woodster
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 12:48 PM |
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Greece and the death of the euro
if i was Greek i'd vote no and tell the french and Germans to go and f??? themselves  
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Simon
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 01:13 PM |
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I'm inclined to agree. Just to upset those two really.
ATB
Simon
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phoenix70
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 01:14 PM |
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probably most greeks will agree, but that still leaves the country bankrupt and guess who is going to lose big if that happens.... well France
seemingly but the UK have a large chunk of that debt too.
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mad-butcher
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 01:18 PM |
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I do a fair bit of diving in Egypt and sadly for the £ it's not very welcome, but the Euro on the other hand is gladly accepted to the extent
that most dives trips and shops are priced in Egyptian pounds or Euros, same thing for Turkey and Tenerife
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bi22le
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 01:36 PM |
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My worry about putting any vote to the public as complex and important as this is that they just will not get enough info to make an informative
decision.
I, as any normal human, always vote what is best for me. Now a proud greek will do the same. With this in mind would you vote to be in debt to your
euro neighbours and becon to their demands or be patriotic and stand on your own two feet as a nation?
This decision should not be left to a nation of lazy patriotic humans who have lived in the red for the good times and now dont want to work
themselves out of it.
Oh and yes lazy, have you ever been to Greece!!!
Sorry to cause offence but Greece are not the only country that are in massive debt to countries they would rather not be in the pockets of, but they
are seemingly the only country that feel they are more important than europe as a trading state and the world econemy.
My advice to Greece - Dont burn the bridges that you may need in the future, man up, be proud and start working hard for a better future, the world is
a small place.
Track days ARE the best thing since sliced bread, until I get a supercharger that is!
Please read my ring story:
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/forum/13/viewthread.php?tid=139152&page=1
Me doing a sub 56sec lap around Brands Indy. I need a geo set up! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EHksfvIGB3I
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twybrow
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 01:52 PM |
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bi22le - I agree. If they tell the rst of Europe to beggar off, they are even more screwed than they are now. They need to swallow their pride, and
get on with it before they bring the rest of the world into even more financial turmoil.
I also think the referendum is purely there so that the Greem PM stands a chance of staying in power. As said above, the general population (even the
LCB population) will simply not have the knowledge or understanding to make the right decision, and yet this vote has the potential to cause a huge
amount of turmoil around the world.
Come on Greece - man up and say thank you to those who have repeatedly thrown you a lifeline....
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JoelP
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 02:01 PM |
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surely if they vote no, they are shafted? No money to pay pensions or pubic sector, ie no police or hospitals?
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l0rd
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 02:36 PM |
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Well Let me have a go about it.
I AM GREEK AND I AM PROUD OF IT!!!!!!! (But proud because of the history of Greece)
Now let me have my say about the fkn situation we are in and how we got here.
I would say that we are not lazy. We work hard. All the lazy ones are the ones who work as a Civic servant and in general the public sector.
Everything started by Andreas Papandreou (Yes George's Father) and his team who shafted Greece.
In order to win the elections, he used to promise money and more money and benefits for all those working in the public sector and also jobs if they
voted for him. (most of them do not even have qualifications to do their job)
eg. wages of 1000euros with benefits would be 2000 euros. (so imagine if someone was given 2000 euros as wages)
They found a warehouse employee who was earning 48000 euros. WTF!!!!!!!!!!!!!! A train driver, used to get 150000 euros.!!!!!!!!!!!!
Minister who inherited 58 houses from his auntie (OMG)
At some point, when the albanians emigrated illegaly to Greece, they used to give them fake passports so they could vote for him.
When new public sector projects were needed, in order to find the best company to do it, they used to find the company that would charge them more but
quite an amount of money would be given to the ministers under the table.
Tax evation is another thing. Start from doctors, lawyers and all they highly paid jobs.
These are only a few examples.
If i had to start writing about all of them, i would finish in my next life.
And the outcome, everybody is paying more taxes so they can have more money to eat/steal.
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onenastyviper
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 02:37 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by bi22le
My worry about putting any vote to the public as complex and important as this is that they just will not get enough info to make an informative
decision.
I, as any normal human, always vote what is best for me. Now a proud greek will do the same. With this in mind would you vote to be in debt to your
euro neighbours and becon to their demands or be patriotic and stand on your own two feet as a nation?
This decision should not be left to a nation of lazy patriotic humans who have lived in the red for the good times and now dont want to work
themselves out of it.
Oh and yes lazy, have you ever been to Greece!!!
Sorry to cause offence but Greece are not the only country that are in massive debt to countries they would rather not be in the pockets of, but they
are seemingly the only country that feel they are more important than europe as a trading state and the world econemy.
My advice to Greece - Dont burn the bridges that you may need in the future, man up, be proud and start working hard for a better future, the world is
a small place.
How to bankrupt a country:
1. Make a mistake.
2. Blackmail a government to give you money knowing that it would destabilise them.
3. Keep money.
4. As countries fall, rush in and buy all assets.
5. Banks now control housing, employment and national assets.
The ultimate form of capitalism is monopolisation.
Remember the good old local shop?
Along came the supermarket who could sell items cheaper.
The local shop tried to compete but gave in, sold out and retired to somewhere in Southern Europe - the shop was turned into a trendy coffee shop.
The supermarket, now without any competition started realising that customers want a "better experience" and long for the good old local
shop - easy, the supermarket now unviels a spinoff - the local shop.
What an invention?
Tell me, how much would a pint of milk cost if there was only one shop selling the stuff?
Banks are businesses, they just sell money.
Greeks being lazy, that is a resentful comment from a hypocritical nation .
Tell me, how many people in this "ahem" productive country have thought about retiring to Spain, Italy, Greece or Portugal?
At our level: we work, we live and we die.
An honest days work for an honest days wage has never existed - it has always been an illusion to keep the masses placated.
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designer
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 02:46 PM |
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Every country in Europe will eventually be brought down by the cost of Public Purse Pensions, it's inevitable.
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onenastyviper
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 03:00 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by designer
Every country in Europe will eventually be brought down by the cost of Public Purse Pensions, it's inevitable.
There used to be an unofficial belief that a public service job was poorly paid compared to private sector wages but that the pensions were better.
Now, you get a poor wage and a poor pension - congratulations to all the jealous bar-stewards, instead of bringing people up and having a fair,
guaranteed pension, everyone has been pulled down.
Welcome to the 21st century, things progressed slightly during the 20th Century but those who decide thought that the great unwashed have had it too
good for too long.
I expect the 21st Century to be pretty much like the 19th Century - just with everyone having a cloth cap and an iphone instead.
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l0rd
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 03:10 PM |
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Ohh by the way,
I am Greek and proud of it.
But, i lived and worked in UK for 13 years. I know both Nation's good and bad habits.
[Edited on 3/11/11 by l0rd]
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jeffw
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 03:53 PM |
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So it appears people on here don't understand either. Greece owes more money than it can ever hope to payback. The latest bailout package is
to enable it to pay the interest on the existing loans.....
Greece joined a club (the Euro) which it had no right being in, financially, but the entry requirements where....'overlooked'....to expand
the European experiment. It suffers from a economic policy that provides record low interest rates which suits Germany but not Greece. They really
have only one choice which is to leave the Euro and return to the Drachma when they will be able to deal with their finances with their policies
rather than Kowtowing to the ECB & Germany/France.
The Euro is a busted flush....the sooner it collapses the quicker we can get on with the recovery. The only way now for Germany & France to save
it is complete political & financial union which would mean that the German working in Wolfsburg building your next Volkswagen will pay the tax
(and have to work to 70) to ensure an Athens bus driver can avoid paying tax and retire at 55. Not going to happen.
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Ivan
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 04:22 PM |
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Watching the whole business from remote - they'll pay - no they won't - euro up euro down - then again - they'll pay - no they
won't - euro up euro down. This is all very predictable if you are the one creating the news (Guess who) and predictable value shifts (even
small ones) are the best way to make lots of money in a short time when trading in currency and/or buying and selling short or long.
Wish I could influence currency and stock values as easily. I would still have my Cobra and Locost - but they would soon be joined by some
"super cars" in my new 10 car garage.
And the ones playing the game don't care a damn about who suffers in the end - they've won 
[Edited on 3/11/11 by Ivan]
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onenastyviper
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 04:34 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Ivan
...And the ones playing the game don't care a damn about who suffers in the end - they've won
[Edited on 3/11/11 by Ivan]
Again.
Anyway, I look forward to the day I reach 55 and can retire.
By then I hope to have ruined and asset stripped several small countries.
Made thousands unemployed and homeless.
Caused famine and disease.
I really don't see the problem, it's only good business.
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bi22le
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 04:38 PM |
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I think just the variedness of these posts show just how complex they are. Pretty much every post has introduced a valid point to this topic. Very
complex and new ground for everyone involved, maybe except for the bankers. They know the deal. . .
l0rd I did think of you when putting up my post, Im sure you will understand the 'lazy' was not a personal attack.
Oh and I still have not received your email yet. Did you resend to both email accounts? I have been keeping an eye out and checked that the accounts
are still working. maybe its the government dictatorship \ corruption blocking the email getting through 
Biz.
Track days ARE the best thing since sliced bread, until I get a supercharger that is!
Please read my ring story:
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/forum/13/viewthread.php?tid=139152&page=1
Me doing a sub 56sec lap around Brands Indy. I need a geo set up! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EHksfvIGB3I
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Ninehigh
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 05:49 PM |
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What's a pension?
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jollygreengiant
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 06:28 PM |
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Now then, what was that famous lesson from history,........
Oh yes now I remember, .....
"Beware of Greeks bearing gifts".
Personally I have nothing against Greeks, I just hate politicians and the 'mega rich' who are only in it for themselves.
Beware of the Goldfish in the tulip mines. The ONLY defence against them is smoking peanut butter sandwiches.
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02GF74
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 07:03 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by jollygreengiant
Now then, what was that famous lesson from history,........
Oh yes now I remember, .....
"Beware of Greeks bearing gifts".
Personally I have nothing against Greeks, I just hate politicians and the 'mega rich' who are only in it for themselves.
Trojans actually
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designer
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 07:32 PM |
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quote:
What's a pension?
It's what the public sector gets (and they are huge), while the rest get a pittance.
Many in the North work 40hrs for the equivalent of the 'average' public purse pension!!!
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NeilP
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 08:02 PM |
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Interesting little bit of history from a book I read a few years ago.
The term economics comes from the Ancient Greek 'oikonomia' (management of a household, administration) from 'oikos' (house) +
'nomos' (custom or law), hence "rules of the house(hold)".
IIRC - Early historical records of the turbulent politics of ancient Greece note that this was brought forwards as the only way for the Greek nation
to survive after years of fighting with the Macedonians and some truly disasterous policies on the importation of wheat that left them starving.
Only several thousand years ago - takes a while for learning to seep in...
p.s. Without the Greeks we'd still be living in mud huts...
[Edited on 3/11/2011 by NeilP]
If you pay peanuts...
Mentale, yar? Yar, mentale!
Drive it like you stole it!
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jeffw
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 09:36 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by 02GF74
quote:
Originally posted by jollygreengiant
Now then, what was that famous lesson from history,........
Oh yes now I remember, .....
"Beware of Greeks bearing gifts".
Personally I have nothing against Greeks, I just hate politicians and the 'mega rich' who are only in it for themselves.
Trojans actually
Definitely the Greeks in the Wooden Horse which the Trojans pulled into Troy.
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l0rd
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| posted on 3/11/11 at 09:50 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by bi22le
I think just the variedness of these posts show just how complex they are. Pretty much every post has introduced a valid point to this topic. Very
complex and new ground for everyone involved, maybe except for the bankers. They know the deal. . .
l0rd I did think of you when putting up my post, Im sure you will understand the 'lazy' was not a personal attack.
Oh and I still have not received your email yet. Did you resend to both email accounts? I have been keeping an eye out and checked that the accounts
are still working. maybe its the government dictatorship corruption blocking the email getting through
Biz.
I have send the email on the second address as well ages ago.
Yesterday i even posted it here. You can have a look on the electrics topics
I know it wasn't a personal attack. As i said. I have lived both nations and know what is tru and what not.
Yes, Greeks working for the fkn public sector should be shot at site.
I also assumed that you have seen lazy greeks when you are on holidays probably in an island. Yes, they do tend to be lazy as well as they only work
for 6 months a year and then they are sitting doing nothing and get used to it.
Me, being grown in a farmer's family, i never had time even to go on holidays.
Working from 5am till 11pm every day during the summer.
As i said, if it wasn't for Georges Papandreou father, Greece would be a better place to live.
Greece reached this point due to the politicians since 1981.
Similar thing happened to UK as well with your ministers. But they paid for it.
In Greece, the ministers have voted a law that basically can get away with anything. So, they do steal money etc.....
[Edited on 3/11/11 by l0rd]
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