craig1410
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| posted on 22/12/03 at 12:28 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by blueshift
I don't think the amount of crap building up has any effect on the process.
Blueshift,
It certainly does in my case. I have a power supply with voltage and current meters and the current starts off at 4 Amps and dies away to around 2
Amps after about 20 minutes and drops further to around 1 Amp overnight. If I take out the anode and scrub it with some emery cloth and rinse it under
the tap I can get 4 Amps of current flowing again. I think the crap which forms on the anode is reducing the surface conductivity and thus reducing
the current. It also produces swathes of gunge at the anode which contaminates the solution badly.
Cheers,
Craig.
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blueshift
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| posted on 22/12/03 at 01:41 PM |
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This makes sense I shuppose, a rust cake coating being less conductive than the bare metal. Does that mean you're using a mild steel electrode
or does cack form on stainless too?
I thought you were talking about the poop that ends up suspended in the solution, before.. that's why I said I didn't think it'd
have any effect.. my bad
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JoelP
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| posted on 22/12/03 at 01:47 PM |
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how about using wire wool as the +ve electrode? should have enough surface area to resist some goop buildup!
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locoboy
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| posted on 22/12/03 at 02:00 PM |
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with the strands being so thin it may just all desintegrate!
I thought about a stainless steel seive, but thought it may be too thin and get eaten away,
and be a bitch to clean.
ATB
Locoboy
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JoelP
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| posted on 22/12/03 at 07:23 PM |
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maybe possible to clean the electrode easily by reversing the current with some scrap as the target?!
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locoboy
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| posted on 22/12/03 at 07:35 PM |
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Gutted.........
Needed a battery charger for some time so thought now is the time and i can try this de rusting process too.
Inot Halfrauds and out with a nice looking all singing all dancing charger.
 
Halford Auto Charger
Got the washing soda and a nice stainless serving spoon (90p) and a plastic washing up bowl.
hooked it all up and nowt seemed to be happening.
Theni discover this "fully Automatic" charger is to fecking clever for its own good.
It only supplies power to the leads once it is connected to the battery, i guess it will detect some resistance of someting and allow power to
flow.
I tried it with the power on and touched the 2 clips together and nowt!
Question,
Can i hook the charger to a battery then at the same time run 2 leads from the battery to the rusty piece and the stainless anode?
Word of warning, even battery chargers are getting smart these days!
ATB
Locoboy
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craig1410
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| posted on 22/12/03 at 08:19 PM |
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Col,
Only thing to watch for is short circuits as the battery will supply a huge current if you short out the anode and cathode. A battery charger will
only supply maybe 4 Amps before its internal protection will start to shut it down. The other downside of a battery is that it is always live so you
won't be able to turn off the power so easily when rearranging the piece being derusted. Obviously you could just use jump leads but you
don't really want sparks when connecting and disconnecting as this could potentially explode the hydrogen.
Why not try to get hold of one of those old CB (Citizens band radio) power supplies. They supply 13.8 Volts at a few amps and would be safer than a
car battery in my opinion. Maplin are selling a 5Amp version for £29.99 inc vat (product code XM22Y)
HTH,
Craig.
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blueshift
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| posted on 23/12/03 at 02:12 AM |
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I've got a nice old 7A CB power supply. you can pick them up dirt cheap secondhand, or at least you used to be able to. they might be thin on
the ground these days.
The idea of cheating the automatic charger with the battery should work I think, you might want to put a fuse in the circuit though, else as craig
says much melting.
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locoboy
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| posted on 23/12/03 at 09:08 AM |
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Cheers chaps,
Think i will return it today and just try to get an old style battery charger, or failing that i have a transformer that i used to use to power my
radio controlled car battery rapid charger, i guess that would do?
ATB
Locoboy
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Spyderman
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| posted on 23/12/03 at 12:57 PM |
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If you have an old PC case you can use the power supply from that.
They are commonly used for small scale plating and should provide enough current for what you want!
Spyderman
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DaveFJ
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| posted on 23/12/03 at 01:23 PM |
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AHAA - finally a use for those 30 odd AT style PC power supplies I kept in the garage 'just in case'
Dave
"In Support of Help the Heroes" - Always
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timf
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| posted on 23/12/03 at 01:44 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by protofj
AHAA - finally a use for those 30 odd AT style PC power supplies I kept in the garage 'just in case'
dave 1 or 2 ok but 30
definately a case of hoarding on your part
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MikeR
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| posted on 23/12/03 at 06:57 PM |
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So nows not a good time to admit i had to shift 10 cases when i moved house ..... I had a clear out some time later and have still got a few cases and
power supplies hanging around!!
Now which would be better, AT or ATX 1.0 or ATX 2.1 power supplies?
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blueshift
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| posted on 24/12/03 at 11:11 AM |
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One of the nice old ones that doesn't have magic in them that only turns on the power rails when it has devices / motherboard attached.
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craig1410
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| posted on 24/12/03 at 11:52 AM |
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Blueshift,
That's easily defeated anyway by placing a load resistor across the +5V to ground pins. You'll need a load of an Amp or so which would
require a 4.7ohm resistor. Don't just use a little 0.25 watt resistor though as you will need to dissipate a fair amount of power. Something
like 5 watts in fact (V^2/R)
Cheers,
Craig.
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Mark Allanson
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| posted on 29/12/03 at 05:51 PM |
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Easier source of washing soda - Safeways, 79p
 
Rescued attachment Soda.jpg
If you can keep you head, whilst all others around you are losing theirs, you are not fully aware of the situation
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CairB
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| posted on 30/12/03 at 09:31 AM |
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Mark,
You were robbed  Tesco 51p
Anyone any cheaper?
 
Rescued attachment 200312300907_00038.jpg
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blueshift
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| posted on 30/12/03 at 12:04 PM |
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Raiding my dad's garage cupboards, 0p.
I win, unless anyone got paid to take some away?
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DaveFJ
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| posted on 30/12/03 at 12:37 PM |
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Have to try ALDI or LIDL tonite - they just have to be cheaper.....
BTW defeating an ATX power supply is far easuier than all that - i just use a paperclip across two of the pins when testing them (can't remeber
which but I have it written down somewhere...)
Dave
Dave
"In Support of Help the Heroes" - Always
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dave1888
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| posted on 13/1/04 at 06:36 PM |
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can anyone tell me the mix water to sodium/wash soda.
thanks
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blueshift
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| posted on 13/1/04 at 08:16 PM |
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It's in the FAQ liam posted as the first post on this thread.
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dave1888
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| posted on 13/1/04 at 09:31 PM |
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Cheers got it now
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ijohnston99
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| posted on 14/1/04 at 09:20 PM |
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Excellent thanks for that Liam. It got me digging around and I found a slightly simpler to understand version..
More electrolysis
Ian
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craig1410
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| posted on 14/1/04 at 10:35 PM |
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DO NOT USE STAINLESS STEEL ANODES!
Bloody 'ell!
Have you guys read the bit about using stainless steel for the anode?? Here is the text:
"Many people using the electrolysis method for rust reduction swear by stainless steel, stating (incorrectly) that it's not consumed,
stays clean and seems safe.
Stainless steel is indeed consumed when used in the electrolysis process, although slowly. The main problem with using it is the hazardous waste it
produces. Stainless steel contains chromium. The electrodes, and thus the chromium is consumed, and you end up with poisonous chromates in your
electrolyte. Dumping these on the ground or down the drain is illegal. The compounds can cause severe skin problems and ultimately, cancer. Hexavalent
chromate is poisonous. These compounds are not excused from hazardous waste regulations where household wastes are.
These compounds are bad enough that government regulations mandate "elimination of hexavalent chromate by 2007 for corrosion
protection."
Does your electrolyte turn yellow? That's a sign of chromates.
If you have been using stainless steel for the anodes (positive electrodes), wear rubber gloves when working with or near the liquids. If you need to
dispose of it, allow it to evaporate into powders and dispose of the powders in sealed containers during your local "hazardous waste clean-up
days".
Best bet - don't use stainless steel no matter how tempting it is."
Scary stuff!!
If anyone has seen the film "Erin Brochovich" with Julia Roberts then you will know how dangerous hexavalent chromium is. The worrying
thing is that I didn't know about this earlier and have handled and disposed of this stuff down the drain as it was supposedly non-toxic and
harmless. I can't remember there being any yellow residue and the stainless plate may not have been stainless steel as it was magnetic (I know
some SS's are ferrous) and it was eventually eaten away by the process. It may have been chrome plated though which may even be worse!
I guess we'd better all just use mild steel from now on then eh???
Cheers,
Craig.
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blueshift
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| posted on 15/1/04 at 06:44 PM |
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good heads-up. maybe someone should contact the maintainer of the original FAQ?
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