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No Insurance Punishment
liam.mccaffrey - 22/11/12 at 08:20 PM

Whats the normal penalty for driving without insurance, my friend has just had the letter

JoelP - 22/11/12 at 08:26 PM

8 points i believe, and a fine.

Why a letter? Cant think how you would be caught that would lead to a letter - they would usually not let you drive off if you werent on the database and it was outside office hours to call and check.

omega0684 - 22/11/12 at 08:32 PM

6 points, £200 fine

edited: if the car is impounded and the police don't crush it, i would imagine he will need to provide proof of insurance before they would release it, + impound fees too

[Edited on 22/11/12 by omega0684]

liam.mccaffrey - 22/11/12 at 08:35 PM

no he had his car impounded, it was recovered and told to wait for the letter

r1_pete - 22/11/12 at 08:35 PM

I guess it depends on his financial status, he'll be hardest hit if he's a working home owner just making ends meet.

JoelP - 22/11/12 at 08:38 PM

means tested up to 5 grand apparently.

Did he say how it happened by any chance? Unlucky or intentional?

liam.mccaffrey - 22/11/12 at 08:43 PM

it was very unlucky, his mum and dad were looking after the insurance on the car he was using. They were expecting a renewal notice, hadn't recieved one and he got caught after the policy ran out. No defence I know but it was a big balls up and bad luck.

owelly - 22/11/12 at 08:51 PM

Strangely enough, I know a bloke who has been caught in similar circumstances but he assumed that as he wasn't sure when the policy ran out, he'd be OK if he didn't use the car.... DVLA now talk to MID and send the boys round. He hadn't sent the VED back and declared SORN so got six points and £400 fine.

JoelP - 22/11/12 at 08:52 PM

Bad times. Sadly a court wont see that as a defense - but at least if his parents are covering the insurance, the price hike is up to them to cover!

JoelP - 22/11/12 at 08:54 PM

quote:
Originally posted by owelly
Strangely enough, I know a bloke who has been caught in similar circumstances but he assumed that as he wasn't sure when the policy ran out, he'd be OK if he didn't use the car.... DVLA now talk to MID and send the boys round. He hadn't sent the VED back and declared SORN so got six points and £400 fine.


The car must have been on the road for that - if it was off road then the offense is only to not declare sorn, whereas anyone knows that if its on the road it needs to be insured.

owelly - 22/11/12 at 09:20 PM

The vehicle was parked around the back of the blokes house so it was in a public place so should have had insurance. The plod had to come looking for it though!!

SeaBass - 23/11/12 at 07:55 AM

quote:
Originally posted by owelly
The vehicle was parked around the back of the blokes house so it was in a public place so should have had insurance. The plod had to come looking for it though!!


Parked round the back of his house on his private ground? Or parked on a shared area in a development?

owelly - 23/11/12 at 09:46 AM

As defined by the 'Road Traffic Act', it was parked in a public place. It was parked on land owned by the property holders but had free public access.

minitici - 23/11/12 at 11:31 AM

Assuming he has not been charged with driving a car without insurance then:
Rules in England, Wales and Scotland

"The rules for insuring vehicles are called ‘continuous insurance enforcement’. They mean that if you’re the registered keeper of a vehicle it must be insured or declared as off the road (SORN).

If not, you could:

get a fixed penalty of £100
have your vehicle wheel-clamped, impounded or destroyed
face a court prosecution, with a possible maximum fine of £1,000

It doesn’t matter who is driving the car - if you’re the registered keeper, you could get penalised.

You will also still have to pay for your insurance on top of any fines received."

If he was driving when caught then the minimum would be a fixed penalty of 6 points and £200.

omega 24 v6 - 23/11/12 at 03:55 PM

quote:

It was parked on land owned by the property holders but had free public access


Mmm thats a grey area isn't it??
My drive often has a sorned car on it and is open to public access. Are you saying the area was a comunal area?? or private. Even so it would not be defined as a public highway surely.?? Any removal of the vehical would be theft in that case. IMHO

britishtrident - 23/11/12 at 05:14 PM

Shared parking at council houses or flats is a no brainer.

The grey area is shared privately parking areas at private flats, the fact we have heard of no test cases or sob stories on the net must imply the private clamping companies who are licensed to remove untaxed vehicles realise they are in a very grey area.

I would suggest anybody in flats with shared parking or even a housing estate with an open plan front gardens put a small but visible sign saying "Private Area no Public Access", I don't know if it would hold up in court but I am pretty sure the private companies wouldn't take the chance.

SeaBass - 23/11/12 at 07:20 PM

quote:
Originally posted by owelly
As defined by the 'Road Traffic Act', it was parked in a public place. It was parked on land owned by the property holders but had free public access.


That seems a pretty odd response. Would a house driveway with no gate a public place?

Edit: Just found out they have no powers where it's:

within the curtilage of, or in the vicinity of, a dwelling-house, mobile home or houseboat and which is normally enjoyed with it, or
which is within the curtilage of, or in the vicinity of, a building consisting entirely (apart from common parts) of two or more dwellings and which is normally enjoyed only by the occupiers of one or more of those dwellings.

[Edited on 23/11/12 by SeaBass]

owelly - 23/11/12 at 07:29 PM

The whole 'public place' thing was brought about to counter the folks who would try to outrun the plod whilst under the influence, thinking that if they got home, they were safe. Or that's what I was told by a traffic cop. He also went on to explain that a farmer can drive around his fields as drunk as a lord as long as the gate is shut. If he opens the gate, the field becomes a public place and as such he can get proscecuted for DD.
There have been many cases where folks have used the grey areas as a defence and as far as the definitions go, it's up to the judge to decide. If the judge says black is white, it pretty much is.