Coose
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 posted on 19/3/09 at 05:11 PM |
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Company car vs opting out
Evening all,
My company car is up for renewal and I'm contemplating looking at other options. I have asked for prices for a few company cars and
they're coming back at ridiculous costs - for anything interesting I would have to pay a significant chunk towards it (£120+ per month), where I
could have a 1.9td Golf/A3, a 110bhp Passat or a 130bhp Vauxhall Insignia without paying towards them (blahhhhgghhhh!!!!). Then, I would of course be
paying company car tax (£65+/month). Company fuel is paid for, but not private.
If I opt-out I would get about £350/month after tax but only around 14p/mile.
What do others do and what seems to be the most cost-effective? I like the idea of a company car as if/when it breaks it's not my
responsibility, plus all running costs are paid.
If it helps I do around 30k miles a year so the car needs to be a nice place to spend a third of my conscious life!
Ta.
Spin 'er off Well...
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Danozeman
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| posted on 19/3/09 at 05:13 PM |
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Could you not get a contract hire yourself?? Then u would have a new one evry three years, warranty etc. You could get something good for 350 a
month. And you wont have to pay the nice tax.
Dan
Built the purple peril!! Let the modifications begin!!
http://www.eastangliankitcars.co.uk
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Richard Quinn
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| posted on 19/3/09 at 05:49 PM |
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Need to be careful if going with a private lease. Most of the "attractive offers" are based on sub 10k miles per annum. I don't know
what the current penalty rates are but they used to be between 7.5 and 9.5p per mile years ago. If you end up doing 30k a year you could end up with a
£5k+ bill at the end of the lease.
I'm back with a company car now and just find the complete lack of grief (apart from HMRC!) to be worth it. The only way that I would go back to
my own car now is if the company paid for all my fuel and I would suffer the tax just to have something stupidly inappropriate for a while!
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ashg
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| posted on 19/3/09 at 06:15 PM |
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i opted out and so far in 9months it seems to be working out although i havent had anything go wrong with the car other than servicing costs and
tyres/wheel alignment.
Anything With Tits or Wheels Will cost you MONEY!!
Haynes Roadster (Finished)
Exocet (Finished & Sold)
New Project (Started)
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Hellfire
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| posted on 19/3/09 at 06:18 PM |
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Every time my company car comes up for renewal, I always seriously consider opting out. My heart says 'go for something you've always
wanted' but my head always says 'think of all the hassle and the additional costs'.
I do 23,000 miles per year and doing the calculations, the company car wins hands down every time.
Check your policy. If it's like mine, you can opt out for a year and then opt back in annually anytime thereafter. This will allow you to try it
out and see which you prefer.
Phil
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owelly
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| posted on 19/3/09 at 07:29 PM |
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Hi Cooosey.....
Have you spoken to knob jockey? I don't mean have you tried to listen to his 'plate of peas logic' regarding opting out, but try to
get him to do actual numbers. Not his hypothetic 'what if..' numbers. If he can make opting out work, anyone can. How many company Passats
did he kill?? So if running his own car for 36 company miles a year hasn't ended up costing him money, you're onto a winner!
http://www.ppcmag.co.uk
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adrianreeve
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| posted on 19/3/09 at 07:33 PM |
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I opted out 5 years ago, and haven't looked back! Same as you, the company cars on offer were boring/rubbish, and I get a reasonable allowance.
Also like you, I only get 14p fuel allowance per mile, but at the end of the tax year, you can claim a tax rebate based on the following
calculation:
40p - 14p (your allowance) per mile (so that's 26p) for the first 10k miles, and then 25p - 14p = 11p per mile therafter.
So for you, you'd get (10,000 x 26p) = £2600 + (20,000 x 11p) = £2200
So altogether, you could get a tax rebate on £4800 per year. If you are a 40% tax payer, that works out at just under £2000 tax rebate every year,
which usually pays for our holday.
You'll also pay less income tax, as the company car is seen as a payment in kind, and you are taxed accordingly.
Just my thoughts, hope it helps!
Cheers
Adrian
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Coose
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| posted on 19/3/09 at 07:56 PM |
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Thanks for everyone's input so far. 
I don't want to be tied in to a contract hire scheme or similar as I have a strong feeling that my "location" will change within the
next 12 months ( ), which is another reason why I don't want a company car where the monthly cost is greater than my allowance. eg. If
it's £120/month over my allowance and for whatever reason I leave with 2 years left to run on the lease, I then have to pay £120 x 24
months...... 
But, I also don't want a car that I get out of feeling like I've fallen down the stairs as it's not unknown for me to be driving
300+ miles a day, which would pretty-much apply to any car that comes within the company car budget. Over new year we drove down to Monaco to the
in-laws in my current company car (X-Trail) and it was great! We stopped every 3 hours or so to feed the 'lil boy (7 months old at the time)
without any problems at all - it was like we'd only been in the car for 10 minutes! I can't see an Insignia being as comfortable....
So, my thought is to opt out buy something that I'd rather have on a loan for the forseeable future (up to £7-8k), but if for some reasons my
plans change I could go back to a company car in 12 months and sell the car. I've been offered the En-Trail for market value, but I know what
kind of life it's had so far (and it's done 80-odd K).
My En-Trail is costing me an additional £80/month (before tax) plus company car tax (£117/month) so I think savings are to be had! But then, a big
part of me thinks the same way as Phil - if I get up tomorrow and the En-Trail won't start it's not my problem, which is a good thing when
I spend about a third of my conscious life in the car!
Decisions decisions.....
Spin 'er off Well...
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Coose
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| posted on 19/3/09 at 08:02 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by owelly
Hi Cooosey.....
Have you spoken to knob jockey? I don't mean have you tried to listen to his 'plate of peas logic' regarding opting out, but try to
get him to do actual numbers. Not his hypothetic 'what if..' numbers. If he can make opting out work, anyone can. How many company Passats
did he kill?? So if running his own car for 36 company miles a year hasn't ended up costing him money, you're onto a winner!
Sorry old bean, I was typing my last post as you sent yours. I haven't spoken to him, but if you bear in mind his last car (CRV) cost him the
best part of £20k as far as I remember I can guarantee that he hasn't done the sums!
And looking at the comments by adrianreeve (which I thought was something like the case) I had a feeling that there was additional tax that could be
claimed. I think I need to do more sums (and stop looking at Alfa Sportwagons and anything that's RWD!).....
Spin 'er off Well...
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tul214
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| posted on 19/3/09 at 08:08 PM |
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I opted out in October. Similar thoughts about costs as I do 30k miles p.a. also and the list was rubish.
I also get about £400 p.m. and similar fuel allowances to you.
I took the jump and got a 3yr old Merc E270 with 30k miles on it. Very comfy for those long trips, I am getting 42 mpg average over the last 10k miles
and get it serviced at a non main dealer merc specialist.
The way I looked at it was that if I cannot run a decent car for C£11k a year (allowance, fuel rebate and the income tax allowance) then there is
something wrong!!
I will chop it in after 3 yrs when it will have 120k miles on and still get a deposit for the next one.....free motoring IMHO.
1.6 Raw Super6 sold
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Coose
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| posted on 19/3/09 at 08:26 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by tul214
I opted out in October. Similar thoughts about costs as I do 30k miles p.a. also and the list was rubish.
I also get about £400 p.m. and similar fuel allowances to you.
I took the jump and got a 3yr old Merc E270 with 30k miles on it. Very comfy for those long trips, I am getting 42 mpg average over the last 10k miles
and get it serviced at a non main dealer merc specialist.
The way I looked at it was that if I cannot run a decent car for C£11k a year (allowance, fuel rebate and the income tax allowance) then there is
something wrong!!
I will chop it in after 3 yrs when it will have 120k miles on and still get a deposit for the next one.....free motoring IMHO.
So, doing some rough sums I would be around £7.5k/year better off than I am now (plus the 14p/mile allowance), which breaks down as: -
£117/month car tax on the En-Trail (£1400/year),
£80/month (less tax) donation toward the lease cost (£750/year),
About £380/month car allowance after tax (£4500/year),
Fuel tax on £4800/year (£1050/year).
These calculations are based on 22% tax as I'm in the cross-over between that and 40% (I'll never be a millionaire being a controls
engineer!).
Does that seem about right?
Spin 'er off Well...
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mark chandler
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| posted on 19/3/09 at 08:33 PM |
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Opted out years ago, luckily get 45p for first 10k miles, I do around 25k a year booked. Do not forget at 15p per mile you can claim back 30p on you
return, you just get the VAT back but its probally another £1k in the pot.
So cars, either 3 years old and run to death or something more special, Jags have always been good to me as these swallow miles and have already lost
the money. You have to service yourself though, I have found new oil every 5000 miles, do gearbox and axle every 20,000 miles and nothing significant
will fail.
Over the years I have run
Broke even means all expences were covered by mileage claimed
v12 XJS, broke even
4.0litre XJS, made money on miles, sold for slightly more after 2 years with an extra 50k miles added!!! (only changed oil and tyres.
928s4, broke even after 1 year, spent 2k sorting Aircon and bits and bobs, sold for purchase price
MR2 Turbo, broke even, depreciated.
P38 Range rover, 200k miles only purchased wheels tyres and LPG kit, made money
Current car, XK8, converted to LPG, 300miles to £30 so making money at present.
Go on treat yourself, get a quality old car and enjoy. Bonus if redundancy calls they do not take you car.
On balance I have probally made around £20k in 10 years by buying well and selling high, @ 15p per mile you will struggle my XK8 is 10p per mile to
run on fuel but its a fantastic drive.
Regards Mark
[Edited on 19/3/09 by mark chandler]
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l0rd
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| posted on 19/3/09 at 08:34 PM |
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Me being THICK and not having a clue as never had a company car.
You all got me thinking about these.
I am doing 30-35K a year to travel to work and back out of my own pocket.
Is there anything i can do to make up for the loss?
[Edited on 19/3/09 by l0rd]
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owelly
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| posted on 19/3/09 at 08:41 PM |
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Yeah. Disconnect your speedo or move house....
http://www.ppcmag.co.uk
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Coose
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| posted on 19/3/09 at 09:07 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by mark chandler
Opted out years ago, luckily get 45p for first 10k miles, I do around 25k a year booked. Do not forget at 15p per mile you can claim back 30p on you
return, you just get the VAT back but its probally another £1k in the pot.
Yeah, that was the £1050 that I listed as "Fuel Tax", but I forgot the word "Rebate"!
That's my next thought - what would I buy? I want something that's comfortable but has a reasonable turn-of-speed, sensible running costs
and after selling the Striker I'm missing RWD. But, RWD isn't essential. An estate would be useful so I can wedge the dog in the boot, but
also isn't essential. I'm not the biggest fan of diesels (unless it's an auto Mazda Bongo, but I have one of those already). This
doesn't seem to get any easier!
Spin 'er off Well...
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Coose
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| posted on 19/3/09 at 09:08 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by l0rd
Me being THICK and not having a clue as never had a company car.
You all got me thinking about these.
I am doing 30-35K a year to travel to work and back out of my own pocket.
Is there anything i can do to make up for the loss?
[Edited on 19/3/09 by l0rd]
Sorry old chap, but unless you can get some kind of travel allowance Mr Owelly is right!
Spin 'er off Well...
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tul214
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| posted on 19/3/09 at 09:14 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by l0rd
Me being THICK and not having a clue as never had a company car.
You all got me thinking about these.
I am doing 30-35K a year to travel to work and back out of my own pocket.
Is there anything i can do to make up for the loss?
[Edited on 19/3/09 by l0rd]
Err...move nearer your work or work nearer your home?
1.6 Raw Super6 sold
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tul214
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| posted on 19/3/09 at 09:22 PM |
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quote:
That's my next thought - what would I buy? I want something that's comfortable but has a reasonable turn-of-speed, sensible running costs
and after selling the Striker I'm missing RWD. But, RWD isn't essential. An estate would be useful so I can wedge the dog in the boot, but
also isn't essential. I'm not the biggest fan of diesels (unless it's an auto Mazda Bongo, but I have one of those already). This
doesn't seem to get any easier!
This? NTDWM
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/860960.htm
1.6 Raw Super6 sold
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Coose
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| posted on 19/3/09 at 09:37 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by tul214
This? NTDWM
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/860960.htm
Woooaahhhh, twice what I'd be looking at spending! Plus, it's an Audi......
(Ok, maybe a bargain S3 or S4 or an early-80's Quattro, but I don't think that's particularly sensible!)
[Edited on 19/3/09 by Coose]
Spin 'er off Well...
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tul214
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| posted on 19/3/09 at 10:24 PM |
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??" target="_blank">http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/929778.htm??
1.6 Raw Super6 sold
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Coose
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| posted on 19/3/09 at 10:54 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by tul214
??" target="_blank">http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/929778.htm??
Almost nice, but a Vectra.....
(I never said that I'm an awkward bugger, did I? )
Spin 'er off Well...
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tul214
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| posted on 20/3/09 at 05:27 AM |
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quote:
(I never said that I'm an awkward bugger, did I? )
 ...o.k. sod the sensible...
you know you want to
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/934607.htm 
I had a 156 selespeed and loved it...until it needed a new gearbox
[Edited on 20/3/09 by tul214]
1.6 Raw Super6 sold
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l0rd
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| posted on 20/3/09 at 06:27 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by tul214
Err...move nearer your work or work nearer your home?
I am looking for another job nearer at home.
But with the redundancies and the 2million ppl unemployed i am kinda scared of going in a new job as i know that it is very hard to get redundant at
where i am.
If i move, my missus won't be able to get a job hence staying so far away from my work so far.
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Coose
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| posted on 20/3/09 at 07:37 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by tul214
quote:
(I never said that I'm an awkward bugger, did I? )
...o.k. sod the sensible...
you know you want to
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/934607.htm
I had a 156 selespeed and loved it...until it needed a new gearbox
Nice! I'd love an Alfa but, though I already have breakdown cover I can see them charging me double for it the next year....
Spin 'er off Well...
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Coose
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| posted on 20/3/09 at 04:41 PM |
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Went to look at this today but it was sold..... Maybe a bit daft bearing in mind 25mpg with a
tail wind?
Spin 'er off Well...
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