locoboy
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| posted on 16/5/07 at 09:36 AM |
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flush fit Downlighter spotlights
I am converting a room in my house and i have put a new roof on it and i need to use ceilign mounted spots - flush fit die to the lack of head room. (
i dont want wall lights).
I have a 4 inch gap above the ceiling plasterboard in which to set my spot lights.
I am planning on using fibreglass insulation inbetween the roof members and above the plasterboard (in where the lights will be)
Is this advisable from a fire risk viewpoint?
Do these spots get HOT?
Cheers
ATB
Locoboy
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ned
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| posted on 16/5/07 at 09:40 AM |
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They definately get hot and I'm sure the instructions in the packet will have a diagram showing fitment location and distance to surrounding
surfaces. Sorry if this is a bit vague.
Ned.
beware, I've got yellow skin
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iank
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| posted on 16/5/07 at 09:52 AM |
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Might be better to use LED rather than halogen.
They aren't as bright and cost a fair bit more (5x), but use less power, run cool and last longer (10x).
You can get them in GU10 mains powered packages so they are plug and play.
--
Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level, then beat you with experience.
Anonymous
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owelly
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| posted on 16/5/07 at 10:01 AM |
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Screwfix sell the insulating hoods to stop the heat off the halogens and they also sell cheap halogen kits for a bout £10 for a kit of three lamps
IIRC.
I have a ceiling full of them with insulation directly on top of them and I've had no fires. Yet..........
http://www.ppcmag.co.uk
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DaveFJ
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| posted on 16/5/07 at 11:02 AM |
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Speaking from bitter experience - they get Bl**dy hot!. I ended up paying an absolute fortune for low voltage type ones because i needed them IP rated
to go over a bath and shower  cost me £200 for 8 then - of course - had to pay an electrician to fit them because of the new laws
Saying that - it's hot enough to burn skin but I doubt it's hot enough to start a fire - unless something very flamable was up against
them.....
Dave
"In Support of Help the Heroes" - Always
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smart51
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| posted on 16/5/07 at 11:20 AM |
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I've just bought an LED spotlight bulb. Sadly 240V rather than 12V (doh!) At 2W power consumption, it won't get too hot and it is bright
(we've just tried it out on the lab). You'd probably be OK with these.
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britishtrident
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| posted on 16/5/07 at 01:12 PM |
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Big problem with 12v ones is the transformers --- I have 3 sets in my house and the transformers have given me a lot of trouble, I am not replacing
anymore and as each in turn fail I have started converting to 240v ones from Wickes.
The 240v volt luminairs can also be converted to LED much easier. At the moment LED lamps are expensive but the price is comming down and the light
output is increasing.
With the 12v types be aware that replacement bulbs have to be exactly the same wattage as originally fitted or the transformer shuts down. On a
couple of occasions I have bought bulbs which had the wrong wattage marked on both the bulb and the pack.
[Edited on 16/5/07 by britishtrident]
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britishtrident
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| posted on 16/5/07 at 01:18 PM |
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I picked this tip up from another4 forum a few years back
The cheap way of covering the hot bits of the luminair that stick into in the loft is to use upturned old fashioned clay flower pots, they even have a
hole for wires to go through.
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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DaveFJ
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| posted on 16/5/07 at 02:21 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by britishtrident
I picked this tip up from another4 forum a few years back
The cheap way of covering the hot bits of the luminair that stick into in the loft is to use upturned old fashioned clay flower pots, they even have a
hole for wires to go through.
good tip!
Dave
"In Support of Help the Heroes" - Always
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caber
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| posted on 16/5/07 at 03:35 PM |
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AARGH! there are some very cheap LV downlights and they are risky if installed badly. Many are CE marked but do not comply with temperature
requirements for installation. There should be at least 90mm behind the lamp of free air. The smallest fittings should not be used directly in timber
they will be OK in plasterboard, this goes for mains voltage small spots.
Transformers are also a problem. Cheap i.e. less than £12 are rubbish and will fail quickly or not regulate output voltage and fry the lamps. They
also need to by located where they will not overheat, well away from the back of the lamps and not covered with insulation.
The lamp holders in these fittings run at between 100C° and 300C° and will burn out quickly if not quality items, this can cause arcing that is a very
major fire hazard in a roof space or floor void.
Basically spend £30+ for the downlight and £15+ for a transformer and you will be OK if installed properly!
Caber
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MkIndy7
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| posted on 16/5/07 at 04:36 PM |
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As above definately buy quality transformer lamps.
We bought ours about 5+ years ago now for the bathroom and have changed 2 maybe 3 bulbs tops.
The transformers for those were about twice as heavy as the last ones I installed for somebody else.. hopefully a sign of their quality!
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locoboy
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| posted on 16/5/07 at 06:01 PM |
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I have decided to go 240V with LED and keep the insulation away as a precaution anyway.
I have noticed that the LED ones are rated in watts and 1.2, 1.4, 1.5 seem common figures.
Watts meaning consumption, but is that directly comparable to a 60W standard lightbulb?
Is the 60W bulb really 40 odd times brighter than the 1.4W LED affair?
ATB
Locoboy
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smart51
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| posted on 17/5/07 at 12:44 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by locoboy
Is the 60W bulb really 40 odd times brighter than the 1.4W LED affair?
No. Incandescent bulbs are about 5% efficient so a 60W bulb makes about 3W of light.
LED efficiency is improving all the time. IT really depends on the technology in the bulbe how bight it is per Watt.
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britishtrident
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| posted on 17/5/07 at 02:57 PM |
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Efficiency of various types of bulbs is often misleading
Often forgotten but the heat from filament bulbs is usually useful heat. Same goes for fridges, the rejected "waste" heat helps warm the
kitchen.
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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britishtrident
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| posted on 17/5/07 at 02:59 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by smart51
quote:
Originally posted by locoboy
Is the 60W bulb really 40 odd times brighter than the 1.4W LED affair?
No. Incandescent bulbs are about 5% efficient so a 60W bulb makes about 3W of light.
LED efficiency is improving all the time. IT really depends on the technology in the bulbe how bight it is per Watt.
One problem with LED bulbs is the light output dropd by 50% after 6 months use --- something to keep in mind.
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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smart51
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| posted on 17/5/07 at 05:48 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by britishtrident
Efficiency of various types of bulbs is often misleading
Often forgotten but the heat from filament bulbs is usually useful heat. Same goes for fridges, the rejected "waste" heat helps warm the
kitchen.
Which is fine in the winter. A real pain in the summer though.
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smart51
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| posted on 17/5/07 at 05:49 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by britishtrident
One problem with LED bulbs is the light output dropd by 50% after 6 months use --- something to keep in mind.
really? I Haven't heard that before. LEDs are quoted by their manufacturer has making X amount of light @ Y mA over a Z° viewing angle. Is
that when new or after they've burned in?
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