 12:16 AM |
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This has to be a pre production mock up or...
They want something large and sharp shoving up their warm and moist part of their body
If you can keep you head, whilst all others around you are losing theirs, you are not fully aware of the situation
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Alan B
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| posted on 15/3/04 at 12:37 AM |
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For me the big question is ..why?
It looks like the wishbone design has driven the the bracket placement...rather than the other way round...
I see no reason that the bracket could not have been on the tube fully and the wishbone designed accordingly...
Looks like they had existing wishbones and lashed up the chassis to suit..IMO
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gerr80
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| posted on 15/3/04 at 01:43 AM |
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Welding
So that's what they mean by triangulation!!
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James
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| posted on 15/3/04 at 02:04 AM |
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The full horror is not fully shown by this picture. As has been discussed here before The Book design (strictly speaking) has the brackets an inch too
far back- such that a lot of people gusset them. On this car though, all four brackets each side were an additional inch back than The Book so that
none of them were mounted properly.
You can see this by the positioning of the lower rear bracket which is so far from the FU1/2 rail. It should be such that the end of the bolt nearly
hits FU1/2.
In addition, the back of the bracket should be welded so it's 'flat' against the rail- instead, the back of this bracket was
vertical! ie. literally only the corner of the bracket was on the rail!
As Madforfishing says- yes, there is a gusset but it really wasn't much good- it was welded only on the outside such that the bracket could have
just been 'peeled' away from the chassis rail if the 'tack' weld failed.
I felt it was so unsafe I spoke to the guy there that was selling them and said I was concerned. He justified it to me (and memory forces me to
paraphrase somewhat):
"... well, it's been built how our designer designed it..."
So that's all right then!!! 
I then asked about the steering rack (which you can see from the bend in the bush is not in the right place) and was told it was not setup yet. It
looked pretty setup to me- the mounts were fully welded in place!
In their defence: he told me that he'd only started building it 6 days ago. The implication being it would be sorted out. Read into this what
you like. Although when I said the whole setup should be brought forward 2" he didn't know what I was on about so maybe that bit
won't be fixed.
Scutter did you also take a picture of the top wishbone? The design and weld of the threaded bar for the Transit BJ was *interesting* to say the
least.
quote:
Originally posted by Alan B
It looks like the wishbone design has driven the the bracket placement...rather than the other way round...
I see no reason that the bracket could not have been on the tube fully and the wishbone designed accordingly...
Looks like they had existing wishbones and lashed up the chassis to suit..IMO
I don't think as much thought as that has actually gone into it- bear in mind these guys have bought SPD's designs (Of Woodster's
propshaft fame). SPD in turn had just basically ripped off MK's designs.
They have just literally put the brackets in the wrong place.
The bottom w/bone was a straight copy of MK, the top wishbone was in essence a badly made (and slightly modified to be of worse design) copy of
MK's.
All the best,
James
P.S. If the owner, designer, whoever, is reading this then please, please sort these things out. I am fearful that someone could be seriously hurt if
the bracket fails and the w/bone becomes detached. 
It would be very little work for you to correct the problems- grind the brackets off (if they don't 'pull' off ) and just bring
them (and the steering rack) further forward. I'm sure you have a bracket jig so I'd have thought it'd take just a couple of hours
in total to do including repainting!
Don't risk someone's life...!
EDITED so as not to hurt Ned's feelings!
[Edited on 15/3/04 by James]
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ned
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| posted on 15/3/04 at 10:41 AM |
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James,
I do believe it was i that pointed this dodgy bracket out to you in the first place before scutter took the pic!
it is of course the ex-spd snake, now built by rs jigtec as mentioned above. i talked to the guy, but as the pic shows, wasn't impressed with
the car..
allegedly!
Ned.
beware, I've got yellow skin
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James
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| posted on 15/3/04 at 11:02 AM |
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Sorry if that read as stealing your observational skills Ned!
Cheers for lift yesterday,
James
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David Jenkins
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| posted on 15/3/04 at 11:34 AM |
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I don't claim to be a welding expert, by any means - but if I had produced that weld I would not show it to my friends, let alone display it at
a show!
The placement looks like a clear case of doing something to make it fit, without any thought or knowledge of engineering principles. Scary!
I wonder what a switched-on SVA inspector would say about it... there is a 'catch-all' provision in the SVA regarding chassis design and
weld quality.
rgds,
David
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ned
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| posted on 15/3/04 at 11:45 AM |
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i am not an sva inspector, but if i was i would be worried for the occupants life if i was to pass it. it would be a fail imho.
Ned.
beware, I've got yellow skin
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JoelP
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| posted on 15/3/04 at 01:24 PM |
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my brackets are like a bit like that, but they hang off the front of the upright rather than the rear. I decided not to use a short diagonal to hold
it because braking force would lead to a twist in the upright, instead i welded an inch square tube from on bracket to the opposite one, hence helping
to hold them together and also welded that bar to both uprights. That worked for me, but i cant see how a 'professional' company can
explain not just moving the upright bar.
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zetec
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| posted on 15/3/04 at 06:02 PM |
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Was that the stand where they had on display the results from crash testing a Cobra into the back of a "7"!
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stephen_gusterson
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| posted on 15/3/04 at 11:34 PM |
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Giving kitcars a bad name
Horace
that would be pretty crap
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