cloudy
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posted on 15/7/09 at 07:21 PM |
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How bad is this oil surge?
I'm in the process of making a baffled sump, but not sure it'll be ready for a trackday on saturday...
I've just fitted R888's and the level of grip has made me worried about oil surge, particulary under braking. I've just taken a warm R4
round the block through some twisties. The drops in the graph are brake tests from 60 to zero. I think the dip on the far right is a drop to idle,
though i'm not 100% sure. I know the graph isn't ideal - but am I likely to do damage driving the track day like this?
![](/galpreviews/a983730-surge.png) ![Rescued attachment surge.png](/gallery/a983730-surge.png) Rescued attachment surge.png
www.warnercars.com
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mookaloid
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posted on 15/7/09 at 07:26 PM |
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are you likely to lots of braking from 60 to zero on a track day?
perhaps do the test without these brake tests and see if the pressure drops as much?
"That thing you're thinking - it wont be that."
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cloudy
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posted on 15/7/09 at 07:27 PM |
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perhaps not to a stop, but heavy braking is heavy braking, I can't do 100>50 on the road can I
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locoR1
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posted on 15/7/09 at 07:37 PM |
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Have you done a sensible drive to compare the graphs?
Could be just normal oil pressure fluctuation due to change of engine rpm
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mookaloid
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posted on 15/7/09 at 07:42 PM |
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quote: Originally posted by cloudy
perhaps not to a stop, but heavy braking is heavy braking, I can't do 100>50 on the road can I
Ok fair point - is that a minimum of 38 psi?
If so it doesn't seem too bad to me.
I think the main problems with oil surge are when you lose pressure on a long corner with the engine under load, which doesn't seem to be
happening here
Cheers
Mark
"That thing you're thinking - it wont be that."
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cloudy
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posted on 15/7/09 at 07:44 PM |
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"a sensible drive" not familiar with this terminology?
Here's another run before tyre swap, two drops I know equate to medium braking for two corners
![](/galpreviews/a983758-surge2.png) ![Rescued attachment surge2.png](/gallery/a983758-surge2.png) Rescued attachment surge2.png
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locoR1
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posted on 15/7/09 at 07:49 PM |
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quote: Originally posted by cloudy
"a sensible drive" not familiar with this terminology?
Here's another run before tyre swap, two drops I know equate to medium braking for two corners
I half expected that reply ![](/images//smilies/bigsmile.gif)
looks ok to me but as said by mookaloid its your long fast corners that are the real engine killers!
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Check out my CB500T Cafe Racer build diary
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cloudy
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posted on 15/7/09 at 07:58 PM |
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Will try and find some big roundabouts! I'm getting the feeling that it'll probably be ok for a few sprints until I make and fit a
baffle...
James
www.warnercars.com
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mark chandler
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posted on 15/7/09 at 08:09 PM |
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Can you not graph with respect to RPM, you can then see if its an issue.
Regards Mark
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s2gse
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posted on 15/7/09 at 08:15 PM |
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how are you doing the graph what program are you using to get oil pressure info
life's to short and so was the drive
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cloudy
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posted on 15/7/09 at 08:17 PM |
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To answer both posts in one go it's a digidash2 lite, so can only log one channel... I could take a GPS log at the same time I suppose...
James
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afj
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posted on 15/7/09 at 08:30 PM |
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can you look at the graph after a session on track, take a laptop i mean
eerrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
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cloudy
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posted on 15/7/09 at 08:44 PM |
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Will do, I presume i'm looking for any drop below 30ish psi (idle hot pressure) whats dangerous? I presume 0psi for any time at all is
terminal?
James
[Edited on 15/7/09 by cloudy]
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procomp
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posted on 16/7/09 at 06:49 AM |
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Hi
I will make no comments on the pressure or how to do the test. However on the RGB forum there is one guy who runs a data logging overlay on his
videos. Tim Hovred. His videos will clearly show his oil pressures temperature and G forces over a full race. This may give you an indication of what
affect the pressures in different situations.
LINK TO VIDEOS.
HTH
Cheers Matt
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cloudy
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posted on 16/7/09 at 09:07 AM |
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Thanks Matt, that's a good comparison to see "normal" figures
Interestingly his just stays very static, doesn't change even when revving or idling? I'm sure bike engines don't do that normally!
[Edited on 16/7/09 by cloudy]
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matt_gsxr
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posted on 16/7/09 at 07:47 PM |
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James,
Oil pressure on these GSXR1100's is a bit strange (as you probably have noticed).
At idle when cold mine is way high (100psi or maybe a bit more), the manual suggests it should be lower, but I swapped the pressure relief valve and
it made no difference. Subsequently rf900rush confirmed that this is what they do. (rf900 has similar bottom end to GSXR1100, different clutch
FWIW).
I haven't used mine enough to recognise pressure changes with cornering so I can't comment (and my engine is the other way around to yours),
although when I talked to the side-car chaps they suggested a bit of over-filling and a sump-baffle (the directions of force are different in mine,
prop and no chain, so I'm not sure on that).
I haven't yet gone around any corners, these are for next week after I have sorted out the straight stuff.
Here is a picture of a sump baffle that I inherited (which fits the GSXR1100W). I will probably use it so can't offer it, but it shows the
design. You are not short of design skill I know, but there is no need to reinvent everything (unless you want to of-course!). They used a sump
gasket above and below in the standard fashion.
![](/galpreviews/5Image013.jpg) ![GSXR1100WP SUMP BAFFLE](/gallery/5Image013.jpg) GSXR1100WP SUMP BAFFLE
Matt
p.s. how did you get your pressure log? Can you show it along with a RPM trace? If those dips are braking induced, then I think you want to get rid
of them (but you know this already).
[edited for precision]
[Edited on 17/7/09 by matt_gsxr]
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