EViS
|
| posted on 9/4/06 at 10:44 PM |
|
|
I'm So Baffled - Which Kit?!
I was all set on a Luego, but today i've looked into the MK Indy more, well actually I realised the price list was a downloadable pdf in the
downloads section on the MK site  . MK seems to be half the price than Luego for a tad more parts... it's got me thinking again...
Firstly, it's really not feasible for me to get around all (if any) of the manufacturers warehouses, so i'll most probably be purchasing
upon this forums advice and my own research...
How does MK compare to Luego (and other kit manufacturers) in quality, etc?
Will it also be simple enough for me to get a soft-top hood and sides made up from a 3rd party?
|
|
|
|
|
zetec
|
| posted on 9/4/06 at 11:07 PM |
|
|
MK are as good as they get in this area of the market...and not far behin7d the likes of Westfield. They were the first to venture into this
"7" market supplying just chassis and basic fibreglass, but now supply almost anything you want. The good news is they have sorted the
kit and there should be no problems.
There's a few MK builders near you to help out if need be...
To have a hood made up with sidescreens will be the best part of £500 if done by a pro...build the car first and see what life is like. Plenty of
owners get hoods and never use them.
|
|
|
BKLOCO
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 06:47 AM |
|
|
Quite honestly you are not going to geta fair and impartial opinion on here regarding what you should buy.
You may find out what you should NOT buy.
The problem is that people are loyal to what they themselves have bought.
This is particularly applicable to the MK boys as you will see from the first 2 posts.
The only information that will be 100% impartial will come from your own experiences, unfortunately.
The best advice I can give you is research the market yourself. Remember that most if not all kit manufacturers are a "cottage industry"
and do not hold large, if any, stocks of component parts.
The kit you order will be made to order.
The first thing to do once you have chosen which genre of kit you are going to build is to decide on a realistic budget. This will to a large extent
decide for you which route you are going to take.
Warning: Pay little attention to builders claims of spend unless they can back it up with comprehensive documentary evidence.
I could recount my route to deciding which kit I purchased but quite honestly it would not do you much good unless you had exactly the same criteria
to meet as I did (which is very unlikely)
I must confess to getting somewhat angry with the people who react to questions such as yours by simply quoting the kit that they bought as the one
you should buy. Or posting out of date adverts!
We can all do that.
The sad fact is that YOU have to weigh up what YOU want from a kit, research the market YOURSELF and find the one that closes matches YOUR
criteria.
If you do not do this you will end up buying the car that someone else wanted!!!
Do not be swayed by hype and the product loyalty of others.
This hobby is about individuallity....Be individual....Don't follow the crowd....
Experience is what you get when you don't get what you want!!! 
|
|
|
David Jenkins
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 07:29 AM |
|
|
What he said... 
Also, go to a couple of big shows, sit in their demonstrator cars, talk to the people, and make a short-list. Then, if at all possible, go to their
'factories', check out their operation and blag a decent ride in a demonstrator.
9/10ths of a successful build is having a good relationship with the supplier, as far as I can see (mind you, I built mine from scratch, so what do I
know! )
You're going to spend a fair bit of cash - you wouldn't buy a new car by mail-order, would you? You'd at least want to go and look
at it.
David
|
|
|
graememk
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 07:57 AM |
|
|
if it helps, i've had a robin hood or two.
was going to build a luego as ther only 20 miles up the road
but bought a part built indy, just because i like them.
|
|
|
James
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 08:29 AM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by EViS
Firstly, it's really not feasible for me to get around all (if any) of the manufacturers warehouses, so i'll most probably be purchasing
upon this forums advice and my own research...
As David said, you wouldn't choose a tin top without trying one or two out would you, so why take the risk with this.
At the end of the day to build the car is going to take a *massive* dedication, mostly in time but also in financial outlay. Chances are, even with a
good (and comprehensive) kit it'll take you a year and that's if you work hard at it. Some have spent 4 times that building a kit.
For the cost of £4-6000 and a minimum years worth of my time I'd be willing to make a few trips to manufacturers and (at the very least) go to a
show or two before buying. It's a pity you didn't go to Detling this weekend as it's your nearest show.
As someone who's building a Locost rather than a kit I would say that from my experience you'll get a really good kit from either MK,
Luego, GTS, MNR. So after that it comes down to a choice of the price and the after-sales support from the people you've bought it from.
As BKLOCO says, this is a largely cottage industry and it's pretty typical of British engineering: great products, and engineering etc. but
bugger all idea about marketing or customer service.
At the end of the day go to Stoneleigh, check out all the manufacturers you're interested in (they'll *all* be there unless they're
totally daft) and their cars and make your choice once you've got some more info.
I hope that helps a little and wasn't too partisan!
All the best,
James
P.S. Feel free to come down to our meets at Newlands Corner (Guildford) 1st Sunday of every month where you'll see a selection of MK, Luego,
Caterham and (best of all!!!  ) a bunch of Locosts!
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
- Muhammad Ali
|
|
|
DarrenW
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 09:21 AM |
|
|
As above - you will never get a balanced view on here. Ive only built one - thoroughly enjoyed the build. Support and service was superb, problem is
ive got nothing to compare it to.
The question you should ask is what should i not buy and why - unfortunately this is a dodgy area these days as some answers could be slanderous!!!
People could answer via U2U though so less public.
In an attempt to be balanced - all i can say is go to the shows, short list, visit manufacturers and go with the one that you feel most comfortable
with - this is what i did and chose Mac#1. A lot of the woes that people encounter just didnt crop up in my build. Maybe its because iam so good
(not!) or the components are so well sorted (maybe). MNR was a close 2nd. Mk were 3rd on my shortlist of 3.
|
|
|
zxrlocost
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 09:29 AM |
|
|
I have an MK which now I have built I love it and it looks ace
Ive always loved the look of the MK more than the others thats why I bought the kit
There quality of fibreglass work is not the best IMHO and the fitment of the panels is pretty shite youd think after having sold so many cars they
would have perfected the panels...
I could create a long list of other problems Ive had along the way which through a bit of common sense they could get so right...
but Im also very happy with a lot of things
so Im sitting on the fence with this one
you deff need to go and view all the kits even if you book into a B&B
theres a nice B&B outside MK sportscars
chris
|
PLEASE NOTE: This user is a trader who has not signed up for the LocostBuilders registration scheme. If this post is advertising a commercial product or service, please report it by clicking here.
|
Gav
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 10:06 AM |
|
|
Which Kit?
Kits are for girls, smelt your own ore and buy uncle rons book
Seriously, while i whole heartedly agree with the previous comments, especially BKLOCO's, you perhaps wont realise exactly what you need or are
looking for in a kit until you've done your first one.
I dont think you can go far wrong with any of the kit makers that are mentioned on this forum. Although i would follow CalvinX's example and
make sure your timescales and expectations can be met by your chosen supplier.
While i am a scratch builder i would probably do it again, but next time but i would do it exactly how i wanted to, simply because i now have the
experience of knowing what should go where etc and what carnt go there.
|
|
|
EViS
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 11:03 AM |
|
|
I'm completely aware that owners are generally biased, which is why i always read between the lines  . However, what I guess i'm trying
to ask is whether MK really is that much cheaper than Luego in terms of achieving a road legal, SVA approved car? Or am I just missing something and
the difference in pricing between the two is pretty minimal...
However as an example, a full exhaust set (incl. manifold, etc) from MK is £300, whilst Mac#1 charge and Luego charge around the £600 bracket...
again, is there a significant quality issue with the MK supplied exhaust...
My budget is set at no more than £4k (preferably incl. of registration and SVA fees). I'll also have 2 months free to work on the project
non-stop.
[Edited on 10/4/06 by EViS]
|
|
|
fesycresy
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 11:24 AM |
|
|
I've got a MAC#1 and I am biased, so I'll not offer any advice on kit selection, but, no more than £4k, all in ?
Don't think you'll do any of the above mentioned manufacturers for that (Snoopy, didn't the magazine powered pinto cost £5k ?), or
you could build a book locost for £250
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The sooner you fall behind, the more time you'll have to catch up.
|
|
|
zxrlocost
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 11:25 AM |
|
|
if your budget is that much I would seriously consider saving more or
use absolutely everything from your donor including the engine etc
get cheap second hand alloys
because otherwise believe me all the little things add up loads more
chris
|
PLEASE NOTE: This user is a trader who has not signed up for the LocostBuilders registration scheme. If this post is advertising a commercial product or service, please report it by clicking here.
|
DarrenW
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 11:48 AM |
|
|
i started with 4K budget. Quickly realised it was insufficient for any kit and just built what i wanted in the end. I found i culd do some trades to
keep cost controlled and spread the cost to make it affordable.
|
|
|
EViS
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 11:57 AM |
|
|
Yup i am planning on using abolutely everything other than seats and dials (which with a bit of luck i'll try source cheaper somewhere). Having
done a search over the MK Indy section of the forum, there were people quoting figures of complete builds finished for £3k  . Obviously they
weren't the nicest looking MK's but it shows that it is possible...
|
|
|
zxrlocost
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 12:40 PM |
|
|
believe me when i say its not possible
theres to many little things that are £50 a go
that you need that arent in the kit
fuel tank £50-100
seats £50-200 at least
brake calipers or at least recon kits £50
discs+pads£40-??
loads of nuts and bolts£
rear lights£50-180
headlights £70-100
fuel cap filler restrictor and pipe at least £70
bonnet catches £30-40
dash £30-100
indicators£20
bits modifying £50
exhaust £300
harnesses are at least £70
wheels £100 at least
rubber strips u strip etc etc £50 at least
mirrors mirror £40
I could probably think of another load of stuff but hope that helps
chris
|
PLEASE NOTE: This user is a trader who has not signed up for the LocostBuilders registration scheme. If this post is advertising a commercial product or service, please report it by clicking here.
|
EViS
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 12:45 PM |
|
|
Well taking into account all the above, and giving rather generous prices for each, the total has come to £1380. Add the £2500 for the MK kit, the
total comes out as 3880, leaving some leeway for additions such as tools, rivets and nuts/bolts and a donor... Yes it most definitely is a squeeze...
escpecially if i also want to get a soft top made up...
So those who say they have built their kits for £3500 are lying ...?
[Edited on 10/4/06 by EViS]
|
|
|
zxrlocost
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 12:59 PM |
|
|
sva 150 quid
dvla 50 quid
and all the things Ive forgot which will ad another good 500 pounds onto it
what Im saying is that dont be held back
but ie you have 4k in the bank buy the kit
fetch the kit how are you going ot fetch it theres another £100
youll have 4k and youll spend most of it before youve even had time to think so tread carefully
youll also come across all the things that dont work on the original car or break after a week engine wise as it will be old
££££££
mine has cost 9k but its a bec and everything apart from the engine and drive stuff is new which is obviously totally different than trying to do it
on a budget.
just remember what I say about the things youll come across
" the phrase shite I forgot about that theres another 30 quid 20 quid etc
etc
|
PLEASE NOTE: This user is a trader who has not signed up for the LocostBuilders registration scheme. If this post is advertising a commercial product or service, please report it by clicking here.
|
mac1ZR
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 01:35 PM |
|
|
MAC#1 THE ONLY ONE!
|
|
|
EViS
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 01:36 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by mac1ZR
MAC#1 THE ONLY ONE!
Hard to read in-between the lines there .
|
|
|
Peteff
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 01:54 PM |
|
|
I helped build an Indy 4 years ago and last year I gave a friend a hand with his MAC1#. I couldn't actually tell the difference between them.
yours, Pete
I went into the RSPCA office the other day. It was so small you could hardly swing a cat in there.
|
|
|
zxrlocost
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 02:15 PM |
|
|
they are the same car
|
PLEASE NOTE: This user is a trader who has not signed up for the LocostBuilders registration scheme. If this post is advertising a commercial product or service, please report it by clicking here.
|
BKLOCO
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 02:24 PM |
|
|
I would be very supprised if you are able to build a kit to a reasonable standard for the sort of money you are talking.
There are absolutely loads of bits and pieces that you don't think of at the time of ordering even the fluids can add up to close to £100 then
you have things like: Battery. No plates. Hoses. G.box mount. Fuel filter. Air filters. As well as all of this, and believe me ther is loads more you
will need that hasn't yet been mentioned. You will probably need to buy some of the more specialist tools or at least hire them.
Do you have an engine hoist? brake pipe flaring tool? etc. etc.
I believe that a much more realistic budget for ANY kit starts at around the £6000 mark and trust me it's easy to spend much more.
The last thing I want to do is put anyone off building but I think you need to be realistic and know the possible total cost before you start, then
hopefully we won't see yet another half finished dissapointment on the good old fleebay!
Experience is what you get when you don't get what you want!!!
|
|
|
EViS
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 02:37 PM |
|
|
BKLOCO, your spot on in thinking that the last thing i want is to have to cut my losses and sell an unfinished project on fleabay... Furthermore, £4k
is a rather large amount of money for a student like myself...
I'll still pop down to Stoneleigh at the end of this month and have words with some of the manufacturers and get their opinions on my budget.
It's been very mixed here... The Locost Related (General Chat) part of the forum agrees that my budget is far too low, whilst the Car Specific
parts of the forum reckon that my budget is ideal... hmm...
So hard to get a straight answer .
|
|
|
David Jenkins
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 02:55 PM |
|
|
Ask for advice on this forum and you'll get at least 10 different answers!
...and probably an argument will be the result...
A practical answer is - the more time you are prepared to put into the project, the cheaper it will be. This includes scrapheap scrounging, finding
things that will do the job rather than those with a high bling factor (esp. wheels), and all sorts of things like that. Also being prepared to
accept less-than-bling until after SVA.
Contrary to what you said earlier, I have seen some very respectable cars that have been built for less than £3000. Most of them used 2nd-hand
wheels, simple engines will little or no tuning, home-made seats, and so on. Many of them looked really high-class.
Setting modest objectives is a very good way to keep the cost down. Trouble is, when you start building you start to think "it would look nicer
if I just added..." and then the budget spirals out of control!
David
|
|
|
EViS
|
| posted on 10/4/06 at 02:58 PM |
|
|
This is precisely my point and why I love this forum, 101 different opinions haha. Any idea whether those £3k budgeted cars were kits or self made
(chassis, Al bodywork, etc)? If kits, any idea which manufacturer?
|
|
|
.jpg)
.jpg){kind=avatar}
