Guys, I know some of you are engineering grads and/or employ such people. Can I ask for some advice, I feel a bit desperate at the moment.

I started a B-Eng course in Sept in Mechanical engineering with composites. I am really struggling to learn/figure out the maths we are being presented with. Its just fairly basic things like partial fractions, completing the square, differentiation by parts etc. But I find it so hard to learn and remeber all of the operations for everything. Even if I do I make a stupid algebraic mistake and end up with the wrong anwer anyway. Add to this that my lecturer for Maths and Mechanics is a feckin arse bandit who seems to have no lecture plans and is crap at explaining anything... Means I feel a little helpless.

I only need 40% in the math module to go to next year, but unless I get closer to 90% there is no way I would be able to understand year2 and therefore get a decent degree out of the course.

So my options as far as I see them:
1.Stick with the current course, blunder through the maths, trying as hard as I can to figure things out myself (as the lecturer is useless). And hope I can complete the entire course... But risk getting a low classification degree because of my afformentioned weaknesses.
2. Change courses and do a Bsc in Mechanical design and manufacturing in the hope that the Maths is slightly easier and more applied. By doing this I might stand a chance of getting a reasonable degree classification at the end of it. I would like to think that this degree would be more fun as it is a bit more applied which is how my mind works)


I am concerned that perhaps it might be harder to get a job with a Bsc rather than a BEng.... but as I dont have any idea what I want to do for a job, at this stage it doesnt seem to matter much...

If you have managed to read this far.... can anyone offer any usefull advice, I am really wound up at the moment. I look at the maths and it just makes me feel so de-motivated and depressed about everything. Its a fear thing im sure...

[Edited on 17/10/11 by tegwin]

Having no idea what you want to do for a job is worrying, and just like me! I did a degree in Biochemistry and Genetics, and now fit kitchens for a living.

Have a good ponder about what you want to do with your life and see if the specific degree matter. The only use for mine is to mention it occationally to amuse customers

Its annoying not having any idea what I want to do for a job. I am very mechanically minded, but having worked for quite a big company in the past, that has put me right off the idea of working in a big engineering company again... leaving me with..... urm..... not quite sure really...

I would in the first instance get some help; talk to people that organise the course, it is very likely you are not the only one having an issue with the taught component of the maths. The sooner you get help the better , being lectured on Maths is none to helpful you need help doing it with feedback (tutorials ect).

Good luck with what ever you do.. Remember that the A-level Maths is quite rubbish now the uni-has to help get you up-to the required level it is part of the course now..

It's early enough to get up to speed so don't despair.. Our Physics course had a similar issue they were using maths in the lectures in the course that had yet to be taught in the maths modules..

Dan


[Edited on 17/10/11 by Bluemoon]

The main thing to remember is that you'll use all those hard maths almost every day in your work.....<absolute massive eyeroll......>

From my memory it doesn't get especially much harder, just more of it....stick with it you'll be fine..

Alan

There are plenty of Math heads here who would be more than pleased to help i am sure. Find out if the the Maths modules in the BSc are common with the BEng. Find out generally what the differences are too.

What industry are you looking to get into? Check whether both courses are accredited to the Engineering Council/IMechE for chartered status. If the BSc isn't then I would strongly recommend you stick with the BEng.

From my experience I would say that getting a 2:1 Bsc rather than a 3rd BEng would be much more use. It also depends how old you are tbh - I got a 3rd Class BEng in Automotive engineering (because I got bored basically and spent too much time building racing cars instead ) and graduated when I was 30ish. I've never managed to get a job in Engineering and in fact have only ever got 3 interviews for Engineering jobs, basically because of the 3rd and my age. I was too old for graduate trainee programs and there were lots of other people with better degree classifications in front of me in the job queue......

11 years on and I've worked for nearly 9 years as a Architectural Technician and have only rarely used anything I learnt at University! In fact I reckon I've probably forgotten 80% of it all which looking back does seem a bit of a waste of 3 years tbh

The best way to learn maths is tutorials and working with others at the same level or slightly higher. Learning maths just via lectures is much harder and it doesn't stick.

Find someone else of about the same level and work on the problems together.

I did a Maths degree btw

Hi

I can only empathise with you having been in the same position 12 - 13 years ago. (Blimey was it that long ago!! EEk).
First year at uni....great...except for 2 modules we had to pass and that was Statistics. I know what you mean when you are struggling to grasp the basics when everyone else seems to be forging ahead and looks as though they have no issues what so ever.
My only advice would be to go see the lecturer and get some additional work groups set up to address what it is exactly you are stressing about. It may not become clear straight away, but i bet you feel a whole weight get lifted off your shoulders as you now know that you aren't suffering in silent, which is where a lot of the stress and confusion starts to creep.

Go see your lecturer and sort out some additional work groups. Honestly, you'll be surprised. Also i think you'll be surprised how many others on your course are also suffering in silent when you see who turns up.... ;-)

No matter what the outcome....stick with it. Seems like fookin hard work now, but believe you me you'll look back and wonder what was all the fuss about.

What he said you need the maths no matter what branch of engineering you do. As a general rule if you don't need so much maths in a particular degree it is not regarded as highly in engineering.

My solution was working through previous exam papers , exercises , and more examples .

You do not need to take any poo from your lecturer. If he is really no use what have you to loose by complaining to the departmental head? First though I would have a long chat with him putting your cards on the table - you never know he might not know how bad you feel and could give you lots of extra stuff (worked examples, exercises etc).

At the end of the day you really need to understand this stuff.

good luck and don't give up on it.

Cheers!

I'd say see if there is a way of getting a bit of extra help with the maths, if your lucky you'll be good mates with someone else on you course who really understands it all and has time to help you for free

or when I was at uni there were offers of extra maths tutoring for a few £ an hour (mostly post-grad's) - I think some of these were even arranged by the uni

at the very least you should tell the guy thats teaching you - they might be able to give you a little time to point you in the right direction (some of my lectures were always happy to help)
or have the uni allocated a lecturer to be a mentor/ year head or similar that you can go to with any issues ? as it would be there job to point you in the direction of some help




I wish I'd done something about my own maths in 1st/2nd year because it only gets in your way later on
as it was I scraped through my last year and came out with a 3rd, I recon my maths was a big part of that

in the end I was lucky and got a job designing steelwork - structural engineering has much, much easier maths but given another chance I'd still sort my maths out...


[Edited on 17/10/2011 by mcerd1]

An interesting topic this I had exactly the same issue when I was in uni (11 years ago)

I really really struggled with my maths - failed the maths module in the first year.I wasn't sure if I would be able to do the maths and in the following years so I found a friendly lecturer and had a chat. He explained to me that while maths was fundamental to the course (Integrated engineering) the first coup,e of modules were the pure maths stuff. After that it was more about applying the maths. He also pointed out to me that generally maths is just a series of process and if you can learn each part and then how to apply it then you will be fine. The important thing though it to practice practice and practice.

So I took on his advice, got some maths books out and actually knuckled down and spent hours and hours doing maths problems over and over. When I came to the next module, my marked increased to 55% - a 20% increase in a few months just because I spent the time and worked by myself. That was a massive ego boost to me and a great wake up call that made me believe that with enough hard work I could do it. I then put a similar amount of extra effort in across all the modules and before I knew it the Uni were offering me to upgrade from a BEng to an MEng.

So how did I get on - well with my marks on the way up I really pushed myself in the final year and too may amazement I scraped a first class honours (70.3%) - not bad for a first year failure!

After that I had the chance and decided to stay on to do my Doctorate and now I am a succesful Project Engineer looking after £15m+ projects.

While I was doing my doctorate I did get invovled with a few uni projects and helped a few students. One thing I did notice is that the 'more' practical students struggled with some of the theoretical subjects because they struggled to get their heads around some of the concepts. In contrast they excelled at the more practical subjects.

I found maths difficult too. I can still remember the chaos theory lessons from nearly 20 years ago, I sat there clueless some days.

It also helps if you can get a 2nd / 3rd year student to help explain and mentor you. They can explain better than some lecturers who have the 'look how much I know' attitude.

I am currently studying Mechanical Engineering at Newcastle, I'm in my 3rd year and have another 1 to go after this year. I've always enjoyed maths, but I have a really crap memory so every time an exam comes along I essentially have to relearn the basics e.g. partial fractions etc.

One textbook which I strongly recommend which got me 1st in both first and second years is K.A Stroud - Engineering Mathematics, Sixth Edition. It goes through the basics very simply, step by step and has lots of questions and answers at the end of every chapters. You can buy it from amazon here:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Engineering-Mathematics-K-Stroud/dp/1403942463/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1318864920&sr=1-1#_

But I am positive that your university library will have it in stock, so get it out on loan, give it a read and see if you like it. I bought it and definitely dont regret it. His Advanced Engineering Mathematics edition wasn't as a good tho and doesnt cover the basics so make sure you just get the nomral Engineering Mathematics.

The ISBN is:

978-1-4039-4246-3

Buy your own K.A Stroud. You would need it forever, trust me I have mine next to my table at work. I use it at least twice a month. Back to the question, I would recommend tutorials as well and taking time to research the application of the maths ur learning, I found it helped me out visually, cause I have a crap memory as well.

Also I studied chemical engineering. I have worked for about 4 years now as a chemical engineer and to say i do not really like it is an understatement. i dont know what to do with myself so i keep going to work.

Agree with most of the above but add to that, good friends are vital at uni. Everyone has different strengths and I had a good bunch of mates through uni and we could mostly figure stuff out between us and explain it to one another!

quote:

---

Originally posted by Tatey
I am currently studying Mechanical Engineering at Newcastle, I'm in my 3rd year and have another 1 to go after this year. I've always enjoyed maths, but I have a really crap memory so every time an exam comes along I essentially have to relearn the basics e.g. partial fractions etc.

One textbook which I strongly recommend which got me 1st in both first and second years is K.A Stroud - Engineering Mathematics, Sixth Edition. It goes through the basics very simply, step by step and has lots of questions and answers at the end of every chapters. You can buy it from amazon here:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Engineering-Mathematics-K-Stroud/dp/1403942463/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1318864920&sr=1-1#_

But I am positive that your university library will have it in stock, so get it out on loan, give it a read and see if you like it. I bought it and definitely dont regret it. His Advanced Engineering Mathematics edition wasn't as a good tho and doesnt cover the basics so make sure you just get the nomral Engineering Mathematics.

The ISBN is:

978-1-4039-4246-3

---

Man I wish I had you guys around when I was studying Engineering (in the 80's). As mentioned by others I seem to be very "practical" so concepts that I could see I could deal with, but the esoteric calculus etc I battled with.

That said, I managed to complete my course, and still do some trig or other engineering maths almost weekly.

It does seem most people end up doing something different to what they studied, I say as long as you have some tertiary education it teaches you to approach problems, and you can turn that to anything

Cheers

Fred W B

[Edited on 17/10/11 by Fred W B]

I had the same sort of issue when I was at Uni - Maths lecturer was rubbish and gave us an e-learning type package, which is great if you understand it!
I ended up dropping out of Uni because of this - I kind of regret it. Decided that the best route for me was get a job with part time HNC - which I did.
My advice is stick with it and try and get the extra help.

Chears for all the posative comments guys. Its really comforting to hear these things...

Im going to be 27(feckin ell... just had to double check my maths!) by the time I graduate... I dont want to bleep up a degree and come out with nothing... would put me in a really poo position for getting a job....

why dont you go to the uni maths club? im sure they have one. i struggled with the maths at first on my degree but the maths club got me through it. turns out that once i nailed the concepts that i failed to learn (didn't even know they existed) in previous educational establishments it wasn't really that hard.

[Edited on 17/10/2011 by ashg]

went to Plymouth, did the same course, well BEng Composites,... have sent you a u2u.

quote:

---

Originally posted by tegwin
Guys, I know some of you are engineering grads and/or employ such people. Can I ask for some advice, I feel a bit desperate at the moment.

I started a B-Eng course in Sept in Mechanical engineering with composites. I am really struggling to learn/figure out the maths we are being presented with. Its just fairly basic things like partial fractions, completing the square, differentiation by parts etc. But I find it so hard to learn and remeber all of the operations for everything. Even if I do I make a stupid algebraic mistake and end up with the wrong anwer anyway. Add to this that my lecturer for Maths and Mechanics is a feckin arse bandit who seems to have no lecture plans and is crap at explaining anything... Means I feel a little helpless.

I only need 40% in the math module to go to next year, but unless I get closer to 90% there is no way I would be able to understand year2 and therefore get a decent degree out of the course.

So my options as far as I see them:
1.Stick with the current course, blunder through the maths, trying as hard as I can to figure things out myself (as the lecturer is useless). And hope I can complete the entire course... But risk getting a low classification degree because of my afformentioned weaknesses.
2. Change courses and do a Bsc in Mechanical design and manufacturing in the hope that the Maths is slightly easier and more applied. By doing this I might stand a chance of getting a reasonable degree classification at the end of it. I would like to think that this degree would be more fun as it is a bit more applied which is how my mind works)


I am concerned that perhaps it might be harder to get a job with a Bsc rather than a BEng.... but as I dont have any idea what I want to do for a job, at this stage it doesnt seem to matter much...

If you have managed to read this far.... can anyone offer any usefull advice, I am really wound up at the moment. I look at the maths and it just makes me feel so de-motivated and depressed about everything. Its a fear thing im sure...

[Edited on 17/10/11 by tegwin]

---

Funnily enough Tegwin, I found myself in the very same situation 3 years ago. Having gone into the Mechanical Engineering degree with a more practical skill base I found I really struggled with the maths, especially in the first year. There were two methods which I used to get through the pure maths modules- firstly having a decent source book (Croft and Davidson, Mathematics for Engineers did me fine for the first year, could never get along with K.A Stroud but it's personal preference), and secondly working through every tutorial, example and past paper I could get my hands on. The important point, and I cannot emphasize this enough, is to put the time and effort into learning it. Learn the process and repeat until you can perform an action without referring to notes. I effectively taught myself most of my modules in an intensive week each. TBH in the end I just didn't bother with the lectures any more, this method may not work for everyone but I ended up with good grades
Two last points: revising with and support from friends is invaluable, and also if you're like me when you use the maths for a practical purpose it becomes easier to remember.
As for being 27 when you graduate, welcome to the club! I graduated with a BEng (Hons) in Mechanical Engineering in July, grand old age of 27
Now doing a Masters, but that's a different subject

Where are you studying anyways? If you're near to Bristol I'd be more than willing to help out at some point